Playing as a black dude

Discussion in 'General Gaming and Hardware Forum' started by Von Drunky, Jun 27, 2007.

  1. Von Drunky

    Von Drunky Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Mar 10, 2007
    Whatever, after everything said i'm the asshole and i earned my strike. Do you even know what I means when i say "Don't Be a Menace to South Central While Drinking Your Juice in the Hood" you dont because if you did, we would be on the same page. I never actually called anyone a racist, I only called some people closed mind for not giving black culture or hip-hop a chance im sorry for asking scary questions. No matter who the protagonist of GTA is you better bet your sisters sweet panties that its not going to illustrate that characters ethnicity in a positive way being black, white or anything in between. CJ betrayed OG, Tommy fucked over Diaz (w/e I’m sure you can figure it out) and speed fucked everyone to get what he wanted. SO I really don’t see how you can call CJ inconsistent compared to the previous characters, I personally thought he was deeper because not only did he want to come out on top but he also wanted to bring the fam with him. But fine if you all think CJ sucked as a protagonist there really isn’t much that I could do, I tired maybe one of you will replay that game in a new vision and realize that there was actually more depth to the characters of SA then you original thought.

    Sub question when you hear black culture what is the first thing you thing about? I understand that this is an international website, I’ve been all over the world including the Middle East and Europe and black people there are a lot more different then those back home in New York.
     
  2. Wooz

    Wooz Vault Sweeper Admin Orderite

    May 18, 2003
    Here.

    Dude, real gangsters don't sing about how tough they are. It's about your driven hatred towards what you call

    that should be cured, apparently, by

    :seriouslyno:
     
  3. Sander

    Sander This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Jul 5, 2003
    Ehm, yeah, and that's why most people severely dislike it. There was no depth to previous GTA characters, and that was the entire point of it. The fact that we now have a whiny little bitch who can't let go of his family (seen as 'deeper' by you) is *not* a positive thing *for the GTA games*.
     
  4. Sorrow

    Sorrow So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Feb 9, 2006
    Except that we were talking about archetypes for computer games, not about culture - in this case, genocide, conquest and ruling is relevant to the topic because that's what a lot of games are about, especially that the discussion started with game about bad guys. I'm pretty sure that Martin Luther King would make a lot worser protagonist of a tactical, strategic or GTA style game than this guy from Lord of War for example.
     
  5. Per

    Per Vault Consort Staff Member Admin

    Apr 1, 2004
    Right, you just smugly implied as much about a dozen times and even when Montez asked you what you meant, you wouldn't give a straight answer but used the "if I hadn't been right you wouldn't have minded" routine, also known as being an asshole.

    We don't have a black subculture in Sweden. We've had in the last few decades a huge influx of people from the Middle East though, and if you walk in some neighbourhoods at night some gang is likely to take your cellphone and kick you in the ribs...

    WHAT

    THEY DO
     
  6. Stag

    Stag Guest


    I've seen "Don't Be a Menace", and I've seen the Wayans bros. spoof, whatever. I understand what you're saying, and I think that most people here do; but you're wrong. And you're being an asshole.
     
  7. Von Drunky

    Von Drunky Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Mar 10, 2007
    You don’t have to have a strong black community to answer this question. If you feel that you haven’t been exposed to black culture, you always have the option of not answering the question at all. What does getting kicked in the ribs have to do with anything?
     
  8. Per

    Per Vault Consort Staff Member Admin

    Apr 1, 2004
    Your "international website /.../ black people there are a lot more different" led me to think you were asking about how we relate to black culture where we live specifically. If you ask what I literally associate to when I hear "black culture", that would be gospel, jazz, Motown, R&B and reverends holding speeches.
     
  9. Tannhauser

    Tannhauser Venerable Relic of the Wastes
    Orderite

    Mar 18, 2004
    Part of people's problem with CJ and his neighborhood is how poorly it is presented in the game. The only emotional attachment the player is shown is to CJ's family and friends, who all leave town or betray him. All that is left in the neighborhood is an unremarkable safehouse and a few groups of NPCs wearing green.

    During the course of the game, the character builds business after business, becoming a multi-millionaire in the process. Then CJ's brother gets out of jail, and after a minute-long, uninspiring speech about how CJ has "forgotten the hood" the player is railroaded back to this unremarkable place. There is no emotional reason for the player to return, and the trite little speech isn't anything but annoying.

    Really it is a failure of storytelling, Rockstar wasn't able to build up motivation in the mind of the player, and merely forced him along. Their previous GTA games were more successful, since they didn't try to build deeper, emotional elements into the story.

    A far cry from the wide-spread racism you are alleging Von Drunky. You are not asking "scary questions," you are being a smug ass.
     
  10. Von Drunky

    Von Drunky Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Mar 10, 2007
    I literally asked “when you hear black culture what is the first thing you thing about?” being an international website, I would expect a slightly different response based on region. I generally don’t think of Hoodlums from the Middle East jacking my cell phone or kicking me in the ribs when I think about black culture or black people.
     
  11. Sander

    Sander This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Jul 5, 2003
    Black culture? Tower of Power, baby (I don't know, half of those people are white, it just feels black to me). Funk, R&B, groovy shit. Also, hip-hop.

    No one here hates CJ or dislikes the game because CJ is black, but because his behaviour does not fit with what we expect from a GTA game. We expect ruthless dickheads that have no depth to them. CJ is pretty much the opposite of that.
     
  12. Sorrow

    Sorrow So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Feb 9, 2006
    Which is a good reason to hate CJ :P . I want my criminal to be a monster, not a half-human.
     
  13. Tannhauser

    Tannhauser Venerable Relic of the Wastes
    Orderite

    Mar 18, 2004
    Fine, "black culture?" The Caribbean and all the culture associated with that area, Jamaica in particular is what first springs into mind. Africa comes in second. Basically, I don't associate "black culture" specifically with African-American culture.
     
  14. Von Drunky

    Von Drunky Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Mar 10, 2007
    I had some alone time for the past two days to play GTA SA and I found an analogy between SLC Punk and the characters of SA, two of my all time favorites. Anyway if you’re a fan of the movie but not of the GTA SA I found a new front on which this discussion could proceed. Also I think of Jonny Depp, Rum, resorts and cruise ships when I think of The Caribbean. I really don’t understand why you don’t associate Afro-American culture with black culture everyone else does (Israel, Paris, just places I’ve been recently outside the US) I’m not saying that it’s the only one but it does hold the majority in the influence category.
     
  15. Wooz

    Wooz Vault Sweeper Admin Orderite

    May 18, 2003
    Read carefully next time. One thing is Afro-American culture, another thing is Black culture.

    Which only shows how clueless you are about that area.

    I don't, care to enlighten the rest of us?
     
  16. Vault 69er

    Vault 69er Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    May 3, 2007
    That sir is an insult! I see it's time for my Elf to man the Tesla gun and kill some backwards magic types once again. Muahahaha!

    On topic: Anybody mentioned TES yet? Particularly Redguard, the only TES with a set character that makes you play as a black man.
     
  17. Makagulfazel

    Makagulfazel Adept Bungler of Things Orderite

    Jun 14, 2007
    If people don't want to like a game, because of one reason or another, it's their choice. If you are so shocked by the reaction of some reviewers/posters about GTA:SA, don't listen to them anymore. Simply stating their opinion does not make them a racist.

    Keep in mind, racism is evident on all fronts. Although I'm a white American(and therefore biased), racism among other cultures is a lot more severe. Think about the fanatics like suicide bombers, Rev. Jackson and Neo-nazis. Blacks in America get BET, affirmative action, hate crime lawsuits, Black History Month, and reparations. Imagine if whites got WET or White History Month. That shit just wouldn't fly. Whites would then be labeled as racists(As if we already aren't..).

    I'm not saying whites haven't done their fair share of racist acts; however, blacks are given more than a fair chance to make something of themselves in America. There will always be the whites, blacks, and browns that are shit heads. No matter what race you are, you know you have douche bags in your race you'd rather see shut up and sit down. I'm simply saying, we're all affected racism, so don't go pulling the race card on me.
     
  18. Von Drunky

    Von Drunky Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Mar 10, 2007

    Right, Afro-Americans culture is large sub category within black culture.

    I know what you meant I was making a joke.

    Okay someone said something about the black characters in that game being under developed and hypocritical. Like Big Smoke and Ryder taking about street loyalty and then fucking Grove st over. Now for my next point to make sense I would have to know if you’re a fan of SLC Punk movie: You know how the first hour or so is spent glamorizing punk rock and anarchy, and then Heroin Bob dies and Steveo cuts his hair and goes to Harvard to be a corporate lawyer, moral of the story is how pointless it is to be a punk. Same thing goes for SA its like the first city is used to glamorizing the whole Gangsta thing but at the end you get screwed and realize that there is no such thing as Street loyalty. Same shit different pile.
     
  19. Sorrow

    Sorrow So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Feb 9, 2006
    I want a real GTA III! With a topdown view and mouse aiming! *Shakes his fist*
     
  20. Stag

    Stag Guest

    GTA 3 on PC is top-down...