Things Fallout 4 Got Right

Discussion in 'Fallout 4' started by Wasteland Wanderer, Apr 14, 2017.

  1. ThatZenoGuy

    ThatZenoGuy Residential Zealous Evolved Nano Organism

    Nov 8, 2016
    I lack the machines and tooling for such, unlike future machine shops.

    You can't make a gun without the tools.
    I could, given enough time, resources, and tools.

    How much you want to pay me? ;P

    Are you well seasoned machine shop worker? Do you know how to use lathes, stuff like that?

    Stuff like AK's are literally just pieces of metal stamped into shape, with some machined innards.
    Or, they're just incompetent and need the plans because they lack the skills?

    Seriously.
    https://www.google.com.au/search?rl...0i67k1j0i10i67k1j0i10k1j0i13i30k1.EJNDT5XdYT8

    Look, complete nobodies making AK parts and shit.
     
  2. Risewild

    Risewild Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    Because they have the plans and measurements available all over the internet. Today even nobodies have internet.

    Do you have proof that any of them just one day woke up knowing all the precise measurements for each part in a particular gun so they could make it? Also even professional made guns can misfire and not work well even if just one little piece has any fault in it. But anyone without plans and measurements can make a gun you say...

    Also in the real world is easier to get any good quality metals and alloys, in Fallout world is not that easy (NCR has mines that get new ore and the Gun Runners use that to make new weapons), does the Commonwealth have active mines getting quality ore and metals to make weapons from? Not to mention now with 3D printing, any idiot can just download the specs for parts and use a 3D printer to make them.

    Also, last time I checked, to use machinery like the one necessary to make weapon parts you need at least training in using it, are you telling me any wastelander can just go to a place with machines older than 200 years without functioning, any maintenance and probably no power, make it work and use it properly when there is no one around that even knows how to operate or train people into doing it?
    Do we even see anyone in Fallout 4 using any of those machines or making new parts for things instead of using scavenged parts (this is a genuine question, I can't remember)?
    The only ones probably capable of that would be the Institute or later in the timeline the BoS. And why would them be making those weapons when they have the technology and tools to make the real deal (BoS in FNV even make fun of initiates that have to recharge their own ammunition instead of using "real" one).
     
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  3. ThatZenoGuy

    ThatZenoGuy Residential Zealous Evolved Nano Organism

    Nov 8, 2016
  4. Risewild

    Risewild Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    You are already shooting you in the foot with your links, the first thing you can read on your link page is this:
    He only managed to make it because he got the damn plans. Which totally breaks your argument of "people don't need plans to make guns"...
    Notice how he was already a craftsman, he knew how to use the tools, he got quality metal to build it too. He didn't build it without plans and with at least 230 years old rusty metal. Not to mention it says it is far from being an easy task.
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2017
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  5. ThatZenoGuy

    ThatZenoGuy Residential Zealous Evolved Nano Organism

    Nov 8, 2016
    So you're ignoring the last one? A 100% original gun?

    It's not a stretch at all to go from 100% original gun, altered to a replica of a firearm.
     
  6. Risewild

    Risewild Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    It's not an original gun, he "designed it" by being able to build it using common hardware materials. Inside it is still the same as any other 9mm Submachine gun. Except it wasn't made with proper firearm parts.
    His objective was to have a firearm made that doesn't use any firearm components. That doesn't mean he knew how to make a gun without plans of an already existing weapon, it means he just made the components himself, while following some plans.

    The guy in the video even says that his objective was to show you could make a gun without using the government controlled gun parts. He also says that when they loaded it and fired the gun in the court case, it was only good enough to be considered a gun, so even those weapons made with hardware store parts are not close to a real weapon. Notice how he also made plans on how to build those parts and put those plans on his book. If anyone can do it why making plans for it? :confused:

    Video guys also says "it's a crude gun, a heavy gun, the trigger pull sucks, the accuracy would suck because it's a non rifle barrel. It's not perfectly reliable or mostly reliable."

    And now the beauty of you shooting in your foot once again. Even the video guy say:
    When even your examples go against what you're using them for... I rest my case.
    Also I am tired of derailing this thread and just keep repeating myself (both things I hate to do). So even if you don't believe me and don't believe your own sources, then I have nothing else to say about this subject. It would just lead to pages after pages of posts of me repeating myself, wasting my time reading and watching your sources that even you didn't watch or read.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2017
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  7. Prone Squanderer

    Prone Squanderer A bit of a Sillius Soddus.

    Jan 3, 2016
    Aside from the dead Gary in Operation Anchorage, I always thought the whole biometric lock was just bullshit Stanley(?) told the Lone Wanderer so they wouldn't try to take it off. I don't mind the 3000, though I'm not keen on 4's version.

    Those guys immune to radiation...because they believe in an entity called Atom? Load of bollocks. Didn't mind the rest of the Glowing Sea for the most part but there could have been more to it than just "it's a radioactive hellhole."
     
  8. Valdetiosi

    Valdetiosi It Wandered In From the Wastes

    Jul 14, 2017
    Well, I guess this is positive thing to say, but I liked monsters upon Fallout 4, at least those that were not reskinned,renamed or mutated into legendaries.

    It just wants me to have these creatures in New Vegas rather than in 4.
     
  9. Prone Squanderer

    Prone Squanderer A bit of a Sillius Soddus.

    Jan 3, 2016
    Which ones? The bloodbugs and such?
     
  10. Valdetiosi

    Valdetiosi It Wandered In From the Wastes

    Jul 14, 2017
    Yes, Bloodpugs, the underwater beasts, and some "passive" animals.

    If there's something I hate, it's the style of Deathclaws here. Feels like going off to the wrong turn, like Skyrim did with Argonians.
     
  11. Prone Squanderer

    Prone Squanderer A bit of a Sillius Soddus.

    Jan 3, 2016
    I don't recall the underwater ones, unless you mean those mutant dolphin corpses? It's been quite a while since I've played Fallout 4.
     
  12. Hassknecht

    Hassknecht For hate's sake Admin Orderite

    Aug 16, 2010
    Also, the Institute has tons of minions whose entire shtick is to be better than human and being immune to radiation. It wouldn't exactly be hindered by the radiation if they wanted to find him.
     
  13. Risewild

    Risewild Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
    Modder Orderite

    Jun 14, 2014
    I always thought that FNV hinted that anyone can remove it if they want to. After all, Doc Mitchell gives you his old one and you just put it on without any biometric lock or anything. Then Mick and Ralph can also remove your Pipboy and replace it with a Pimpboy (or does it just hands it to you and your pipboy gets replaced automatically? I can't remember). None of them mention any biometric lock or anything. It wouldn't be hard to make Doc Mitchell's or Mick comment about it, specially since it would stay attached to you for the rest of your life (you would think someone giving you something that would be locked to your arm would warn you about it).
     
  14. Shoggot

    Shoggot First time out of the vault

    Sep 18, 2017
    I think some of the characters are done quite right or at least are done in interesting way. However I couldn't get past the 20 hour mark of gameplay because the game is simply annoying.

    Oh, and just gun sounds are huge improvement over FO3. Other than that, I can't think of anything.
     
  15. Avorez

    Avorez First time out of the vault

    Oct 22, 2017
    Well, I'll say this. Fallout 4 did gunplay really well, but I think it says a lot that the gunplay wasn't actually developed by Bethesda, but by MachineGames who makes the Wolfenstein series.

    Fallout 4 does a lot of things wrong, true, but the parts that it does well it actually does well. The problem is, there's not enough things done well to ignore the parts that it does wrong. Settlements are handled poorly, and they kind of all end up looking same-old same-old without mods. Why do I need to have perks to build shops and crafting stations? In Survival mode, needing the Chemist perk or the Medic perk to make healing items MAKES SENSE. So why do I need to have 6 Charisma to build shops? Why do I need CHARISMA to build CRAFTING STATIONS?

    Though, I do think the major issue with Fallout 4 is that the game can really no longer be classified as an RPG. Joseph Anderson does a really good critique of what issues there are with Fallout 4. See here, for that. What he posits is that if you treat Fallout 4 as an RPG, then yes, you basically would have to scrap the entire game and then remake it from the ground up. Whereas, if you treat it as a game that's an FPS-RPG hybrid, and build around that, then you'll have a more enjoyable game. The problem is, the two portions of the game aren't unified, the FPS portion of the game is more heavily favored than the RPG side, and it really shows.
     
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  16. Black Angel

    Black Angel Grand Inquisitor of the Ordo Hereticus

    Mar 21, 2016
    "MachineGames"? Not id Soft? Pardon me, I'm not exactly in the know.
     
  17. Kilus

    Kilus Antiantibiotic Orderite

    May 3, 2003
    The uninstall feature worked.
     
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  18. a721402

    a721402 I'm officially doomed.

    Mar 29, 2016
  19. Avorez

    Avorez First time out of the vault

    Oct 22, 2017
    Sorry, I thought it was MachineGames, my mistake.

    Regardless, I think the video's points stand. The issue is that we're approaching FO4, and to a significant extent FO3, as RPGs and not games that have just...a different feel entirely from the nature of the RPG. To me, FO:NV is the only game that operates like FO3 or FO4 that is genuinely an RPG. FO:NV has genuine consequences, it has genuine player choice, factions that actually matter, and the ability to impose a particular personality or world-view on a character that we decide the physical and personality characteristics of.

    Sure, FO3 has some of these elements, but it doesn't pull these things off well. FO4 doesn't really even have these elements at all, and when it does those elements feel...forced. Awkward. FO4 doesn't have genuine player choice, and nothing epitomizes that more than the ending and, no, I don't mean the slideshow. The actual ending quest of FO4 boils down to two separate quests, really, with very little variation between the different variants provided by each faction. Ultimately, for all of us here at NMA, this provides an inadequate experience because we want the RPG. We expect Fallout the RPG, because we've played FO1 or FO2, or FO:NV.

    The issue is, the other portion of the community for FO4 that is more captured by the gunplay, is also dissatisfied because they aren't getting a genuinely complete experience. FO4 has these masterfully arranged combat arenas, but there's no real way to interact with them, no way to change the game so that the player feels empowered by the ability to access the entirety of them and turn those elements into a player advantage instead of a player hindrance. To make matters worse, in my opinion, changing this lack of completeness on the FPS side of things is significantly more trivial than fixing the RPG side of things. The real issue is making the FPS game of Fallout and the RPG game of Fallout mesh, and in some ways I think Anderson solves a few of the problems, but it really comes down to the fact that Bethesda's own lack of ability becomes more and more apparent with each new title that they release.

    I've often said this about Bethesda, and I'll stand by it until Bethesda truly rectifies this issue, but Bethesda handles factions in-general incorrectly. They provide the character with all this agency and freedom to access any faction anywhere, but when the player finally reaches the top ranks of the faction, there's nothing there. No benefit. No real power. You're still Joe Blow from Chorrol, but now you can call yourself the Harbinger of the Companions after 4 quests and a few radiants. A lot of this is also general laziness on the part of Bethesda. In Oblivion, each faction has a rather lengthy quest chain, each with it's own story, some are good, some are hilariously weak, but for better or worse they have soul. They have a story. Skyrim's factions don't, and neither do FO4s. FO4 has less sidequests than FO3 did. Do you realize how insane that is? FO3's already kinda sparse on the side-quest front, but they hacked it even further down in 4, further alienating the RPG crowd.

    Anyways, now I'm writing a gorram thesis, so I should probably end it there, but I think the solution is kinda clear on what Bethesda needs to do.
     
  20. AeonG

    AeonG First time out of the vault

    Jun 12, 2016
    Not many, I can list them pretty easily:
    Power Armor, except it's limited use and the fact that you get it immediately.
    Nick Valentine, the only New Vegas-tier companion.
    Assaultrons. They look great, and fighting them is really awesome.