Dungeon crawler

V

VoidVector

First time out of the vault
Does anyone feel that the game was made into a dungeon crawler? A lot of the content was made around the destroyed metro system, caves, hostile installations, and rundown vaults. Most of which contain non-negotiating enemies.

In both F1 and F2, you can negotiate with raiders, infiltrate most enemy bases. Most of the events happen above ground. I don't think F1 and F2 had many long dungeons. Most places you can enter via friendly means. Just trying to list some, I can only come up with 4 dungeons for Fallout 2.

Arroyo Trial
Klamath rat cave
Raider Base
Redding mine
 
Anybody who played Oblivion with it's myriad of Aelid ruins and caves shouldn't be surprised at the abundance of ant nests and subway tunnels in FO3.
 
Dungeon-crawlers usually have some nice/interesting/unique loot as a reward for all this time spent on action-packed and sometimes boring exploration of unending dungeons. Funny thing is that Fallout 3 doesn't offer much of that reward. And when PC come across places like Hamilton's Hideaway player can become annoyed - I mean all those closed gates/doors/containers that require 'one-particular-bloody-key' and are unaccessible for skilled sneaky-thief-like PC or strong PC with sledgehammer or PC trained to work with explosives who have some grenades in pocket [BTW: what has happened to dynamite and plastic explosives in this universe?]. Nay. It's not planned for you to go there now so forget it.

Unmodded Oblivion has additionally level-scalled loot so low-level thief or adventurer can be a bit frustrated when after time spended on exploring some generic ayleid runs/mine/fort/cave he/she found few pieces of gold, some pair of cheap shoes, few of arrows and some sword he/she has already in ten copies. More boring was only planes of Oblivion.

Fallout 3's dungeon maybe aren't as irritating as Oblivion's are but they are definitelly boring, especially when they become obligatory to go through. There are too much dungeon-crawiling for sure.

As for dungeons in real Fallout games... There are also some dungeons under Broken Hills. And Vault 15 can be considered dungeon. But the again all of them [except Temple of Trails] are more or less optional when it comes to main plot so they rather examples of variety of environment :twisted:.

Shame Fallout 3 took example from wrong predecessor... :twisted:
 
I liked the idea of using the metro tunnels to get around the DC area, but it was oh-so-tedious. Especially playing a stealth character, trying not to be spotted. Not that it mattered. Beth can't design games for stealth characters. They've got a huge D&D approach to the genre: There's a dungeon. Go in there and beat up everything you see. Rinse. Repeat.
 
Ever since meeting dad in the game, I have been doing quests that involves dungeon or fighting or both. I am so tired by those now. I am at the "point of no return" (i.e. game ends if i continue), and trying to rack up all the side quests. The only breathe of fresh air I got recently was the awfully short Republic of Dave mini-quest.
 
Trithne said:
I liked the idea of using the metro tunnels to get around the DC area, but it was oh-so-tedious. Especially playing a stealth character, trying not to be spotted. Not that it mattered. Beth can't design games for stealth characters. They've got a huge D&D approach to the genre: There's a dungeon. Go in there and beat up everything you see. Rinse. Repeat.
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Not really a D&D approach. A good thief in D&D would have little trouble stealing all the loot from the dungeon without or with very little fighting. A mage could summon creatures to fight for him. It's just Beth's ridiculous idea of "fun".
 
Seelix said:
Dungeon-crawlers usually have some nice/interesting/unique loot as a reward for all this time spent on action-packed and sometimes boring exploration of unending dungeons. Funny thing is that Fallout 3 doesn't offer much of that reward.
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Exactly. I have never felt so frustrated as when I just got finished brawling my way through a stupid subway or building, fighting hordes of fire ants, raiders, ghouls, radscorpions, stupid radroaches, and mutants, only to find out that I wasted health and ammo to find... To find.... *looks around* What the hell? There is NOTHING HERE.
 
cause Beth made an FPS
and in FPS you have to crawl in the dark tunnels and shoot stuff!


I think it should be #1 tip to all the FO3 players: dont go to the underground unless you absolutely have to. swim over the river, fast-travell, just dont go under - it will worsen your game experience
 
FOO isn't an FPS. It's a poor dungeon-crawler Action RPG. I WISH it used FPS game mechanics, that would save it from being as bad as it is.

I'm also not entirely sure that all FPS consist of just crawling in dark tunnels. Really depends on the setting.
 
Quite true. Just about everywhere in Half-Life was well-lit. I find the hybrid system quite odd; being an FPS veteran in the extreme I'm a bit taken aback when a carefully aimed headshot goes wide for the fifth time. Weapons break down too fast and while my skill in-game is holding me back, it can never make up for a potential lack of skill as a player -i.e. in Fallout (2) if you could click your mouse on someone they game did the rest, and if you were to hit them, you could. In 3, however, I have to aim and fire just like a true FPS, but then I still get a dice check to see if the shot I just aimed perfectly actually hits. This breaks the immersion a bit.

I am not fond of the metro, nor am I fond of the large piles of rubble which I cannot climb over not matter how possible it seems (the invisible walls are obvious) when my goal is a stone's throw away. (I still haven't figgured out how to get to the national archives; I've approached it from every side possible and it is always blocked by the damnable rubble.) The Metro, I think, is the worst part of the game. They're all the same, filled with boring enemies and rarely loot. I stay out of them if possible. They remind me of a line from the excellent first Doom novel; something like "We traded a whole bunch of ammunition for a red keycard. Don't ask."
 
i like dungeons, i like adventure. i hate the fact that they are so generic, i hate it when i feel like i`ve been in this dungeon before.

i mean, theres nothing like going through a big dungeon while listening your own music playlist.

fallout 1/2 always made me feel like i was at someplace new (because i was, in fact, in a new place), but going through fallouts 3 metros, or entering larger wrecked buildings, or caves... all metros are the same, all wrecked buildings are pretty much the same, all a caves look the same.

sneaking w/o stealth boy, even with a 100% in the skill is useless and time consuming, put half those points in small guns and you can get the job done in half the time. i really wanted to be sneaky, i really did, but got tired of waiting for the right time to take a shot when i just need to pump some med-x and use a few stims if needed and charge (got to the end of the game with 750+ stims, 100+ of every single drug and over 19000 caps).
btw drugs are overpowered, and addiction isnt even a problem, you just have to keep pumping drugs and youll never feel the side effects. then when you are at home you use the chemistry lab and get de-tox and thats it.
bottom line, if you want a sneaky characted, you dont need to pump sneak, just get a few stealth boy.


oh and the reward in Fallout 3 is doing the dungeon, you find the treasures hidden as you go, and at the end sometimes you find something extra special, but most times theres nothing.
 
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