What's in a name?

[Bulletbait]

The name "Fallout"...a very memorable name among games. Prestigious, at times. Fallout is (or was) THE definition of post-apoc roleplay. You might talk about another game, and someone else might say "Oh, like Fallout?". Fallout's name occupies a space on many people's "great games" lists - it arrived at just the right time, during the explosion in interest in computer gaming in which other notable names like Doom, Betrayal at Krondor, etc also got swept up into legendary status.

But the name Fallout may be a curse, now. Greedy, lazy companies snap up the names of computer game legend and apply them to generic, poorly designed smelly extrusions of data, and have the nerve to name those piles of crap as spiritual successors to a once-great series. Great names command greater attention. Names like Fallout. Attention from corporate slobs (Bethesda comes to mind) with $'s in their eyes.

For this reason, I don't expect to ever see a decent game called "Fallout" ever again. It's greatness may have damned it to an eternity of being assraped by money-hungry halfwits.

I could be wrong. Actually I hope I am. But the future doesn't look bright, in my eyes.

 

[Serifan]

nope it does not look good for the future but I still have a little hope for the game.

as far as we know the game will be a FPRPG but maybe just maybe they still might be able to capture what made fallout great. but untill the game is released we won't know.

 

[Bulletbait]

The future of Fallout IMHO probably lies with games like Afterfall, which have yet to be gobbled up by Beth or anyone else for that matter. The fact that Afterfall has a forum on this website and encourages input from fans of the genre gives me great hope that there will be other "upstarts" in our arena, which we can hold accountable for the treatment of the post-apocalyptic setting, and who will listen to post-apoc fans at the very least because they can't afford not to.

Fallout 3 will probably enjoy a fair degree of commercial success, because there are always the folks who are willing to settle for whatever pap gets spooned onto their hard drives, and there are always people who enjoy playing Fallout but don't really GET why Fallout is the way it is - hence (in order of least-to-greatest asymmetry with F1) Fallout 2, Tactics, and FOBOS.

 

[zioburosky13]

Fallout 3 will probably enjoy a fair degree of commercial success, because there are always the folks who are willing to settle for whatever pap gets spooned onto their hard drives, and there are always people who enjoy playing Fallout but don't really GET why Fallout is the way it is - hence (in order of least-to-greatest asymmetry with F1) Fallout 2, Tactics, and FOBOS.

I don't think FOOS was a commercial success....which lead to downfall of Interplay.

 

[Grotesque]

I wish for some "nuclear war" in the gaming industry. and after the radioactive fallout is gone, the few that will remain should feel reborn and make great games like in the past

 

[Schuljunge]

i asked someone: Do you know the game Fallout?

he replied: Yeah, if you mean Flatout.

Such an dumbass.

 

[Konig15]

I can understand the pessimism, but that's not to say all hope is lost. Morrowind is a fine game, though I'll readily admit it I'd enjoyed it more turn-based and thrird person.

Listen, Arcanum was a real disapoontment for me. It was not like in Fallout where you could vreate any viable character. In fact, a swordsman was the only true effective option for most of the game. So even the greats can fall, and while I'm hoping Fallout 3 won't be a Morrowind knockoff, I do think certain things from it could make Fallout 3 a better game. So don't give up yet I say...and don't buy in the first two weeks either.

 

[Sander]

I can understand the pessimism, but that's not to say all hope is lost. Morrowind is a fine game, though I'll readily admit it I'd enjoyed it more turn-based and thrird person.

Completely irrelevant. Its design has absolutely nothing to do with Fallout.

Listen, Arcanum was a real disapoontment for me. It was not like in Fallout where you could vreate any viable character. In fact, a swordsman was the only true effective option for most of the game.

No it wasn't. In fact, my mage was a lot more effective.

So even the greats can fall, and while I'm hoping Fallout 3 won't be a Morrowind knockoff, I do think certain things from it could make Fallout 3 a better game. So don't give up yet I say...and don't buy in the first two weeks either.

Ehm, like what?

 

[Konig15]

Well I was saying a game doesn't have to look or play like Fallout II to be Fallout. It just has to be good. That's why I mention Morrowind; like it or not Fallout III is going to have at least a wiff of Morrowind and Oblivion in it, but that may not neccessarily be a bad thing. I like the combat system in Fallout II, but if Bethesda comes out with a better one, and it could happen, why lambast it because "it's not Fallout?" I do remember people saying, not a lot of people, but still, possibly here too, that Fallout II wasn't really "Fallout" because the survivalist aspect was largely gone. Fallout II Wasteland was more 'civilized' and functional than in Fallout I, and stuff was readily availible form Vault City on.

I did get tired of the tediousness of Morrowind, but it is a nice game. So I think it unfair to bemoan, and just bemoan, the 'crappy job' Bethesda is doing without seeing anything but a couple of screenshots. Even Trioka could make a subpar game (and I really saw greatness in Arcanum. BTW, I when the Tech path and that's REAL punishing for about 2/3 of the game), and Bethesda might do something great. Development is just begining, let's watch and wait, and THEN bash the crap out of a bad Fallout III and Bethesda if the case merits it.

 

[FeelTheRads]

Umm, you really need to catch up with your reading.

Like reading this very forum and see what's been discussed about what Fallout is.
It's not just a "good game".

Oh yeah, and Troika couldn't make any game at all anymore, subpar or otherwise, because they ceased to exist quite some time ago.

 

[Sander]

Well I was saying a game doesn't have to look or play like Fallout II to be Fallout. It just has to be good. That's why I mention Morrowind; like it or not Fallout III is going to have at least a wiff of Morrowind and Oblivion in it, but that may not neccessarily be a bad thing. I like the combat system in Fallout II, but if Bethesda comes out with a better one, and it could happen, why lambast it because "it's not Fallout?" I do remember people saying, not a lot of people, but still, possibly here too, that Fallout II wasn't really "Fallout" because the survivalist aspect was largely gone. Fallout II Wasteland was more 'civilized' and functional than in Fallout I, and stuff was readily availible form Vault City on.

You've completely missed the point.
Fallout 3 will be a game in the Fallout series. It hence has to be designed *in line with Fallout's design*. This means a lot of things, but the basis is a faithful representation of PnP RPGs. Hence why turn-based combat, the isometric view etc. etc. are essential.

I did get tired of the tediousness of Morrowind, but it is a nice game. So I think it unfair to bemoan, and just bemoan, the 'crappy job' Bethesda is doing without seeing anything but a couple of screenshots. Even Trioka could make a subpar game (and I really saw greatness in Arcanum. BTW, I when the Tech path and that's REAL punishing for about 2/3 of the game), and Bethesda might do something great. Development is just begining, let's watch and wait, and THEN bash the crap out of a bad Fallout III and Bethesda if the case merits it.

Hey, I'm not the one bashing Bethesda everywhere.

 

[Roshambo]

Well I was saying a game doesn't have to look or play like Fallout II to be Fallout. It just has to be good.

The same thinking went into Ultima IX and guess what?

No, this isn't a rhetorical question, I want to know how you can be so stupid to miss other obvious examples. Many other people were burned because of the same, stupid, whorish logic leading to inferior game series. Like how TES was turned into trash for the console trash for the sake of money and those too stupid to know crap if they stepped in it.

That's why I mention Morrowind; like it or not Fallout III is going to have at least a wiff of Morrowind and Oblivion in it, but that may not neccessarily be a bad thing.

When they can start from Morrowind, get a shitload of feedback, then put out more hype and a game still almost as shitty (maybe even moreso given their neglectful interface release state in lieu of cashing in on horse armor), exactly what the fuck in your own little world makes you think they could pull off anything anywhere close to Fallout's depth and quality?

So Morrowind was "okay" for you. GOOD FOR YOU! You're one of a few million cockroaches that we don't care about, because you obviously CAN step in shit and be Oblivious to the smell.

Apparently, you didn't notice the differences between Daggerfall and Morrowind. That's okay, child, we know there's a lot you're Oblivious to.

I like the combat system in Fallout II, but if Bethesda comes out with a better one, and it could happen, why lambast it because "it's not Fallout?"

RT != better. Neither does anything not suited for a P&P style of gameplay. Action of TES != RPG gameplay. So if Bethesda can do a better turn-based combat system, maybe we could expect a decent space sim from Derek Smart.

Hey, with your "logic", kid, anything is possible.

I do remember people saying, not a lot of people, but still, possibly here too, that Fallout II wasn't really "Fallout" because the survivalist aspect was largely gone. Fallout II Wasteland was more 'civilized' and functional than in Fallout I, and stuff was readily availible form Vault City on.

Nice try to fake relevance. Fallout 2 wasn't as liked because it was fucking around with the setting elements. Now imagine fucked setting elements and fucked gameplay, and you'll have what people have been expecting from Bethesda since Todd Howard proved what kind of an incompetent dipshit he was with Morrowind.

The console trash calls that "innovation".

I did get tired of the tediousness of Morrowind, but it is a nice game.

To your uneducated standards, perhaps.

So I think it unfair to bemoan, and just bemoan, the 'crappy job' Bethesda is doing without seeing anything but a couple of screenshots.

Your thoughts are noted, and mocked, because what you think and what is happening in reality are two different things. Bethesda has made their reputation, and now the talent has left. Remember Rolston, one of the few who prevented Morrowind and Oblivion from sucking as bad as they could have? Do you know what happened to the "Father" of the series?

Of course you don't, you're ignorant, and you're sucking Bethesda off in that ignorance, which suits Pete, Todd, and probably Gavin just fine.

Even Trioka could make a subpar game (and I really saw greatness in Arcanum. BTW, I when the Tech path and that's REAL punishing for about 2/3 of the game), and Bethesda might do something great.

In an RPG sense, everything Troika has made has trumped Bethesda in terms of design, playability, and real definition of CRPG.

In a graphical sense, Bethesda is still a one-trick pony, and they have to go to school to learn soil erosion when a German developer can do far better with land design years before with Gothic.

Development is just begining, let's watch and wait, and THEN bash the crap out of a bad Fallout III and Bethesda if the case merits it.

Kid, development is not just beginning, learn to pay attention to the forum, the news, or anything that you could easily see for yourself if your head wasn't plugged up your ass. The time to stand for what you want is also NOT after the fact, and if Bethesda wants to shovel out their hype (again, child, read the news), then they can be told that their past work "standards" WILL NOT SUFFICE WHATSOEVER FOR FALLOUT 3.

 

[Konig15]

Dude...calm....

I loved Fallout, I loved Fallout II. I also love Star Wars and kitty cats but I'm not about to get into a barfight, virtual or otherwise over them.

Child, have you heard of 'ad homeniem'? Because you certainly do it with the best. It's where you attack someone instead of what they say. It does nothin for your argument and makes you look belligerent.

Now, I am not a Bethesda spambot, and that is what you are painting me out to be. I resent that. I want, nay, need, turn based combat back in Fallout III. I probably won't buy it if it's not. Believe me, as far as I know they didn't have ONE Fallout bigwig on staff to make sure Falllout III fits. That concerns me.

However, having sold millions of RPG related titles in the past decade, I think Bethesda deserves SOME credit. Not a lot, but some.

Now, very bluntly, there's more to gaming than the hard-core guys like you, and the hangers on like me. There's fresh meat to be had. Isometric view is garbage these days, deal with it. There are good arguments for turn based combat, SPECIAL, the perks, etc. and those I think should be retained BECAUSE THEY ENHANCE GAMEPLAY. P&P is a long way from Fallout III; it was a long way away from Fallout I, God be praised.

I have never played Ultima. I have however played Final Fantasy and haven't been back because after VI and VII, they made VIII which had all the right elements, but lacked the fun of the former two. The way any game is constructed is only important insofar as it effects the gameplayer's experience. That's why I'm against Isometric View: it only distracts. It was fine for Fallout, but we needn't go back there.

Let us agree; Morrowind is an RPG, it is not MUCH of an RPG. I played mostly with mods, so I had companions; there were none as such in the original. Walking everywhere was no fun, and a CRPG is no fun without branching diolouge. Shit I know these things, I understand your CONCERNS, just not the pessimism.

And as for the news, I'm not one to read up on the production; the only thing I'm looking at is five or six reviews to see if it's worth it.

Is Bethesda taking suggestions from us lowly players? If so tell me where and I'll tell them exactly what I want. I'll post it here to if you wish. One is I want to be able to play White, Black, Asian, and Hispanic Humans whether or not the PC can be a robot ot Supermutant or Ghoul this time around. I know how Morrowind's race system works and THAT is a good idea to put into Fallout III.

Peace Out.

 

[Per]

In fact, a swordsman was the only true effective option for most of the game.

No it wasn't. In fact, my mage was a lot more effective.

If you're both talking about my sword mage, you are correct.

P&P is a long way from Fallout III; it was a long way away from Fallout I, God be praised.

Er, no. Do your homework.

 

[Cimmerian Nights]

I have never played Ultima. I have however played Final Fantasy

This is like a wine critic claiming he's only had fanta grape. It's called credibility, and before you start talking about P&P fundamentals as if you know what they are, you should get some. You're not just talking out of your ass, you're doing it transparently.

 

[Sander]

Dude...calm....

I loved Fallout, I loved Fallout II. I also love Star Wars and kitty cats but I'm not about to get into a barfight, virtual or otherwise over them.

Child, have you heard of 'ad homeniem'? Because you certainly do it with the best. It's where you attack someone instead of what they say. It does nothin for your argument and makes you look belligerent.

Now, I am not a Bethesda spambot, and that is what you are painting me out to be. I resent that. I want, nay, need, turn based combat back in Fallout III. I probably won't buy it if it's not. Believe me, as far as I know they didn't have ONE Fallout bigwig on staff to make sure Falllout III fits. That concerns me.

However, having sold millions of RPG related titles in the past decade, I think Bethesda deserves SOME credit. Not a lot, but some.

Ehm, what RPG related titles? Morrowind and Oblivion can hardly be called RPGs, at least not in the sense that Fallout was one.

Now, very bluntly, there's more to gaming than the hard-core guys like you, and the hangers on like me.

That doesn't excuse changing Fallout's design to something it isn't.

There's fresh meat to be had. Isometric view is garbage these days, deal with it.

Oh god, not that retarded argument again.
I suggest you go read some threads from the past.
WHy exactly is it garbage? There have been *no* innovations viewpoint-wise since Fallout, so why was it great back then and garbage now?

There are good arguments for turn based combat, SPECIAL, the perks, etc. and those I think should be retained BECAUSE THEY ENHANCE GAMEPLAY.

And the isometric viewpoint doesn't?
By the way, how the hell are you going to decently implement TB combat without such a viewpoint.

P&P is a long way from Fallout III; it was a long way away from Fallout I, God be praised.

Are you fucking serious?
The *entire basis* of Fallout's design was PnP based gameplay. Fuck, man.

I have never played Ultima. I have however played Final Fantasy and haven't been back because after VI and VII, they made VIII which had all the right elements, but lacked the fun of the former two. The way any game is constructed is only important insofar as it effects the gameplayer's experience. That's why I'm against Isometric View: it only distracts. It was fine for Fallout, but we needn't go back there.

It distracts? What the hell?
Also, the way it is constructed is still an essential part of the game and the design.

Let us agree; Morrowind is an RPG, it is not MUCH of an RPG. I played mostly with mods, so I had companions; there were none as such in the original. Walking everywhere was no fun, and a CRPG is no fun without branching diolouge. Shit I know these things, I understand your CONCERNS, just not the pessimism.

This makes no sense to me.

And as for the news, I'm not one to read up on the production; the only thing I'm looking at is five or six reviews to see if it's worth it.

Is Bethesda taking suggestions from us lowly players? If so tell me where and I'll tell them exactly what I want. I'll post it here to if you wish. One is I want to be able to play White, Black, Asian, and Hispanic Humans whether or not the PC can be a robot ot Supermutant or Ghoul this time around. I know how Morrowind's race system works and THAT is a good idea to put into Fallout III.

Peace Out.

Too bad that Bethesda doesn't show any sign of life towards the fans.

 

[Roshambo]

Dude...calm....

Excuse me? You come onto my forum, don't bother to read shit, and then presume to tell us what to do?

I loved Fallout, I loved Fallout II. I also love Star Wars and kitty cats but I'm not about to get into a barfight, virtual or otherwise over them.

Then perhaps you shouldn't have started it with your ignorance. Common sense, really.

Child, have you heard of 'ad homeniem'? Because you certainly do it with the best. It's where you attack someone instead of what they say. It does nothin for your argument and makes you look belligerent.

I only do that to those who first Argue by Ignorance. Which you have done so far more than I have ad hominem. Thank you for noting what little about debate that you know of, now don't even presume to be on the same level. You haven't even bothered to do the slightest bit of research, and you're trying to argue your ignorance upon us?

That's so stupid, it's tragic.

Now, I am not a Bethesda spambot, and that is what you are painting me out to be.

If it smells like shit...

I resent that. I want, nay, need, turn based combat back in Fallout III. I probably won't buy it if it's not. Believe me, as far as I know they didn't have ONE Fallout bigwig on staff to make sure Falllout III fits. That concerns me.

Then you might have noted that instead of sucking them off like a slack-jawed moron. Sloppy technique, but that's just how Todd likes them.

You missed a spot. On the chin. No, other side.

However, having sold millions of RPG related titles in the past decade, I think Bethesda deserves SOME credit. Not a lot, but some.

However, as I noted for your stupid ass previously, the people who MADE THE GAME SELL THOSE MILLIONS are NO LONGER THERE. Now it's just a shitty has-been series modded onto X-Box with an editor. Again, thank you for Argument by Ignorance, and a rather moronic straw man argument.

Now, very bluntly, there's more to gaming than the hard-core guys like you, and the hangers on like me. There's fresh meat to be had.

On the X-Box, for morons like you. Have you cared to look at what Bethesda has said? Have you even bothered to read any of the Fallout 3 info page? Obviously not, else you couldn't make any of these stupid remarks.

Isometric view is garbage these days, deal with it. There are good arguments for turn based combat, SPECIAL, the perks, etc. and those I think should be retained BECAUSE THEY ENHANCE GAMEPLAY.

Yet, you fail to understand the elements for what they are, not because they "enhance gameplay".

Oh, and isometric was used for a reason, and not just "garbage". Amusing that you fail to note why the element was used, and instead figure on "modernizing" the game when Fallout was a breath of fresh air from the old school that DIDN'T have any trendy shit in it, and it was done well, in the 90's. Now you're being regarded as a moron that decides that what Fallout stood for doesn't matter because you're a fucking moron.

P&P is a long way from Fallout III; it was a long way away from Fallout I, God be praised.

Heh, I think even the original developers, nice as they are, would take a moment to call you the most unbelievably dumbshit person to have ever insulted their work with idiocy such as that.

I have never played Ultima.

I have played about all three dozen related Ultima games. The same with Might and Magic, Wizardry, and many more that you in your insipid understanding have no hope of competing against. Including source code likely older than you are.

I have however played Final Fantasy and haven't been back because after VI and VII, they made VIII which had all the right elements, but lacked the fun of the former two.

Those are Adventure games, not RPGs, moron.

The way any game is constructed is only important insofar as it effects the gameplayer's experience.

Yeah, so if the experience is "a tabletop RPG on computer", as the developers were intending, doesn't that make you the dumbshit?

That's why I'm against Isometric View: it only distracts. It was fine for Fallout, but we needn't go back there.

Again, your ignorance. And then you argue upon it, just like you lied about, which technically makes you an idiot.

Let us agree; Morrowind is an RPG, it is not MUCH of an RPG.

No, it isn't. There aren't any story-altering devices worth speaking about.

I played mostly with mods, so I had companions; there were none as such in the original.

Good for you.

Walking everywhere was no fun, and a CRPG is no fun without branching diolouge. Shit I know these things, I understand your CONCERNS, just not the pessimism.

Then maybe you need to get a clue and remember to water it.

And as for the news, I'm not one to read up on the production; the only thing I'm looking at is five or six reviews to see if it's worth it.

Then if you're going to post ignorant shit, you're going to be regarded as ignorant shit.

Is Bethesda taking suggestions from us lowly players?

From those experienced in the industry? No, of course not. I already told you that Rolston left, you stupid fuck. Then again, Bethesda only cares about console trash about as bright as you. Go to their forums to continue sucking them off.

If so tell me where and I'll tell them exactly what I want. I'll post it here to if you wish.

With the idiocy you've already spewed, I'm sure that "as written and styled as if by a 50's science-fiction writer, set in an alternate universe" would have to be corrected and reminded to you at every mindless "point".

One is I want to be able to play White, Black, Asian, and Hispanic Humans whether or not the PC can be a robot ot Supermutant or Ghoul this time around. I know how Morrowind's race system works and THAT is a good idea to put into Fallout III.

Except in terms of story, and you expect Bethesda to put in branching race concerns when the best they've managed to come up with yet is "Go somewhere else <hated>."

Peace Out.

You should really shut the fuck up and start reading unless you want this to get messy. Fair is fair, considering you're rude net trash that didn't bother to lurk beforehand, and so that makes you fair game.

But I bet you didn't even bother reading the rules before posting, and so I guess you've earned it.

 

[chaos_ocean]

you can be right, bulletbait, but it is we, who will make the fallout legend, and it will last for ever in our hearts. Perhaps, our "united" opinions and behaviours can lead fallout live a revolution and we can eliminate -or at least scare - the makers who "copy" the name.

The power through unity, unity through brotherhood. Fallout prevails!!!!