Can't Seem To Encounter Mantis' With TeamX Fallout 1 Patches

Discussion in 'Fallout General Modding' started by RyanFialcowitz, Mar 12, 2008.

  1. RyanFialcowitz

    RyanFialcowitz It Wandered In From the Wastes

    106
    Jul 30, 2005
    As the title states I can't seem to find any Mantis' in random encounters. I usually encounter several between Vault 13 and 15, I need to find them to get the early Karma boost you get from killing them because Tandi won't divulge certain information without your Karma being at a certain point. Obviously, I could just be really unlucky, but I've never had this much trouble finding them before. Any input would be appreciated. I'm using both the 1.32 patch and the NPC Mod. Thanks.

    -Ryan P. Fialcowitz
     
  2. Stg Granite

    Stg Granite Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    365
    May 8, 2007
    uh... Are there mantis in Fallout 1? I only remember them in Fallout 2 and i'm absolutely sure i've never encountered one in the first game.
     
  3. Lexx

    Lexx Background Radiant
    Moderator

    Apr 24, 2005
    Yes, there are. In the area around the glow, as far as I remember.

    Really? I never encountered them there.
     
  4. Kanhef

    Kanhef Vault Dweller

    793
    Sep 2, 2007
    Per's guide lists them as occurring in coastal areas and around the Boneyard and Shady Sands. I think I've seen them around the Hub as well, but it's been a while since I player FO1. They aren't very common anywhere, though; I see a lot more of them in FO2.
     
  5. Stg Granite

    Stg Granite Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    365
    May 8, 2007
    Man, i'm feeling as if I have never played Fallout before. :oops:
     
  6. Jaesun

    Jaesun First time out of the vault

    57
    Jul 12, 2005
    Interestingly, I also tried the 1.32 patch a few months ago (and using NO other mods) and played all the way through F1. I never ever encountered any Mantis at all. Perhaps we should post this finding on the TeamX forums?
     
  7. patriot_41

    patriot_41 Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?

    478
    Mar 8, 2008
    Well I encoutnered mantis once for over 3 years of playing Fallout 1. Besides - why would you need them? :lol: :lol: :lol:
     
  8. Nimrod

    Nimrod It Wandered In From the Wastes

    196
    Sep 24, 2007
    Definitely mantis up north, I've run into them as my first encounter after leaving V-13. Very rare though. Coyotes suffer the same issue, but I don't believe that to be a patch thing. I think I've run into maybe three coyote encounters total since I picked up the game.

    Why would we need them? Variety. Tweaking the encounter tables a touch would be a welcome addition in my mind.
     
  9. RyanFialcowitz

    RyanFialcowitz It Wandered In From the Wastes

    106
    Jul 30, 2005
    As I posted above in order to get Tandi to put Junktown and The Hub on your map as well as talk about the Deathclaw you need 6 karma. It is only possible, through Vault 13 and Shady Sands to get 5 karma. Every Mantis you kill gives you 1 karma, thus I need them to get Tandi to talk.

    How would I go about tweaking the encounter table? Without the patch I got the Mantis encounter more then any other. I know how to do it in Fallout 2 but I can't seem to find the same file for Fallout 1. I think this should be addressed by the makes of the mod for the reason I posted above.

    -Ryan P. Fialcowitz
     
  10. Alchemist

    Alchemist Nocturnal Mechanic Modder

    164
    Dec 26, 2004
    rnddesrt.int

    Mantis' appearance in that region of the world was extremely rare since the first release of the game. So it's never been assured that you'll get the encounter (and corresponding karma levels) before visiting Shady Sands. It's more likely to find mantis near the Boneyard or during caravan run than in the area between V13 and V15. Hint: killing ANY 'evil' creatures rises your karma.

    We'll check the desert encounter script bundled with the patch. But if there is nothing wrong with it then we definitely won't tincker hardcoded into the engine tables just to fulfil personal customs. When it comes to cheating, you're on your own, sorry.

    --- Update ---

    Alright. I've looked into the script. And it looks this way. There is only one opportunity to encounter mantis in the topmost desert area of the game world. It's so called 'Dead traveler' encounter. It could appear only in the approx one square radius around Shady Sands. And the chance is only 16,67%. It's already doesn't look like 'quite often'. :wink: Moreover. The 'Dead traveler' in fact is not just a generic dead body but Lance, which was reenabled by Avega. So you never get the dead Lance encounter until he actually dies. And at the moment, when player usually roams between V13, SS and V15, Lance is apparently alive. So no manti could be encountered at the early stage of the game.
    You can just delete the file rnddesrt.int to revert to the old behavior. But this could trigger back party member multiplication bug and something about Tandi (I don't remember what exactly).
    I'm adding this one to the list of questionable features. But I won't guarantee that anything will be actually changed.
     
  11. RyanFialcowitz

    RyanFialcowitz It Wandered In From the Wastes

    106
    Jul 30, 2005
    1.) Who is Lance?

    2.) How is wanting to encounter a dead Lance cheating?

    3.) I can't explain it but I know I have had that encounter in the vicinity of Vault 15. This is, of course, without your patch.

    4.) So, in order to woo over Tandi one would have to visit Junktown or The Hub and then backtrack to Shady Sands? Is there some other way to get the additional dialog from her?

    -Ryan P. Fialcowitz
     
  12. Wasteland Ghost

    Wasteland Ghost Still Mildly Glowing

    296
    Sep 20, 2005
    1) "You see Lance, one of the guards from Shady Sands' long-range patrols."
    2) It is not cheating. But it is questionable situation. The original script is "killing" Lance right after his creation so you can see only his dead body. In 1.3 patch we fixed some bugs and removed kill-after-creation stuff. Now I really don't know what to do with this. May be we should remove this change from the patch and leave it for Restoration Project.
     
  13. RyanFialcowitz

    RyanFialcowitz It Wandered In From the Wastes

    106
    Jul 30, 2005
    1.) Where do your currently encounter Lance? When and where does he die? Is this info in the read.me?

    2.) I'd be fine with the change, if I could only get the dialog from Tandi. If you simply lowered the karma requirement a few points- it wouldn't be an issue.

    -Ryan P. Fialcowitz
     
  14. Nimrod

    Nimrod It Wandered In From the Wastes

    196
    Sep 24, 2007
    I usually encounter him between Shady Sands and Vault 15. I don't know if he dies unless you kill him.
     
  15. Alchemist

    Alchemist Nocturnal Mechanic Modder

    164
    Dec 26, 2004
    2RyanFialcowitz
    You can encounter Lance in the close vicinity of the Shady Sands. Presumably in 1-2 square radius. He doesn't die until he gets killed. There is no real cause to mention that details in the readme file.

    I don't thik that's a wise decision. It's better to really remove this questionable feature from the patch and reserve it for the upcomig Restoration Project.

    But tell me why do you want this dialogue brunch with Tandi that much? There are more than one person in Shady Sands who can mark Hub an Junktown on your worldmap. Ian for example. So player DOES NOT get stuck if he can't get direction from Tandi.

    And to make it clear. I've been talking about 'cheating' because you make your walkthrough of the game very very dependant on the rare enough encounter. If you'd play the game for the firts time you'd never be seeking for that particular dead body of Lance. :wink:
     
  16. Wasteland Ghost

    Wasteland Ghost Still Mildly Glowing

    296
    Sep 20, 2005
    Yeah, I think we better make this as separate encounter and this change is definitely not for the patch.
     
  17. Per

    Per Vault Consort Staff Member Admin

    Apr 1, 2004
    You can probably add a reversed karma check in Trent's script to your list of bugs.
     
  18. Wasteland Ghost

    Wasteland Ghost Still Mildly Glowing

    296
    Sep 20, 2005
    2Per Thanks, I'll look into this issue.
     
  19. RyanFialcowitz

    RyanFialcowitz It Wandered In From the Wastes

    106
    Jul 30, 2005
    Well, the information she provides is only really useful the first time you get to Shady Sands and I would imagine most players wouldn't have a lot of reason to return later. Would it be possible to split the encounter in two? One for Lance and one for the Manti? I'm not sure if that was the suggestion one of the above posters was making.

    -Ryan P. Fialcowitz
     
  20. Wasteland Ghost

    Wasteland Ghost Still Mildly Glowing

    296
    Sep 20, 2005
    Wasteland Ghost:
    :)