No jury in Bethesda vs Interplay

Discussion in 'NMA News and Information' started by Brother None, Nov 10, 2011.

  1. Brother None

    Brother None This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Apr 3, 2003
    Bethesda and Interplay suddenly remembered a clause in the APA that means that despite requests from both for this case to go before jury, it won't be going before jury, Duck and Cover reports.

    Also, as you'd expect, Interplay has argued Bethesda dealt with them in bad faith.<blockquote>A. Interplay proposes to prove the following facts in support of its counter-claims:
    (1) The Asset Purchase Agreement signed between Interplay and Bethesda on April 4, 2007, (APA) is void ab initio because there was no "meeting of the minds" with respect to the rights granted between the parties;</blockquote>That's really not a new or shocking claim. Bethesda can be fined or more for that if the court agrees, and technically the APA could be voided, which would revert the Fallout license back to Interplay and see them be paid a ton of licensing fees out of the profits of Fallout 3 and New Vegas. I have never heard anyone other than Interplay stockholders suggest this is a likely case scenario.
     
  2. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    well the interesting question is if this would be a "good" scenario ...

    Remember ... who ever wins. Fallout fans lose :|
     
  3. Brother None

    Brother None This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Apr 3, 2003
    I know some are averse to a "shell company" getting Fallout, but do realize Interplay would not just get Fallout, they'd get a truckload of cash as Bethesda would have to pay them damages and a truckload of licensing fees. Certainly enough to do well with the license.

    Not that it matters for us. Fallout is now an FPS/RPG franchise. Interplay couldn't release even a slightly old-school Fallout without the current legion of fans rioting to this "betrayal" of Fallout's "franchise principles" or something like that.
     
  4. Bakura

    Bakura Still Mildly Glowing

    223
    Sep 8, 2011
    Not if they market it right. Most gamers do have a soft spot for classic games. Also never forget that avrage gamer has the memory span of a goldfish,meaning the second Interplay makes,or remakes,fallout in classic form no one will remember the Bethesda version. If they do,and they miss it,they will most likly buy the next Elder Scrolls.
     
  5. Surf Solar

    Surf Solar So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Aug 20, 2009
    You have probably never been much outside of these boards here? A vast majority of "new generation gamers" "hate" the "oldschool" Fallout titles and would never accept such a thing.
     
  6. Kilus

    Kilus Not Australian Orderite

    May 3, 2003
    I suggested this and never had interplay stock. This is court, Interplay has actual lawyers and they have found avenues of attack. I mean I'm not a legal expert but to me it seems like there is a chance to nullify the contract. Then again I'm only slightly familiar with Australian contract law which is different from American Law.
     
  7. TheSHEEEP

    TheSHEEEP It Wandered In From the Wastes

    149
    Jan 22, 2007
    Yup.
    There won't ever be games like Fallout 1 + 2 from AAA devs again.

    Look at indie devs if that really is what you are waiting for. Who knows what will come from that direction? ;)
     
  8. Brother None

    Brother None This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Apr 3, 2003
    I didn't say it was impossible. Just that if it were likely there's no reason Bethesda wouldn't have settled out already, or that there is anything indicating that this is likely except "Interplay's lawyers are better than Bethesda's lawyers".
     
  9. Kilus

    Kilus Not Australian Orderite

    May 3, 2003
    It can only be settled if both groups find a agreement. Maybe Interplay is asking for too much money, maybe Zenimax refuses to consider settlement at this time. Not every party of a lawsuit acts rationally.
     
  10. ramessesjones

    ramessesjones It Wandered In From the Wastes

    194
    Oct 27, 2010
    I think if it was marketed as "spin off" it could work, similar to how New Vegas is a spin off to Fallout 3, even though his story, setting, dialogues and quest structures actually resemble and somewhat continue the earlier games in the series, but more extreme to where combat mechanics are included in that as well.

    A downloadable, lower priced game would probably be a good format for a game that follows more closely to the old school mechanics, so long you promise another shooter engine based version in the future.
     
  11. ReedTFM

    ReedTFM First time out of the vault

    46
    Dec 21, 2010
    More likely than not, even if the current contract is ruled void ab initio (void from the beginning), the court will simply look to the parties course of conduct since execution of the agreement to determine what the "actual" agreement was.

    Before the dispute arose, Beth and Interplay acted with the apparent belief that Beth had the right to make Fallout 3 and NV. Before the TLA deadline, Beth and Interplay acted under the belief Interplay retained the rights to make the MMO. Regardless of whether deadlines were missed or only the name "Fallout" was liscensed, those two courses of conduct will likely be reflected in the courts ruling, rather than a wholesale windfall for Interplay.

    Any contract can be recinded and modified simply by the conduct of the parties after execution. This is why course of conduct evidence AFTER the agreement is entered into is not even considered parol evidence.

    A scenario where Beth has to pay royalties for its games to Interplay is extremely unlikely, simply under reliance and unjust enrichment theories. The court will look to the intent of the parties and quite possibly just rewrite or strike the offending clauses as unenforceable.
     
  12. Brother None

    Brother None This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Apr 3, 2003
    Nice one, Reed, that makes a lot of sense.

    If we get more of these documents to read (we sometimes do) would you care to do some analysis?
     
  13. ReedTFM

    ReedTFM First time out of the vault

    46
    Dec 21, 2010
    Thanks, Brother None.

    I would be glad to offer input on anything you guys get... It's not often a (limited) legal background comes in handy on a post-apocalypse forum.
     
  14. Walpknut

    Walpknut This ghoul has seen it all

    Dec 30, 2010
    Yeah Interplay will make an old school fallout if they win, just look at how well they handled Fallout before selling it, canceling VanBuren and making FOBOS and planing a sequel to FOBOS.
     
  15. Dork Mage

    Dork Mage First time out of the vault

    42
    Oct 19, 2008
    Nice to hear from someone with a legal (limited) background, I don't BTW.

    I look upon this case as entertainment so I've finally perused the APA and TLA to try and see what's going on.

    The APA is a drab, boring sell/purchase agreement. Frankly the only way to violate that agreement is for Interplay to issue Fallout Trilogy... oh wait....

    I really can't fathom this one. The issuance of Fallout Trilogy is (apparently) a blatant violation and yet Bethesda screws it up. Rather than file for a injunction to halt sales of and require repackaging of Fallout Trilogy, Bethesda files an injunction to nullify all contracts... which the court rejects. A halt sales and repackage ruling would have been guarenteed though (and would have hurt Interplay financially more) but Bethesda goes for broke instead and loses....

    The TLA is more interesting. Interplay must meet several criteria to retain rights.

    After 2-years
    1) Full scale development: 100% of Interplay developers are developing V13 - check - okay full scale development is occurring....

    2) US $30 million secured minimum financing: don't know... does Masthead guarentee Interplay access to $30 million? If so then - check - okay got financing. Note, there does not have to be money in a bank account.

    After 4-years (5-years if Bethesda is notified that good faith effort will result in a full scale release within 12 additional months)

    Note, Interplay can claim Bethesda legal actions have made it impossible to meet this provision and that Bethesda has acted in a caprice manner, and that... [might work].

    3) Full scale deployment of MMOG on server available 24hrs/day, 7-days/week: nope.

    4) Minimum 10,000 paying subscribers: uh, no....
     
  16. Bakura

    Bakura Still Mildly Glowing

    223
    Sep 8, 2011
    Yeah, and most of these "gamers" still piss the bed. You must understand: I HAVE seen the new generation of gamers: they are all morons who can`t think for themselfs, who will never amount to anything other than a fry cook or a waterboy and could not careless ether way. So my post still stands: Build it,market it,the idiots will flock to it,and Fallout 3 will be forgotten like it should be.
     
  17. Walpknut

    Walpknut This ghoul has seen it all

    Dec 30, 2010
    ^Remeber that, if you don't like Old School RPGS you will only be a fry cook, because as we know we can just clasify people like that.
     
  18. Bakura

    Bakura Still Mildly Glowing

    223
    Sep 8, 2011
    Why is it that whenever I post something,you seem to show up to make fun of it? Your watching me aren`t you?
     
  19. Brother None

    Brother None This ghoul has seen it all
    Staff Member Admin Orderite

    Apr 3, 2003
    Well, that was a pretty stupid post dude.
     
  20. Sub-Human

    Sub-Human -

    May 31, 2011
    So, basically... nothing has changed.

    Fallout doesn't seem to have a very bright future. Like a lot of (good) titles in the past, it's not very lively. Or enjoyable, at least for me. I'd love Bethesda to lose; I'm not exactly pro-Interplay, but I'm sure as hell anti-Bethesda.

    My (great-great-)grandparents lived under Stalin... I don't mind doing the same.

    On a side note, 11.11.11! It was truly a unique moment. You know, when the clock hit 11:11:11 in the morning. 12 ones in a row! :)