Fallout the boardgame and New California controversy

Discussion in 'NMA News and Information' started by Proletären, Jul 24, 2018.

  1. Proletären

    Proletären Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    Mar 15, 2012
    Last year Fantasty Flight Games published a Fallout boardgame based on the Bethesda games. Newly announced an expansion called New California is on it's way. The expansion is set on the west coast and will include locations familiar to fans of the real Fallout games.

    The potential controvercy is that there already is a famous total conversion New Vegas mod of the same name. The TC Falllout: New California has been under development for over seven years now and will release this fall. The developers express their concern in a Facebook post. The board game expansion having the same name as their mod could make it possible for Bethesda to send them a cease and desist order, something that is not uncommon. PC Gamer had an article about it. However, since the publication of the article in PC Gamer a representative of Bethesda has given the following statement:

     
  2. Risewild

    Risewild Half-way Through My Half-life
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    It annoys me that they are using shitty Fallout 4 style for figurines and other stuff in this expansion, instead of classic Fallout style... Look at their figurines and you will see what I mean.

    Come on... Super Mutant Behemoth enemy card?
    Bethesda lore says that Behemoths are only made using the Capital Wasteland strand of FEV, so what the hell are they doing in California?
    You're SPECIAL book?

    Someone make it stop!
     
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  3. MPPlantOfficial

    MPPlantOfficial Still Mildly Glowing

    Aug 24, 2017
    Beth using Beth stuff for Beth products. I don't see the issue in this situation. It's better they don't touch east coast lore at all but that's a whole other discussion.

    This is one thing I'm going to support Beth and Capcom at. They're very open to people using their assets and IPs to create mods and fangames with.
    If this were Nintendo or Squaresoft they'd wait 'til the last minute when the mods have been promoted to the shit then send their Cease & Desist rendering all work useless.
     
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  4. Risewild

    Risewild Half-way Through My Half-life
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    I assume you mean "It's better they don't touch west coast lore" instead of east... But then they make a west coast board game expansion that has The Rise of the Master and other classic games stuff in it? Then they should be faithful to the material and at least make the figurines and all of that look like west coast and not Commonwealth junk.

    And by having behemoths in this expansion they are already messing with west coast lore. This will make new players think that the Master could make Behemoths...
     
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  5. MPPlantOfficial

    MPPlantOfficial Still Mildly Glowing

    Aug 24, 2017
    Oh right. Sorry 'bout that.
     
  6. Risewild

    Risewild Half-way Through My Half-life
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    No problem, I was glad I assumed it correctly. :smile:
     
  7. Proletären

    Proletären Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    Mar 15, 2012
    Agree. Stay away from the west coast if you can't do it justice!
     
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  8. Risewild

    Risewild Half-way Through My Half-life
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    Another stupid thing is that it depicts the Enclave using this junk:


    Instead of this badassery:


    They could even have used the New Vegas Version and it would still have been better:

     
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  9. TheManFromRedding

    TheManFromRedding First time out of the vault

    Oct 15, 2015
    The problem I believe is that a stipulation of the development of the Offical Fallout Board Game by Fantasy Flight Games is that it used assets exclusively from Fallout 3 and 4 for the imagery in the set. I wouldn't say that's an absolute deal-breaker because the game's mechanics itself still get far more right in the most important thing; and that's giving you player choice and roleplay ability. Almost every quest has multiple outcomes, and the game itself allows you multiple win-states either by siding with seperate factions or no. Ironically more of an RPG than the Bethesda games themselves. I think it is annoying that they are restricted entirely to using Bethesda's assets but FFG at least understands the setting significantly more than Bethesda does, to some extent. I wouldn't shift so much blame onto FFG because they're being saddled with an opaque set of development rules by Bethesda that nobody knows the specifics of.

    I find the Plasma Rifle's model irrelevant. It would've been cooler if it was the Plasma Caster but that's been since long retconned by 3 and New Vegas. NV incorporating it more properly into "Classic Canon". Not all of the asset cards have been revealed and there's at least some chance some classic weapons might still appear. As well, the expansion is introducing new mechanics with even more complex choices and starter cards that can lead to different outcomes every time, so I think it gets right what Tim Cain was going for at least.

    "My idea is to explore more of the world and more of the ethics of a post-nuclear world, not to make a better plasma gun." Or in this case, "Make a more faithful representation of a plasma gun."

    The Behemoth I can see the issue with, but it's not one that can't be explained. You could easily see it as an aberration experiment that was accidentally created by the Master early on, if it's to be believed the different FEV strains at least share some similarities. Might be the same situation as how he refined Deathclaws but they ran wild and were never actually employed in his use. It's a rare Elite creature so the chances of seeing it appear on the board out of the already existing Elites is quite low. And at that, since it's part of the expansion, you can just toss the tile away and use the base game Elites. I'm certain it's only included in this expansion because it was absent from the base game, not because it necessarily needs to be used in the expansion's Classic scenarios.


    On a side note, Tycho is also in the preview, shown wearing Desert Ranger Armor. Curious, as it's not in Fallout 4, yet appears rendered in it's engine. Using the fan-made Desert Ranger Armor mod perhaps? I thought so too, but something seems off. I noticed it's the neck-collar. It's made very high. So I assume this might not be a render but artwork? Or an asset made in the game engine originally? You can notice it looks much different than the mod.





    So you can say it's likely New California may not be using imagery from FO1-2 for the cards, but either modified imagery or original artwork in the style of FO4 inspired by them. You can also vaguely see an interpretation of NCR Shady Sands in the location tiles, and it's been shown Arroyo, the Cathedral, and other locations like The Hub will also have original artwork for the location tiles. I think that's pretty cool.

    Besides the Behemoth I see nothing else immediately lore-breaking or ignorant about New California, and I am glad to see the original canon finally getting the attention it deserves, as well with the mod coming soon. I would prefer a Fallout game with actual RPG elements or a proper PnP release set but this is alright too, I suppose.
     
  10. Risewild

    Risewild Half-way Through My Half-life
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    The thing is that Bethesda owns Fallout 1, 2 and even tactics, so there is no reason for the board game to only use Bethesda assets and not use the classic Fallout games ones, since they are owned by Bethesda too.

    You point out the Ranger armor, and that is another proof that they can use assets based from NV without a problem.

    There is really nothing in terms of legality preventing Bethesda from using the classic imagery/assets/style, because they are the owners of all of that. They fully own the Intellectual Property, which includes everything in every Fallout game ever made. They just don't seem to want to use them. :shrug:

    They could also use Fallout 3 style weapons for example. Many Fallout 3 and 4 players say they prefer the style of Fallout 3's weapons over Fallout 4. Bethesda seems intent on never return to the past games, including their own games.
    It's like it tries to make people forget old games exist and focus always on the newer releases.
     
  11. Pwener

    Pwener Tunnelers? They Don't Sound That Tough...

    Aug 15, 2017
    The reason for this ignorant focus on Fallout 4's style is the same reason ESO uses Skyrim aesthetics down to the health/stamina/magicka bars. Marketability. People nowadays more readily recognize Fallout through Fallout 4's (awful) artistic style just like people recognize TES with Skyrim's (also awfully cartoony) style.

    The (also awful) modern MODERN fans wouldn't recognize a style derived from F1/F2 even though said style is superior in every way. Now, I admit, I started with F3. But many of us played the originals eventually and now see them for the masterpieces they are. Not many people that started with F4 did that or will ever do it. Bethesda know this, and so they ignore the past in favor of catering to the newer folks. It's all about money in the end.

    Obsidian gave us the last of old Fallout we will ever have through New Vegas.

    Yeah. The West Coast's last song, one only a few people are ever going to hear. A little sad, but what can you do?
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2018
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  12. Risewild

    Risewild Half-way Through My Half-life
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    But the thing is... I don't think many of the people who prefer Fallout 4 "style" will be interested in board games.

    Also, making a West Coast expansion for the board game with events like "The rise of the Master" is obviously aimed at the classic Fallout fans. So they should have fully pulled the "nostalgia" trump-card and go with some "old style" designs.
     
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  13. TorontRayne

    TorontRayne This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Moderator Orderite

    Apr 1, 2005
    They should have, but they are all about money. They aren't fans of the series. They bought it for the theme. They will drain the IP of all value while paying lip service to the classics like they really care about the fans.
     
  14. Risewild

    Risewild Half-way Through My Half-life
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    Yes, but again, they would be making more money by appealing more to the classic fans. This expansion is trying to appeal to those, but then it fails miserably by doing it the "Fallout 4" way. :lmao:

    Like I said before, I doubt the majority of Fallout 4 fans will play board games. I wonder if this expansion was made because after the board game was released, it didn't sell as much as they thought, so they decided to make an expansion to appeal to the older fans. I wonder if Bethesda failed to realize that the typical Fallout 4 fan will not be into board games. That would have been a really giant fail from their part. :lol:
     
  15. TorontRayne

    TorontRayne This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Moderator Orderite

    Apr 1, 2005
    Personally I look at it as soulless marketing that they don't really expect to sell a ton of anyway but you see fill the stores. I see what you are saying, but they do not. They hear OLD FALLOUT FAN and they don't give a flying fuck. Interplay didn't either. NMA is a joke to them.
     
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  16. Lone Cat

    Lone Cat It Wandered In From the Wastes

    Apr 8, 2012
    So Betty decided to bitchslap Obsidian entirely! and I see why Bethesda chose not to permit The Old Gang to do any Fallout 'westcoast sidestory' anymore.