Tale of Two Wastelands 3.2 release

Discussion in 'NMA News and Information' started by Risewild, Nov 11, 2018.

  1. Norzan

    Norzan Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    Apr 7, 2017
    Can't really choose to ignore anything in the intro when the game doesn't want to. Also, that's just a ridiculous thing to do in the first place.

    The intro and the backstory in the vault is so hardcoded that is pretty much impossible to mod something to change it. The rest of the game makes sure that the crap that happened in the intro actually happened.

    At best you have a mod to completely skip the intro but like i said, the rest of the game still acknowledges that it happened.
     
  2. sesom

    sesom First time out of the vault

    Nov 17, 2008
    Sorry Norzan your information isn't correct.

    The quest with which the games start is called CG00 (VCG00 in NV) and yes you can make a mod to completely skip it, if you want to have the random encounters and the revisit in Vault 101 in your main game then you have to set some questvariables but it isn't complicated stuff. If you can. I actually started a project a while ago for a total conversion for FO3/NV but it's abandoned now.
     
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  3. Norzan

    Norzan Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    Apr 7, 2017
    I did say you can mod it to completely skip it, so my information isn't wrong. My point is that even if you skip it, the narrative, story, characters and the world make sure that it did happen even if you skipped it.
     
  4. sesom

    sesom First time out of the vault

    Nov 17, 2008
    Yeah you have to change the narrative too in the game. Everyone knows and acknowledge constantly that you came from Vault 101. Sorry understood you wrong.
     
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  5. Norzan

    Norzan Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    Apr 7, 2017
    I do admit that this can be somewhat confusing. My point is that you can't mod to not have your dad be James, neither having a living mother, neither having siblings, or really anything in the vault. Unless you want to spend a ton of money hiring the same VAs and changing the script.

    And gotta love Arnust liking posts that say i was wrong even though i wasn't. Being a contrarian and white knight to Fallout 3's bullshit as usual.
     
  6. Arnust

    Arnust Maybe you've seen it, maybe, in a dream...

    Feb 2, 2016
    I tend to appreciate insight into the inner workings of games that are naturally unseen. And also the premise of putting work where his mouth is.

    I probably don’t like it quite as much as seeing people get passed at that, though.

    It does make me wonder though, why the hell do you want to play the game if you want to remove LITERALLY all context for it, as if somehow just isn’t doable by just, say, going and setting your game to Russian or whatever so you can’t possibly understand anything of what you’re being told and just have the game world to roam.

    All which i’m not sure if it either is worth the trouble seeing your general disposition towards the game and it’s authors in the first place, which then makes me wonder if you’re not being an antagonistic ass as usual, more aggravatingly so in this thread supposedly dedicated to talking and celebrating about TTW, feedback, and it’s team, not about how Cool Guy Norzan doesn’t like Fallout 3 like that shit’s novel from him or anyone a DECADE later and particularly on
    NMA of all places.

    So there’s that.

    Anyway, I was wondering, isn’t the balance rather broken by having a whole two games to get XP from, as well as all the new items rarely replacing others? I’ve just done the stuff around Megaton and I leveled at the vanilla rate. I guess it shouldn’t be much of a problem, but I assume it’ll be a bit awkward to wake up on Doc Mitchell’s clinic at level 50.
     
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  7. Golbolco

    Golbolco First time out of the vault

    Jul 12, 2015
    I could deal with that. I don't think that Fallout 1 is made any worse of a game by telling you that you're from Vault 13. Are things actually as intrusive as Norzan says they are, though? I don't recall many lines of dialogue that state every meticulous detail about your character's backstory. The worst of it is referring to James and his wife as your parents, no?
     
  8. sesom

    sesom First time out of the vault

    Nov 17, 2008
    The mainquest is all about your father and that your father left the Vault. You are on a search for your daddy (as you are in FO4 in search for your son) and finishing his passion project. Also remind you a lot of NPCs that you are fresh out of the Vault.
     
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  9. Norzan

    Norzan Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    Apr 7, 2017
    In Fallout 1 being told you are from Vault 13 is fine because that's all the game says about you, everything else is up to you. That's not the case for Fallout 3, the intro tells too much about you and you can't just ignore that on a whim.

    Like sesom said, the entire questline is how you help your dad. You can't just ignore that out of preference. You are called James's son or daughter by some npcs as well and you have quests on the vault after the intro. The entire core of the game is built upon this.
     
  10. Golbolco

    Golbolco First time out of the vault

    Jul 12, 2015
    I’m not sure my question was clear. I’ll try to clarify.

    What would a kidder have to remove, add or change to Fallout 3 in order to free up player choice and determining their own character through roleplay?

    We agree that you would have to:
    -Cut most, if not all of the intro to the game.
    -Clip or splice any dialogue referencing your familial ties to James and Catherine.

    Being fresh out of the Vault is fine: we can assume that if possible, then we would cut the Vault sequence up to escaping the Vault itself. That will keep a lot of the quests/logistical errors in check.

    What else would have to be done, hypothetically?
     
  11. Norzan

    Norzan Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    Apr 7, 2017
    Cut the intro, make any mention of being James's son or daughter disappear and also make James not acknowledge you as his son or daughter and just think you as some random dude/dudette that decided to help him. And also not specific your age.

    That's pretty much it.
     
  12. naossano

    naossano Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Oct 19, 2006
    They don't go anywhere.
    They pop at certain location at certain times, but if you follow them for a couple of hours, they won't reach any cities. They just move randomly.
    Protecting caravans would be the only reason i would go back to the Capital Wasteland.
     
  13. Risewild

    Risewild Half-way Through My Half-life
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    I am pretty sure they have their patrol markers, they are supposed to follow them to reach each settlement.

    Although they will probably die when trying to reach Rivet City, because of the Super Mutants and the route they take. But the game doesn't "simulate" things that are not being rendered, so they will only die if the player is in the same cells as the caravan.

    I am gonna start testing TTW 3.2 way more from today, so I will have to test that too... It will be a very slow and boring trek, to follow each caravan through all of their routes... Literally real time hours I think.
     
  14. sesom

    sesom First time out of the vault

    Nov 17, 2008
    You don't have to follow them Rise for the test, simply wait a day or two on a route marker and see if they show up. That's the planned behavior for them. The advantage is they don't get in any fights that way and you see if the general AI (packages) do what it is supposed to do. While following them they get offtrack, in fights or stuck on bad navmeshes but catch up later when the player reaches a patrol marker with fast travel or from a different direction.
     
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  15. Risewild

    Risewild Half-way Through My Half-life
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    You should know that I am thorough with my testing ;-).
    I do it the hard and boring way just to be sure. It will also help me know, if there are any parts besides the Rivet City route where the caravans will usually die.

    If I identify some of those "problematic" areas, maybe I can suggest we change/edit them a bit to make the caravans have more survivability :wiggle:.


    EDIT: Here are some things TTW adds:
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2018
  16. naossano

    naossano Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Oct 19, 2006
    The problem isn't for spawns. They usually spawn on schedules on map markers. The problem is that when you follow them, they don'T have caravan behaviors.

    Followed the water caravans in Fo3 for 4 or 6 hours. Those guys never reach a city. Sometime they get close to a city, but they move into another direction before reaching it. Then, they seem to go north, then suddenly turn south, then east, then west... Once they spawn, they don't try to reach any destination. They just move at random. Of course, if you spawn somewhere else, they will spawn on schedule, but if you follow them, they don't behave properly.

    It got even worse in New Vegas. I followed one caravan until it reach a location in which they started moving in circle around a stopsign. And then, other caravans join them them and move in circle around the same stopsign, making a cluster of npc on the same spot.

    As it is, it is not possible to follow a protect a caravan for a sustainable amount of time, as they don'T have the proper behavior for it. FoNV can save itself with its quests and writing, but protecting caravan is litterally the only thing i would consider doing in Fo3 at that point. They have a map, but they are doing nothing with it.