Best Combat Builds

Discussion in 'General Fallout Discussion' started by Yoshi525, Feb 22, 2011.

  1. Yoshi525

    Yoshi525 Vault Senior Citizen
    Orderite

    Dec 10, 2006
    This has been done before but not for a while (plus there seem to be a fair few foke fairly new to Fallout and Fallout 2). Based on a single weapon, what are the most effective late game builds in both games?

    Fallout

    Power Fist

    Surprising? With an agility of 10, Fast Shot, Bonus HtH Attacks and eventually Slayer as essentials. Power Fist attacks cost 1 AP (the Super Sledgehammer is a better weapon damage wise, however I don't think Bonus HtH works on melee weapons and the knockback attribute gets annoying). Optional extras include: Better Criticals, (2) Action Boy(s) and (2) Bonus Move. Actually, provided Agility is good, Bonus Move > Action Boy for this. Overall this can mean 12 instant critical hits, i.e. you can wipe the floor with anything.

    Minigun (and normally to a lesser extent, the Gattling Laser)

    Impractical, as it requires the Sniper perk - takes ages to get in Fallout. However Fast Shot + Bonus Rate of Fire + Action Boy (2) + Sniper (with luck >7) + Better Criticals = carnage. Bonus ranged damage is very good here as well. There are lots of perk permutations in this build, but providing you have good luck, I think this tops it in terms of damage administration. Not saying it's practical though. You can fire thrice in the first round of combat.

    Turbo Plasma Rifle

    Much the same setup as for minigun, only you can potentially fire it 6 times - a lot better than the F2 version. Same for the Alien Blaster, which does more damage but at the expense of having a terrible range. Generally inferior to the first two in terms of damage, easier and more practical to play though.


    Fallout 2

    Unarmed weapons cannot become faster than 2 AP to use, which makes them all distinctly inferior to ranged weapons. Also, stuff is better at killing you in F2 - making HtH harder (though with Prizefighter and power armour it is very possible to tank the whole game).

    Vindicator minigun/ Avenger/ Bozar

    As with minigun in F1, though getting Sniper in a normal game is worlds more realistic, making this build a lot more likely. This can do some brutal damage, and if used correctly The Enclave + Navarro becomes a doddle, even on the hardest difficulties. The availability of ammunition makes this a difficult weapon of choice to use often though. The Avenger minigun and Bozar become far more practical. The Avenger is the Vindicators equal against some opponents (if you invest in bonus ranged damage anyway), however it still lacks a bit of a punch (relatively speaking - it doesn't matter a whole lot with Sniper) against power armour. The Bozar uses cheap ammunition with great modifiers, fires less bullets and still nails virtually everything, making it the most practical of the three. Nothing comes close to competing with this damage wise.

    Gauss Pistol (and rifle)

    When you have Sniper and good luck, this seems superior to the rifle in my eyes. 6, ludicrously accurate, high-probability-of-critical hits, within a massive range. Armour (apart from the Boss'), provides little relief.

    Pulse Rifle

    Distinctly superior to the turbo plasma rifle, basically a slow alien blaster with much better range. Lots of damage, and again most armour won't be a problem. Still seems inferior to the Gauss Pistol though.

    End Boss Plasma Gun

    Of no consequence, seeing as you have completed the game. Had to include it though, I mean it'd basically a turbo plasma rifle with burst capability :lol:

    Other notable weapons:-

    F1

    1) .223 Pistol - best small gun in the original, decent range, good damage, owns most armour, style.

    2) RR LE BB Gun - inferior to 1), but deserves a mention. Fires quick, massive clip, good damage, not so great armour penetration. Shooting children and Gizmo with it are fun past times.

    3) Hunting Rifle - with a refined ability to land bullets in peoples eyes, one can finish the game with this no problems. Unless you have 12 AP, this is better than the Sniper rifle IMO.

    4) Death Satchel - Get a bag from Junktown and store all the spare explosives in it. Activate detonators, drop next to target, run. Bang.

    F2

    1) Those from F1, although they are eclipsed by better weapons - Gauss weaponry is miles ahead of other small guns really.

    2) FN FAL HPFA - strange and fairly uncommon assault rifle, as a single shot weapon, it's superior to all of the assault rifles except the H&K G11(E) and (maybe?) the XL70E3. Does have one feature that (arguably) sets it above all other (non gauss) small guns though, that being the bullets fired per burst - 20. It has a faster rate of fire than all other bullet weapons bar miniguns (even the HK P90c and Bozar!). It's ammo has the same DR mod as the 4.7mm used by the H&K G11, though a weaker damage mod. 5mm ammo, as used by the XL70E3, has weak mods in comparison. Because if this I'd say that the FN FAL HPFA is up there with the H&K G11E as the best assault rifle (don't recall if the later is technically an SMG, don't think it is), it's also superior to all SMG's and shotguns (Pancor Jackhammer is still a very good gun though). Small guns running on .223 or 2mm are it's only out right superiors.

    3) Needler Pistol - Actually a decent gun if you can get the AP ammo (which isn't really AP, just double damage).

    4) Robot rocket launcher - For a rocket launcher, it has poor damage. It also requires only 3 AP and has a 'clip' of 6, think Fast Shot + Bonus Rate of Fire + Sniper....evil laugh. A rather exoensive AP rocket habit though.

    Just my two pence, be interested to here peoples opinions, especially with regards to the FN FAL HPFA, which I only realized was decent on a recent play through. I feel that assault rifles are underrated by some, not in F1 as there is only one and it's poor-mediocre for what it is. In F2 there is a bunch, of which the FN FAL HPFA, XL70E3, H&K G11 and H&K G11E are all amongst the better small guns around.

    Small Guns Rankings

    Top Class: Gauss Pistol, gauss rifle.
    Second class: H&K G11E, FN FAL HPFA, .223 pistol.
    Third class: H&K G11, needler pistol, pancor jackhammer, HK P90c, sniper rifle, scoped hunting rifle.
    Fourth class: H&K CAWS, combat shotgun (unquestionably inferior, though by a small margin), grease gun, FN FAL (with nighsight), .44 magnum (with speedloader), RR LE BB Gun.

    You could probably argue for the .223 rifles, pancor and LE BB gun to be moved up a class in many circumstances.
     
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  2. LinkPain

    LinkPain Mildly Dipped

    540
    Jan 18, 2011
    Why not Super Sledge on the list ?
    Sure , HtH Evade does not apply on it but it has a range of 2 with almost the same low ap cost . And that thing more literally clears the floor with enemies . I killed Deathclaws much easier with that than Power or Megapower fists . Knocking them off map makes space for you and destroys their ap by knocking them out or making them run to you again and again .

    EDIT: Bonus HtH work on Super Sledge .
    But :"...hit for 2...was killed.Unfortunately his spine is now visible." does not work . At least they fly away like Goku hit them . Ballistic Fist is crap compared to previous unarmed and melee .
     
  3. Yoshi525

    Yoshi525 Vault Senior Citizen
    Orderite

    Dec 10, 2006
    With regards to F1, you may be correct about Bonus HtH working for the SS, I don't recall. Pros/cons:

    Super Sledge

    + Best damage of any HtH weapon
    + Knockback
    + Range = 2
    + No ammo
    - Knockback

    Seems a clear winner right? In F2 it is the clear winner, however in the original I would argue otherwise - I find by the end that the knockback feature is more a hindrance. Your main enemies are super mutants, most of whom attack from range. When you are fighting deathclaws, you can take them on one at a time - if you have decent armour and either weapon, the battle should be easy. Knocking them back is an advantage, but an unnecessary one. It's unlikely you will kill a super mutant in one hit, even with slayer. I'd prefer by range-based opponent to stay in front of me, take a second hit and die - rather than going backwards, requiring me to close the distance (which can be substantial). Don't get me wrong, both are good - I feel that the powerfist makes for a smoother fight in Mariposa and under the cathedral.

    In F2 there are some circumstances when mega power fist > the sledge, others where the converse is true. As you mentioned, deathclaw packs (and most encounters on the desert strip NE of SF) are best dealt with using a hammer. MPF is better against the Enclave however. For a start, every extra but of damage helps and once again knockback ends up pissing me off somewhat.
     
  4. LinkPain

    LinkPain Mildly Dipped

    540
    Jan 18, 2011
    Thanks . And you're right , Sledge usually works best on melee enemies . Knocking around Enclave troopers who carry gauss pistols in Fallout 2 , just so they can get up and shoot you again is not good thing . There we prefer hand to hand diplomatic relations and solutions :D

    But one thing more . I think MPF applies dmg based on a weapon itself , not the unarmed skill like a basic punch does .
    So a costly 8 ap (9 with aiming) punch which has highly boosted critical chance because of unarmed skill (only on high level , 150%+) can literally obliterate everything , even Frank Horrigan in one or 2 hits . But it's very costly . I don't think it applies on a Power Fist like that .
    There's a list of upgraded kicks and punches on Vault , higher levels have really brutal critical chance .
     
  5. Bf109

    Bf109 First time out of the vault

    20
    Jul 13, 2010
    My copy of FO1 when I played it was bugged (didn't have an Internet connection back then), Bonus Move didn't work correctly (turn ended automatically after using up the "normal" AP, even if you had the "extra" movement points left), and knockback worked everywhere BUT in the Boneyard deathclaw nest. Said deathclaws also ALWAYS got the first turn regardless of my character's stats (IIRC you'd normally beat them in sequencing at about PE 7 or so).

    One thing that was cool about FO1 was the weapons selection/balance, automatic weapons progression (SMG/AR to minigun) increased rate of fire more than single shot damage and you could build a specialist "machine gunner" character...Bonus Ranged Damage was REALLY useful in FO1, two levels of it roughly doubled the damage you could do with SMG or Minigun...That became totally useless in FO2, what with Vindicators and Bozars doing 25+ damage per single round...

    One combat buid that has worked very well for me in FO2 (with it's progressive skill point cost and relative abundance of fast-firing weapons like 44mag etc.):

    Gifted, One Hander, AG 10, LK 6 for Better Crits perk, ST 5 for 44 magnum early on, 3 for a Hth character or 4 for something inbetween (hth till Reno, greasegun/p90 from then on) , IN and PE high for skill points and shooting accuracy, EN low, CH...depends

    The 20% onehander bonus really helps once your skills get over 100, that 20% seems to cost about 3-4 level's worth of SP (50-60?) at high skill levels! Most of the fast-firing (4AP) weapons in FO2 are pistols/SMG's so with high enough skill a "pistolero" character can get 2 called shots in a turn even early on.

    Or...put first few level's SP's into either Unarmed or Melee, the let Sullivan train you for another 10 SP's in Klamath...At level 3-4, you're now a ninja...It also makes sense to put a few SP into Throwing, since thanks to the bonus it's "almost usable" from getgo.
     
  6. valcik

    valcik So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs

    Dec 20, 2008
    About a melee weapon:
    The Ripper is my favourite toy, due to a bonus for chance to inflict a critical hit. (It needs an ammo though, that's the only disadvantage.)
     
  7. LinkPain

    LinkPain Mildly Dipped

    540
    Jan 18, 2011
    One Hander trait doesn't apply on legs in Fallout 2 , in fact it even lowers the hit chance . That's why i go Aikido Steven Seagal style with hands .
    But what it does to pistols like Gauss ... man , rifle range hit for 95% . Gauss Pistol itself has a beautiful range but .223 Pistol could almost do like it with that trait . H&K G11 isn't considered a one handed weapon btw .
     
  8. Export

    Export First time out of the vault

    23
    Feb 10, 2011
    Well I think I just found the best weapon in New Vegas. I forget the name, it's something like PN-3 (basically numbers and letters) but it's a plasma weapon that uses 4 ammo per shot (that's one of the disadvantages). It easily one-shots Deathclaws with a headshot and has a zoom function. It does over 100 damage per shot. I used to think doing around 50 damage a shot was something to get excited about.

    That said, I haven't tried out melee or unarmed yet - I hope it's good because I'm planning to do Hardcore with one of those two styles since I don't want to get weighed down with ammo. If I switched my current game to Hardcore now, I'd probably weigh about 3 tons.
     
  9. LinkPain

    LinkPain Mildly Dipped

    540
    Jan 18, 2011
    YCS/186 ?
    Unique Gauss , hell of a weapon :)