Fallout 2 utility Translating a mod?

[QuantumApprentice]

Last modding stream I had somebody ask me about translating a mod to their localized language, which was spanish at the time.

This amateur modder also pointed me to a BGforge translation site that's apparently working on translations for a couple of the currently available mods.
https://tra.bgforge.net/
https://github.com/BGforgeNet/msg2po

Can anybody point me to more information on how these services work? Documentation on how to use the github tools? I see they're in python, but I'm not finding anything explaining how to use them...at least not finding anything easily.

And perhaps more significantly, are there other methods of translating a mod that work better?

 

[burn]

A bit late, but... I maintain this. The system is just that you register and start translating. There's glossary, statistics, progress reports, various consistency checks, etc.
The second repo contains some tools used internally by the system to convert in and out of gettext PO format. If you're translating on https://tra.bgforge.net, you don't need to worry about those. Translations automatically flow into corresponding repos on github.

The only other alternative I know about is goold old Notepad. Some people prefer that. Which one is better, you can decide yourself.

 

[QuantumApprentice]

A bit late, but... I maintain this. The system is just that you register and start translating. There's glossary, statistics, progress reports, various consistency checks, etc.
The second repo contains some tools used internally by the system to convert in and out of gettext PO format. If you're translating on https://tra.bgforge.net, you don't need to worry about those. Translations automatically flow into corresponding repos on github.

The only other alternative I know about is goold old Notepad. Some people prefer that. Which one is better, you can decide yourself.

Hey! Thanks for letting me know! I've added a link to this forum post to my video
I showed the Notepad + Google translate method in my video, but your translate system looks very interesting.

The guy I was talking to was in Chile, and wanted to do a Spanish translation for a mod...is there a way to add a new translation job for new mods with untranslated languages? And is there a list of finished translation jobs?

 

[burn]

The guy I was talking to was in Chile, and wanted to do a Spanish translation for a mod...is there a way to add a new translation job for new mods with untranslated languages?

There is. First requirement is to have the mod on github. Then post a request on the forums, and I'll detail next steps.

And is there a list of finished translation jobs?

A translation is never finished. It's a process, part of development. Fallout 2 is still getting patches, 20 years later. Mods get updated, translations with them.
But the beauty of the system is that everything is transparent, you can see the progress for each project and each language yourself: Fallout, Infinity Engine. Along with stats, activity, etc.

 

[QuantumApprentice]

There is. First requirement is to have the mod on github. Then post a request on the forums, and I'll detail next steps.

Ah ok, so it's a permission based system on a private server? Do you have a vetting process? or is it just informal?
If somebody wanted to start a translation of one of the bigger known mods (like Nevada, Sonora or Yesterday) would that be possible?
(I'm unaware if these have githubs)

A translation is never finished. It's a process, part of development. Fallout 2 is still getting patches, 20 years later. Mods get updated, translations with them.

lol of course, of course, but is there a way for people to sort through and find the most up to date translation for a specific mod and download it? Or do you have a separate repository for "completed" translations that are matched to the mod version they were translated for?

Sorry, navigating the sight is a little confusing.

 

[Lexx]

(I'm unaware if these have githubs)

Sadly they don't. There is a discord group for the Sonora translation, but the translation itself is closed-source, which kinda pisses me off. Let some drama happen or people lose motivation and all the progress done with the translation will disappear into the abyss.

This kind of work really should be done open source and not behind locked doors.

 

[burn]

Ah ok, so it's a permission based system on a private server? Do you have a vetting process? or is it just informal?
If somebody wanted to start a translation of one of the bigger known mods (like Nevada, Sonora or Yesterday) would that be possible?
(I'm unaware if these have githubs)

Not sure what do you mean by "permission based". There are permissions, but they are largely unused.
The vetting is just that I decide whether you actually going to translate stuff or waste my time and then never get anything done.
I actually did suggest to use it for Nevada, but folks didn't get into it. Oh well, like I said, if you prefer Notepad, more power to you.

lol of course, of course, but is there a way for people to sort through and find the most up to date translation for a specific mod and download it? Or do you have a separate repository for "completed" translations that are matched to the mod version they were translated for?

Each one is most up to date. Translations flow to mod repos in github, continuously. When a mod is released, translations are with it.

 

[QuantumApprentice]

Sadly they don't. There is a discord group for the Sonora translation, but the translation itself is closed-source, which kinda pisses me off. Let some drama happen or people lose motivation and all the progress done with the translation will disappear into the abyss.

This kind of work really should be done open source and not behind locked doors.

* I agree

Not sure what do you mean by "permission based".

lol I forgot the crowd I was in, I meant new projects need your permission, as opposed to just a registration or something.

I actually did suggest to use it for Nevada, but folks didn't get into it. Oh well, like I said, if you prefer Notepad, more power to you.

Sadly that makes it sound like translators would be forced to use notepad and would be unable to use your system in any meaningful way?

Translations flow to mod repos in github, continuously.

oh that's frickin sweet!

 

[Lexx]

Sadly that makes it sound like translators would be forced to use notepad and would be unable to use your system in any meaningful way?

This is one of the limitations of the system that I don't like. You are forced to translate via the web interface - and it's always line by line, so you lack context that might be important at times.

Some easier "big file editing" feature that allows more freedom would be nice.

 

[burn]

lol I forgot the crowd I was in, I meant new projects need your permission, as opposed to just a registration or something.

It takes some work to set things up, not sure how do you imagine that to go with just registration.
It's open source though, you can set up your own instance and do whatever you like there.

Sadly that makes it sound like translators would be forced to use notepad and would be unable to use your system in any meaningful way?

I don't understand what you mean.

This is one of the limitations of the system that I don't like. You are forced to translate via the web interface - and it's always line by line, so you lack context that might be important at times.

Some easier "big file editing" feature that allows more freedom would be nice.

The system shows nearby strings, and there's a link to the original file which you can review in case of doubts, and there's Zen mode.
And this argument can really apply to any translation, can't it? Even when using Notepad, it's not always clear how the strings are used (which is why SFSE has a recent feature to show dialog trees, if I'm not mistaken).
Just taking numbers alone, hosted weblate has hundreds of projects, translated into dozens, possibly hundreds of languages. If you add private installations, I think it's safe to say that hundreds of thousands of people use weblate. Companies pay good money to use it for their products. Why do you think is that? Maybe the issue you're talking about isn't that big of an issue?


BGforge installation was initially set up for my own needs. Releasing UPU/RPU as they are now simply wouldn't be possible without a translation system. There's a dozen projects there now, and a dozen languages, so about a hundred translations going. That's umanageable with Notepad and forum/Discord gatherings. It took some work to get it all running, but it paid off a dozen times over.
So, just to be clear:
1. I'm not looking to "expand the reach" in any way. If you're happy with Notepad, that's great, keep translations coming!
2. The system does come with certain limitations.
3. Modders who want to use it may put in a request.

 

[Lexx]

Companies pay good money to use it for their products. Why do you think is that?

As someone who is working in a big company, they usually buy into every kinds of things. The bossman doesn't care if the actual users have issues with the software.

Maybe the issue you're talking about isn't that big of an issue?

Never said it is a big issue. It's an issue that I don't like.


Keep in mind that I don't care how other people translate their stuff. I have zero emotions towards this, unless it's done in closed source with a tiny team that wants to earn big attention for their work.

 

[burn]

Well, it's not just companies. I mean, I literally linked an instance with hundreds of projects powered by thousands of volunteers.

Keep in mind that I don't care how other people translate their stuff.

I'm with you on that. Most important is that work actually gets done. I do think that there are better ways than using previous century tech, though .

 

[QuantumApprentice]

It takes some work to set things up, not sure how do you imagine that to go with just registration.

I think my understanding of the system is somewhat limited and I may be misunderstanding what you're saying since...

It's open source though, you can set up your own instance and do whatever you like there.

Is this (https://github.com/BGforgeNet/msg2po) the github for the open source part of this project?
If somebody were to compile this and run it on their own server would the have their own weblate for translations?

I don't understand what you mean.

Yeah I left out a couple of words: "makes it sound like translators for some mods that don't use github would be forced to use notepad"...as opposed to being able to set up a new independent translation and just generating the .msg files separately.

1. I'm not looking to "expand the reach" in any way. If you're happy with Notepad, that's great, keep translations coming!
2. The system does come with certain limitations.
3. Modders who want to use it may put in a request.

What limitations have you found with this system?

 

[burn]

Weblate is open source. The other repo is just glue code for msg files, also open.
There are no translation tools that support msg files. So you want something better than notepad you'll need to convert to some industry standard. And then back, when translated.
As for limitations, you can just try translating yourself.

 

[QuantumApprentice]

Weblate is open source. The other repo is just glue code for msg files, also open

Awesome thanks!

As for limitations, you can just try translating yourself.

Well I was hoping for your opinion from your experience, but I'll go ahead and try and use the tool myself since you suggested it

 

[QuantumApprentice]

As for limitations, you can just try translating yourself.

Ok so I created an account and tried translating the French section of the Fallout/Fixt mod. I only did about 30 lines so it's easy to clean up my mess if you don't like them...but I noticed something.
The first lines to translate were the standard intro movie subtitles for Fallout 1.
Earlier today I dug out the actual French subtitles that came with the Steam install.
This may be something of a unique situation, but how would I go about submitting the entire NARRATE.TXT text file as a translation?

On another note, when I was using the weblate translation tool, I noticed the lines of translation were generally divided up into sections separated by commas, but the original dialogue does not (as seen above).
Is this intentional? Or just one of the limitations of weblate?


One line was split into five sections:

If this isn't intentional, how would somebody trying to translate this be able to tell weblate to put these lines together again? (I imagine this would help when verbs and subjects need to be re-arranged to match different language structures.)
Though it's interesting to note that the equivalent line in the original French translation (Line 10) is actually two sentences with a colon in the middle of the second sentence...the added line appears to be: "Tout le monde n'aurait alors qu'une seule idée en tête :" - roughly "The world had only one idea in mind:"

Assuming this is the best possible way to translate this line (I have no idea myself, I'm just assuming), how would a translator suggest this edit?

 

[burn]

I don't think it's from narrate.txt. See Source Information.
(Some text duplicates in Fallout files).
And I don't think you want to start translating Fixt into French from scratch.

There are some cases where unit-based translation gets weird. Mostly in holodisks, where text has to be aligned properly. I might look into excluding those.

 

[QuantumApprentice]

I don't think it's from narrate.txt. See Source Information.

I dunno for sure, but this is what the link under source information points to:
https://github.com/BGforgeNet/fallo...ster/english/data/text/english/cuts/intro.sve

And I don't think you want to start translating Fixt into French from scratch.

lol I tend to agree, but my intent wasn't specifically to translate, it was to gain an understanding how the system works.
I'd like to make a video covering it for other modders who might be interested.
You're welcome to delete my contributions, especially in light that they may just be duplicate text.