Should a solo main character have an excuse to start in a vault jumpsuit?

Discussion in 'Future Fallout Game Discussion' started by Brycen, Dec 18, 2017.

Should a solo main character have an excuse to start in a vault jumpsuit?

  1. Yes, it's become iconic for most of the Fallout series.

    5 vote(s)
    23.8%
  2. No, it's not essential and should not become a gimmick.

    16 vote(s)
    76.2%
  1. Brycen

    Brycen First time out of the vault

    May 30, 2017
    If there are any future titles in the Fallout series, should a solo main character have an excuse to start in a vault jumpsuit, even if he or she is not from a vault?

    I realize that the solo main character did not start in a vault jumpsuit in FOBOS but he or she had an excuse of already being a part of the Brotherhood of Steel.

    This poll is in reference to the Courier being given a vault jumpsuit in Fallout: New Vegas, even though he or she did not start the main story in a vault, which felt kind of gimmicky.
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2017
  2. VaultHead

    VaultHead First time out of the vault

    Dec 21, 2017
    I admit that the New Vegas way of receiving the vault suit may seem gimmicky and to be honest, because the Vault Suit is a staple of the series almost every single way of retrieving it would seem gimmicky besides actually coming from a vault. Personally I think one of the least gimmicky options would be to start the game with a vault suit would be "You bought it". It's just in your inventory at the start and your character just purchased it off a caravan at some point prior to the beginning of the game
     
  3. Brycen

    Brycen First time out of the vault

    May 30, 2017
    Come to think of it, Fallout 2's way of obtaining the vault jumpsuit felt pretty gimmicky too. It turns out that the developers wanted the main character to be the Vault Dweller from the original Fallout but were not allowed to do so. Then came the Arroyo area that it seems a lot of people find tedious and boring.

    The way the Courier obtains Pip-Boy in New Vegas came off as a gimmick too.

    At the same time, it is often the "Vault Boy" image that is used as the Fallout mascot.
     
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  4. lolpop109

    lolpop109 Water Chip? Been There, Done That
    Modder

    Jul 14, 2016
    Well as I am making a mod that basically a whole new fallout game how shall I handle this ! ? Had't even thought about it to be honest. I think I like the idea of getting it off a trader though. As the character is arriving at Atlanta via a sort of caravan I think that he can get from some body hes traveling with. Something like 'You get won the bet that we'd make her in won piece, guess you get to keep this. Hope you arn't thinking of wearing it though'

    Dunno know if I should really bother giving the PC a vault suit though. As most people will be playing from there New Vegas character. But I guess its handy for people starting a new character
     
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  5. TerminallyChill

    TerminallyChill Be excellent to each other.

    Feb 16, 2018
    Do I think it's a gimmick at this point? Yeah. Do I think it's going to stop? Hell no.

    New Vegas is my favorite game of all time but I still find the vault suit thing with Doc Mitchell a little too overhanded. It's not a huge deal since you can immediately change clothes, but the developers could have easily placed the Vault 21 jumpsuit somewhere in his house, made it available for purchase from Chet, or literally anything else besides automatically equipping it to the player. And that's if the guys at Obsidian absolutely couldn't contain themselves and had to include it at the start. I get that Doc Mitchell grew up in Vault 21 and had to give you the Pip-Boy for gameplay purposes, but there is absolutely no real reason for him to give you the suit other than as fan service. Personally, I would have much preferred earning the jumpsuit by actually making it to Vault 21. In my eyes, they are best treated like trophies or souvenirs. They say "Yeah, I've been there." At least New Vegas didn't start you off with power armor and a minigun...

    Speaking of which, seeing as where the series is headed, I would be shocked if we ever see another Fallout title without the prominent inclusion of a vault suit. They're iconic, and more importantly marketable. The company currently in posession of the franchise is big on branding, generally at the expense of everything else. While it might help sales figures, I don't necessarily think it helps the gameplay or the story. Despite what some think, Fallout has the potential to be about more than just vaults, and handing players a desirable item at the start of any game robs them of the feeling of accomplishment and is just poor design in my opinion.

    All that being said though, the Fallout series has much bigger issues than the fact it starts players off with a cheeky gimmick. Fallouts 2 and New Vegas are good games despite it and Fallout 4 would still be a bad game without it.
     
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  6. President_Peaches

    President_Peaches First time out of the vault

    Mar 4, 2018
    Even though it is justified by the backstory, getting the vault suit in Fallout 2 annoyed me, but mainly because I think that the tribal sprites look cooler. Getting the vault suit at the beginning of New Vegas just feels arbitrary, and makes your Courier stand out like a sore thumb in the dusty Western setting.
     
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  7. Boggins

    Boggins First time out of the vault

    Mar 1, 2018
    I'd like a Fallout game where you get the Vault suit about half-way through the game. Maybe the main character discovers a vault as part of the main quest. For whatever reason, he decides to rebuild it and make it his headquarters. Like the Vault-Tech DLC if it was part of the story... and it was actually good... and the settlement building wasn't garbage. Whatever the case, it's just an idea. You'd change up the Fallout formula just a bit, and you'd still be able to post ads of the protagonist wearing a vault suit. Once again, just an idea.
    I was more annoyed that people instantly realize you're a tribal despite the fact that you wear a fucking vault suit. I honestly didn't mind the vault suit in Fallout 2. It's justified by the backstory, like you said. It just feels like "Here's the vault suit worn by the protagonist of Fallout 1. Hey, by the way, do remember Fallout 1 yet?" Fan service is a minor issue though.

    New Vegas, despite being the best modern Fallout game, probably has the most contrived explanation for obtaining the suit, as @TerminallyChill has already said. So the very first guy you meet in the game just happens to be from a vault. And he just happens to still have his jumpsuit and pip-boy with him. The dumbest thing, though, is that he ends up giving his vault stuff away to a complete stranger.

     
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  8. TerminallyChill

    TerminallyChill Be excellent to each other.

    Feb 16, 2018
    Yeah, it's pretty stupid that anyone would assume you were a tribal instead of like, oh I don't know... someone from a major settlement that literally has 'Vault' in its name, where the leader wears a blue and yellow jumpsuit? I know the number on the back is off by five, but most people aren't that observant. I always figured the Chosen One had to have some physiological feature or mannerism that differentiated them from other wastelanders. Maybe their facial structure, a tattoo, haircut, speech pattern, etc. This was a good way for the developers to explain themselves out of a situation where they would otherwise have to write tons of different dialogue based on what the player is wearing at any given time.

    Still... even the lazily developed Failout 4 had adaptive NPC barks depending on whether or not you were wearing power armor. Doesn't seem like much more to ask for people not to know you're a tribal if you aren't sporting anything reflecting that. Might I remind you that this was the same company that wrote an entirely different game just for stupid characters.

    Woah there. Doc Mitchell doesn't just give you his vault shit. He offers you up every worldly possession he owns. Seriously, there is not one strategic motivation for leaving anything in his house but the floorboards. Unless you are hell bent on immersion, that shit is ripe for the picking and Chet is more than willing to fork over some cold hard caps for the privilege. This is why consequences are an important game mechanic, especially in Fallout. The doctor could have at least commented on it, saying something like "You couldn't leave me anything, could you?" if you took all of his shit, which they knew players were bound to do.
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2018
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  9. Boggins

    Boggins First time out of the vault

    Mar 1, 2018
    I mean... that honestly just seemed like an oversight. Also, "muh ludonarrative dissonance." With that being said, it's still pretty dumb since they only had to one thing to fix the problem. All they had to do was just program the game so that you had to "steal" his stuff to obtain it. That was literally all that they needed to do.

    i give new vegas a "i love nitpicking the shit out of things for no reason"/10
     
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  10. Cobra Commander

    Cobra Commander A Smooth-Skin

    Dec 6, 2016
    Brycen is back? lol

    Anyway, no. I hate wearing these clothes (I like in npcs) and in all fallouts I change for a leather armor at the first opportunity. Luckily all games have this possibility early.
     
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  11. Risewild

    Risewild Half-way Through My Half-life
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    All of his things are un-owned so that the players don't steal and make Doc Mitchell's aggressive. Since you can't fight before getting your pipboy, players would just stand there being killed by an angry doc Mitchell.:lmao:
     
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  12. TerminallyChill

    TerminallyChill Be excellent to each other.

    Feb 16, 2018
    I mean hey, when the game is that good, what else are people going to talk about? Don't give me any of that positivity bullshit either, this is the internet.

    The overseer thought he was sending us to Vault 15 for a water chip, but joke's on him. We were only in it to get out of that stupid blue onsie and find a badass leather jacket. Also, TUNNEL SNAKES RULE.



    Is that why they did it? Wow, it seems there were like a hundred different elegant solutions to this problem. For one, as I said earlier, he could have just commented on the situation in some way. 'Hey player, take whatever you need. I'm an old man with no grandchildren so you might as well just inherit my shit. No really, I'll probably be dead soon anyway.' Maybe not those exact words, but you get the gist. The devs could have also just not given the player control until they received the Pip-Boy. I know they wanted to 'teach' the player game controls by having them walk up to the Vigor Tester Machine and sit down on the couch, but New Vegas's controls aren't exactly a mystery. I'd risk letting the player figure out WASD on their own before I'd make the first level of the game fundamentally break the rules that govern just about every other location. Or, or, how about this solution? Make Doc Mitchell a pussy. Make him passive so he flees and cowers like the kids in Fallout 3 and New Vegas do instead of becoming aggressive. If I correctly recall how the mechanic works, it runs out after a certain time. Bam. Problem solved. Steal an item, the doctor runs around and crouches in the corner like it's Great War II. Hire me Obsidian.

    I don't know, maybe I'm just being a picky asshole. Isn't this whole thread about a relatively minor issue anyway, though?
     
  13. Risewild

    Risewild Half-way Through My Half-life
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    They had a very short budget to pay voice actors, so they had to try having the less voiced lines possible. They even had to make Christine mute because they were limited to something like 30.000 voiced lines for all the DLCs. :lmao:
    If Doc Mitchell runs, you won't get a pipboy and will be stuck, then the entire town will be hostile to you and attack on sight. You steal from a faction, the entire faction will become hostile. That's how the game engine works.
    If they made Doc Mitchell's not part of the same faction has everyone else, then that would bring other problems in case you got in trouble with someone else in Goodsprings :nod:.

    Sometimes, things are actually the way they are, not because of oversight, but because they need to be like that, as not to break the game right at the start.
     
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  14. TerminallyChill

    TerminallyChill Be excellent to each other.

    Feb 16, 2018
    I wouldn't call it an oversight, more like a compromise the developers were willing to make that I personally disagree with. If I were in their shoes, I would have waited until the Pip-Boy was equipped to give players control, and make Doc Mitchell's items follow the same rules as everyone else's. Obsidian clearly had other priorities though, and at the end of the day, like the choice to give players the vault suit, it didn't negatively impact the game in a significant enough way to warrant a real complaint. I would put it into the category of an "NMA complaint."
     
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  15. Brycen

    Brycen First time out of the vault

    May 30, 2017
    Even if the developers were not allowed to make the Vault Dweller the main character in Fallout 2, why didn't they come up with a new character who emerged from a Vault? It seems like because they could not do it the way they wanted to originally and possibly because they did not want to redo the Vault Boy artwork, they needed some kind of connection to the main character from the original Fallout. This is why, even with the background story, which it seems a lot of people are not fond of, obtaining the vault jumpsuit in Fallout 2 still comes off as a bad gimmick.

    Obtaining the suit and the Pip-Boy in New Vegas does, indeed, come off as stupid. If they were that adamant about the main character wearing a vault suit and a Pip-Boy, and if they did not want to come up with an alternative to the Vault Boy artwork, then why not just write a character who emerges from a Vault? Otherwise, it is still a bad gimmick. The "Pimp-Boy 3Billion" was also dumb.

    I do not consider it "nitpicking" due to the significance of the Pip-Boy and the Vault Boy mascot established in most of the Fallout series. It is as if some of the developers could not decide if they wanted every main character to emerge from a Vault or not.
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2018
  16. TerminallyChill

    TerminallyChill Be excellent to each other.

    Feb 16, 2018
    Given that the developers had to work with Fallout 3's assets, I don't think they had much of a choice regarding the Pip-Boy. The jumpsuit is a completely different story, however.

    Also hey, leave the Pimp-Boy out of this. It's not its fault that it was too fabulous for this world. :sad: