The Fallout universe is the 1950s!

Discussion in 'General Fallout Discussion' started by President_Peaches, Mar 14, 2018.

  1. President_Peaches

    President_Peaches First time out of the vault

    Mar 4, 2018
    One of the most annoying thing about the kiddies who have only played the 3d Fallouts is that they insist that the Fallout universe, both pre and post-war is stuck in some sort of 1950s stasis. Sometimes firearms in New Vegas are labelled not "lore-friendly" because they were designed more recently than the early 60's and have synthetic stocks. While Fallout 1+2 were retro-futurisic styled, particularly anything related to the pre-war world, these were aesthetic and thematic choices (contrasting the optimism of post WWII America with the horrific realities of a Cold War gone hot) rather than a concrete depiction of the lore of the world.

    And while the world of Fallout was intentionally pulpy, the influences come not just from old classics such as Forbidden Planet, but also from post-60s sci-fi with a more cynical view of the future, such as A Boy and His Dog, The Road Warrior and Warhammer 40k. Saying that everything in the Fallout world should be straight out of the 1950s is like saying that all the female characters in Futurama should be wearing miniskirts because the world is styled to look like what they thought the future would look like in the 1960s and has lots of references to classic Star Trek.
     
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  2. Norzan

    Norzan Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    Apr 7, 2017
    Blame Bethesda for giving this false view on the Fallout universe.
     
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  3. Hassknecht

    Hassknecht For hate's sake Admin Orderite

    Aug 16, 2010
    I think Fallout was intended to take place in the classic WORLD OF TOMORROW sort of pulp science fiction outlook of the 50s, with the added twist that the collapse from Mad Max happened in that utopian world.
    And before everyone REEEEEs at me that the world of Fallout wasn't utopian, yes, I'm aware. That's because the Mad Max apocalypse happened.
     
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  4. DarkCorp

    DarkCorp Vault Fossil

    Oct 27, 2003
    The future as folks in the 50s and 60s thought it would be, combined with the cyberpunk feel of the 80s. THIS is how the world was supposed to be.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2018
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  5. President_Peaches

    President_Peaches First time out of the vault

    Mar 4, 2018
    Fallout uses imagery from the post-WWII utopian visions of what the future was going to be like, but there is no way that the pre-war America (or the rest of the world) was utopian, with all the wars, peak oil, social unrest, toxic pollution and horrific human experimentation. One of the first images of the pre-war world we see in the series is a power-armoured American soldier summarily executing a Canadian fighter- and that's being used as propaganda.
     
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  6. Hassknecht

    Hassknecht For hate's sake Admin Orderite

    Aug 16, 2010
    I hate you.
     
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  7. President_Peaches

    President_Peaches First time out of the vault

    Mar 4, 2018
    Fite me, bro
     
  8. Corbett

    Corbett First time out of the vault

    Feb 28, 2018
    A suggestion; next time someone says that a gun designed later than the 60s doesn't fit the universe, show them the H&K P90c, then the 90s weapon it's based on.
     
  9. Hassknecht

    Hassknecht For hate's sake Admin Orderite

    Aug 16, 2010
    To be fair, the massive amount of modern (and real world) guns found in Fallout 2 was always a huge point of criticism for Fallout 2.
    I think I'll just ban you or something. Change your nickname to "James The Cockmongler", something classy.
     
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  10. TerminallyChill

    TerminallyChill Be excellent to each other.

    Feb 16, 2018
    Unpopular opinion here. And it's funny because usually I'm the first person who seizes an opportunity to rip Bethesda a new one for not understanding the fiction.

    I don't disagree with the '50s stasis' direction that the Fallout 3 took. As Hassknecht alluded to, I felt that Fallout 2 almost deviated too much from the brilliant retro-futuristic tone that Fallout was trying to set in the first place. Look again at the opening to the original game. There's a black and white tube TV and they are showing an ad for a 50s style futuristic car. Making every pre-war item fit the 50s aesthetic keeps the atmosphere focused in my opinion.

    Bethesda fucked up a lot with Fallout 3, but I never personally felt the style was one of them.
     
  11. Cobra Commander

    Cobra Commander Lanius. The Butcher. Monster of the East.

    Dec 6, 2016
    It is. that´s why I'd rather not get stuck by these conventions. For example, I love the AMR (although I does not use, real men snipes with brush guns without scope). AMR is a nineties weapon

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PGM_Hécate_II



    I also love the Desert Eagle .44 in FO2

    Could not care less if it is not Fallout thing. I know what I like.
     
  12. Gizmojunk

    Gizmojunk Vault Fossil

    Nov 26, 2007
    I would argue that it is not just a belief of the future as they expected it to be... but that the very laws of their physical reality are bent around that belief... to the point that an unknown atomic fallout from the great war could create the Necropolis Ghouls, and that men & women can be transmogrified into B movie ogre-like monsters by being dipped into a green vat nuclear ooze.

    It was to be a thematic GURPS campaign setting after all...

    As for the perceived anachronisms (with the weapons and other items)...
    I'd assume that they could develop any technology at all—regardless of if it was pre or post 50's. The only important factor would be that they would develop it with a 50's aesthetic. If they were to devise an portable media player, or a even cell phone... it would behave like what you'd expect, but it would look like a prop from Forbidden Planet, or out of a World-of-Tomorrow article in Popular Science.

    Fallout is Dieselpunk.
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2018
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  13. Risewild

    Risewild So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    You forgot the New Plague.
     
  14. nkchan16

    nkchan16 It Wandered In From the Wastes

    Jul 27, 2016
    True, as Bethesda's understanding of Fallout universe is extremely superficial. However, Obsidian didn't do anything to fix it either in NV. I often felt like I was in a 50's movie while playing NV.

    Fallout and Fallout 2 had nothing to do with the 50's other than a bunch of retro-futuristic design choices that looked like props of a 50's sci-fi movie and that was about it.
     
  15. Gizmojunk

    Gizmojunk Vault Fossil

    Nov 26, 2007
    I think it's much worse than that. I believe that Todd and Emil are not that dense. Both like video games, and Emil & Pete both were a professional game reviewers at the Adrenalin Vault, back when the original games were current—they would very likely have played them, or known about them.

    Some of the FO3 devs had never even heard of the game before starting work on the sequel... but the ones in charge almost certainly knew of them... and I think that they chose to simplify the elevator pitch—for mass consumption. Try explaining that the game-world is the incarnate belief and expectation of the popular 1950's cultural hopes & fears—blown to hell by nuclear war. Or simply say it's the future that stopped in the 50's. :whatever:

    There were professional game reviews where the authors believed the game was set in the 1950's.
    Todd himself joked during a speech at George Mason University, about some event happening after 1947... so it didn't happen in FO3. :irked:

    IMO it's a marketing choice. Unfortunate for us; very fortunate for them. I can't fault them for being good at their job... But that job is making something that will sell to the masses—not making a faithful sequel, appreciated mainly by those (relatively few) who were fans of the originals. They used us for hype and word of mouth, but they knew they would never deliver on what we were hoping for—and they refused help from at least one Fallout developer who contacted them.
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2018
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  16. TerminallyChill

    TerminallyChill Be excellent to each other.

    Feb 16, 2018
    Not to mention that cold fusion nuclear reactors have been miniturized to the point of powering cars, suits of armor, and fucking guns. I'm glad you brought this up though, because while I must have always subconsciously understood it, I don't know if I would have ever necessarily put Fallout's bad science under the '50s aesthetic' blanket until now.

    Nailed it. I mean look at fucking Mr. Handies and Robobrains. Can we even do that shit now in 2018? Don't tell me they can't make a sniper rifle. The only difference is that the robots look 50s.

    Nope, nothing to do with the 50s at all.

     
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  17. Cobra Commander

    Cobra Commander Lanius. The Butcher. Monster of the East.

    Dec 6, 2016
    I agree, for OWB.

    NV in a nutshell is more like mobsters in old west/cowboys vs roman empire

    . This is even one of the greatest critiques of the Bethesdafags. That NV does not look anything like a "true Fallout"
     
  18. TerminallyChill

    TerminallyChill Be excellent to each other.

    Feb 16, 2018

     
  19. nkchan16

    nkchan16 It Wandered In From the Wastes

    Jul 27, 2016
    Funny thing is, those retro-futuristic design choices for certain stuff in the game felt rather out of place and somewhat annoying when I first played the game back in the day, "immersion breaking" if you will, as I preferred a more realistic game world, which is completely the opposite of what those kiddies think. :D
     
  20. TerminallyChill

    TerminallyChill Be excellent to each other.

    Feb 16, 2018
    You can hate it all you want, I'm not disputing that you dislike the aesthetic. Don't tell me that Fallout has never had anything to do with the 50s or retro-futurism though, because that's just blatantly untrue. If you want something realistic, there are plenty of other titles for that.

    Also on a side note, assuming the only reason people like the design choices is because they are young is a bit of a generalization.