Cyberpunk 2077

Discussion in 'General Gaming and Hardware Forum' started by Xellos, Jan 12, 2013.

  1. 0wing

    0wing Все умрут, а я волномут

    Mar 23, 2015
    Hey, it's that faggot YongYea again. Don't forget to subscribe and support his patreon, guys.

    What's the real situation here? A typical post-soviet game development. C'mon lads, the very same shit hit the fan when STALKER was in development. A quick recap - endless crunch cycles, management gets more and more arrogant, setting even less realistic deadlines, crunches never changes; Experienced folks leave and founding their own studios or finding happy place elsewhere (like ukranians did founding 4A Games when STALKER was still in development, engine programmer left, BTW), juniors slowly getting the gist of situation and leaving. And suddenly, "wow, where is everyone?! Quick, hire westerners!" Oh yeah, this plan doesn't work so swell too. Management pulls the INTERESTING TEAM INTERESTING PROJECTS, BUILD YOUR CAREER FAST IN GROWING STUDIO, A JOB IN FAMOUS COMPANY, RECREATION ZONE WITH PS4 AND COOKIES GUARANTEED. In reality, they squeeze you out like a lemon and fire when you hit professional burnout and apathy. Westeners see their pay is less than western gamedev company, not to mention enterprise or goverment industries, and leave famous glassdoor reviews YongYea feeds on and leave CDPR behind.
    Don't be suprised when not all promises from 2012-2013 will be delivered. Be suprised Cyberpunk 2077 ever delivered.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2017 at 5:54 PM
  2. Alphons

    Alphons Prophet der Auges

    Aug 9, 2017
    It always warms my heart, when I think about all these homeless people on Youtube that produce clips in exchange for lunch money and rent cash.
     
  3. eissa

    eissa Gall óGlaigh Lady of War

    Jan 7, 2016
    What the hell, whats wrong with that guy anyway?
     
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  4. 0wing

    0wing Все умрут, а я волномут

    Mar 23, 2015
    I don't like "independent" e-journos begging on patreon, sorry. Their info is always skewed.
     
  5. CT Phipps

    CT Phipps Half-way Through My Half-life

    Sep 17, 2016
    Mind you, I'm okay with "Witcher with Guns" but I'm always the swimmer upstream in this forum.
     
  6. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    Quite often the stream is a canalisation though.
     
  7. 0wing

    0wing Все умрут, а я волномут

    Mar 23, 2015
    I am too in case when that's what was promised. But they promised real RPG based on PnP, so Witcher with guns now is a sorry excuse. Bet my lunch Baldur's Gate wouldn't be so succesful if Bioware delivered another crappy isometric shooter/hack'n'slash/rts instead of D&D-based actual RPG with innovative-if-we-forget-Darklands-combat.
    Case in point.
    "I can appreciate good investigative "journalism" in any industry and you almost kinda got there, but man - it was a 100% DICK MOVE to include details about Adam Badowski's private matters, the tragic loss of his girlfriend...hey, you even included her name and photo in the material. Welcome to the typical tabloid level of "journalism". No class, it's just clicks that matter. Disgusting." - comment section.
    Bonus point - he calls The Net, cyberspace in CP2020 a Matrix - cyberspace in Shadowrun. Journalism and facts check, never gets old.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2017 at 11:18 PM
  8. CT Phipps

    CT Phipps Half-way Through My Half-life

    Sep 17, 2016
    CD_Projekt Red is one of those companies which has done almost the opposite of what every other company in video games have been doing for the past few years. Whereas everyone else seems to be leaving behind lore and story for gameplay, they doubled-down on it. While everyone else was doing microtransactions and nickel/diming folk--they released all of their DLC free except two expansions which were not only the size of actual video games but also expertly made as well as story-heavy.

    BLOOD AND WINE, in fact, I'd argue is probably one of the best RPGs of the past decade even if just played by itself (which you can do).

    So CDPR has gotten a huge amount of slack from me on this. Honestly, I also believe the dreams they've been promising on this game were a bit ridiculous to begin with. The Witcher 3 is a MASSIVE game and I mean that not entirely in a good sense because the travel times are ludicrous even with fast travel. It's also a place with a lot of open ground with nothing in it just to give a sense of scale.
    I think dialing it back a bit (a lot) and making it so a voiced protagonist (or two like Fallout 4) is probably the best option to take in this. What made the Witcher 3 so great was the heavy focus on characterization and storytelling. I hope we don't get a "blank slate" protagonist who is someone we can press ourselves on because what made Geralt awesome was the fact he had opinions, history, and relationships.

    This comes with its downside of not being able to be as free with your character but it means a better story, IMHO.

    I am also kind of REALLY desperate for this game because of the announced retirement of the Deus Ex series following Mankind Divided's disappointing sales (in the middle of a cliffhanger no less). As a huge cyberpunk, I'm kind of horrified at the loss of one of my favorite franchises when it looked like it was just about take off and Cyberpunk is really my only hope now.
     
  9. SuAside

    SuAside Testament to the ghoul lifespan
    Admin

    May 27, 2004
    I don't necessarily mind a railroaded game, as long as the story is good.
    Stuff like SpecOps: The Line could never have worked if it were a sandbox game. A lot of games nowadays give the illusion of choice and consequence, but barely offer any of it.

    I'd be truly worried if CD Projekt Red suddenly started making a D&D game. ;)
     
  10. Jogre

    Jogre It's all JO'Ger now

    Oct 25, 2015
    Depends what you mean by RPG.

    If you mean a Mass-Effect-Esque RPG where the character already has established personality traits and you are simply making decisions/interpreting the character in your own way, then yes.

    If we judge it in terms of classic RPGs where you feel like you are in full control of your own character, then no.
     
  11. 0wing

    0wing Все умрут, а я волномут

    Mar 23, 2015
    Well, they basically did, but it bears Cyberpunk PnP name, it's still a game based on a pen'n'paper RPG. Your point?
     
  12. CT Phipps

    CT Phipps Half-way Through My Half-life

    Sep 17, 2016
    Also, D&D has so influenced the fantasy RPG network I'm not sure what you'd call a game about a fantasy protagonist who uses spells, gets better equipment, levels up, has hit points, and fights monsters.
     
  13. 0wing

    0wing Все умрут, а я волномут

    Mar 23, 2015
    And yours?
     
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  14. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    Your point?
     
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  15. 0wing

    0wing Все умрут, а я волномут

    Mar 23, 2015
    Don't be worried about D&D ever.
    Be fucking worried because the ones who happened to work on another iconic PnP video game adaptaion is CDPR, well known for underdeveloping gameplay, and this is supposed to be an official game.
     
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  16. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    But what's wrong with a more traditional approach on the RPG-Gameplay, since the number of games where you actually create your own character, with gender, skills etc. is rather low - if we talk about REAL RPGs, I refuse to call Fallout 4 or Skyrim an RPG.

    So if CDRed says they basically want to make Cyberpunk-Witcher, than it really feels a bit ... disapointing, doesn't mean the game can't be good, just that it's the same old same over and over again. The reason why I hate Bioware these days for example, all their games feel soooooo similar in tonality and gameplay, I can find stuff in ME and Dragonage that could have been also in Star Wars:Knights of the old Republic. They really havn't changed their formula much since those days ...

    if you think that the story has to take a bit of a back-seat in the traditional PnP RGPs, well, that is because the story is not necessirly focused around a cinematic narrative like in the Witcher or similar games. Also PnP RPGs don't have to be necessarily about choices and consequences - albeit it is arguably very nice to have it! They are much more about character creation, skill choice etc. Look at Ice Wind Dale 1 and 2 for example where the characters pretty much serve as a white canvas to the player and are simply thrown in some adventure. That's not a weakness of the game or the story telling, this is how often PnP RGPs actually played.
     
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  17. SuAside

    SuAside Testament to the ghoul lifespan
    Admin

    May 27, 2004
    Temple Of Elemental Evil didn't exactly turn out that great, although it implemented D&D perfectly.
    My point was that focusing blindly on a system rarely results in good games, even when carried out by an extremely talented studio.
     
  18. CT Phipps

    CT Phipps Half-way Through My Half-life

    Sep 17, 2016
    It actually got me into a nasty long debate on the CD_Projekt Red forums between the people who thought you needed a preset character to do the kind of deep storytelling which the Witcher 3 had as well as intimate romances/friendships versus the people who not only didn't want a preset character but they actually didn't want him to be voiced. There's a lot of people who argue that voicing a character--even with thousands of lines like Fallout 4 just means you can't project yourself fully or do a good character type.

    Mike Pondsmith has said classes were still in the game so it may be wrong but I will point out I think Cyberpunk Witcher is better simply because it's more likely to come out soon as a lot of games try for too much and end up getting nothing. Inquisition and Andromeda, ironically, were spoiled by the fact they wanted massive games that ultimately had nothing in them because they were going for too much while missing the character and story in the center.

    The irony of this is it's why I love SKyrim's story. :) However, "Making my own story" is something I do in other games while I trust CDPR's version.
     
  19. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    It comes down to preference, and sadly people often mistake preference for fact. Two games can be equally good in quality, yet someone who's in favour of shooters might call strategy games garbage and someone who's into racing games might call shooters garbage, all based on what kind of mechanic they prefer. To often you see people making reviews about games, testing some RPG for example ... but ... they themselfs only like shooters ... and naturally the game gets a low or bad score "CUZ NOT ENOUGH ACTIUN, YO!", and so the Mass Effect/Skyrim/Fallour4 type of games became the norm ...

    I mean how big is the chance that a company like Bioware (under EA ...) or Bethesda would develope a game like Wasteland 2 or anthing similar? Not much I would say.
     
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  20. 0wing

    0wing Все умрут, а я волномут

    Mar 23, 2015
    Well, Troika only had passionate D&D fans on their side, 19 months and another project on their back while CD Projekt RED also has when-it's-done deadline(Duke Nukem Forever, ho), access all the talent and resources in the world enough to put actual RPG system into a cyberwitcher and put it leagues above ToEE in terms of well, everything.
    And ToEE-level of perfection is not needed, really. Baldur's Gate is enough.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017 at 7:35 PM
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