Bitter Mormons vs. republicans.

[welsh]

Did I not say that a Mormon could not be president, at least this time around?

Mormons

Gnashing their teeth
Feb 21st 2008 | WASHINGTON, DC
From The Economist print edition

The latter-day saints are angry with the Republicans

“POLYGAMY”, the comedian Stephen Colbert quipped, “comes from the Greek ‘poly’ meaning multiple and ‘gamy’, meaning reasons not to vote for Mitt Romney.” Now that the Mormon former governor of Massachusetts has abandoned the race and endorsed John McCain, will the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints—an important voting-group in several states—follow his lead?

Colbert is great.
Note that Colbert things that the Mormons shouldn' apologize for polygamy

Utah, the centre of the Mormon universe, preferred George Bush to John Kerry by 46 points in 2004. But Mormons took a beating during Mr Romney's run. In a Pew poll from December, a quarter of Americans and 36% of white evangelicals expressed reservations about voting for one. A study from Vanderbilt University concluded that conservative Christians cited unrelated concerns about Mr Romney to mask their discomfort with his faith.

Which goes to show you Mormons- if you want a party with someone who might respect your faith, you got to go Democrats. After all we got Protestants, Catholics, Jews, Athiests, Rationalists, and lots of hippy New Age - Age of Aquarius wannabes. Even some Pagan chicks who are into freaky sex. Not only can the Democrats embrace the Mormons, but we might even be willing to deal with the whole in-the-closet polygamy thing.

Mormons naturally invested in Mr Romney, donating to his campaign and voting for him in droves: 90% of Utah Republicans plumped for him. Half of Mr Romney's supporters in the Nevada caucuses, which he won convincingly, were from his church.

Which might be why Mitch 'Flip-Flop' Romney won big in the states that he lived in.

Mike Huckabee took Iowa and the South, however, areas filled with evangelicals whom Mr Romney needed to win. “In Utah you could almost hear the wailing and gnashing of teeth,” says Kirk Jowers, head of the University of Utah's Hinckley Institute of Politics. In a poll taken just after Mr Romney left the race, only 30% of Utahns said they would vote for Mr McCain; 25% said they would choose Barack Obama.

Which, Mormons, says a lot. YOu take a poll of cracker white Southern Republicans who spend their Saturday Nights burning crosses in front of Black folks, and they'd rather vote for Barrack (ok, so he's really only half black) than a Mormon.

That says a lot.

Utah's political pundits agree that the conservative state will prefer Mr McCain. But the margin may be smaller as some Romneyites switch sides or stay at home. In other Mormon-rich states, particularly Nevada, which is a swing state, depressed Mormon turnout could hurt Mr McCain a lot more.

You can almost hear the angels in the Tabernacle sing-
"All we are saying... Give barrack a chance....."

Much depends on the Democratic nominee. Hillary Clinton is reviled; Mr Obama is not. Much also depends on Mr McCain's eventual running-mate. Many Mormons believe Mr Huckabee used Mr Romney's faith against him, as when the former Baptist minister asked a reporter “Don't Mormons believe that Jesus and the devil are brothers?” If Mr Huckabee is on the Republican ticket, there could be a latter-day revolt.

Satan and Jesus buddies?

This guy-

and that guy

Say it ain't so!

 

[Zeal]

Pagan chicks with freaky sex! omg sign me in :O


No, really, you still believe in polls?

 

[welsh]

No, I suspect that Obama will beat Clinton in Ohio and Texas- but it might be close.

 

[xdarkyrex]

no one likes mormons.

 

[welsh]

That's not true. I like Mormons. I have a few mormon friends. Ok, so what if they wear holy underwear. I mean I have Sikh friends who do all sorts of goofy shit and their cool.

No, its not that everyone hates mormons. Its that some folks won't tolerate religious difference.

Sorry to say it, but that's the problem for the Mormons and the Republican party. The Republican's social conservative wing wants more church and state, but its their church and state, not a state that tolerates all faiths.

Proof- The Huckster.

 

[xdarkyrex]

Christian conservatives suck at social tolerance.

 

[The Vault Dweller]

Christian conservatives suck at social tolerance.

What's sad is that they're supposed to advance it of all things.

Sincerely,
The Vault Dweller

 

[welsh]

They can't. Its not part of their agenda. How can you be pro-life, pro-death, anti-gay and wrap yourself in the flag and still be tolerant of otehrs. Worse yet, the conservatives play on social fear and promote social division.

This is why, I think, Obama is strong. McCain plays to the Republican base- the wealthy (tax cuts sustained) and the evengelical Christians (socially conservative) and the fearful. Hilary plays heavy to working class and middle class voters but is also supported by special interests. But Obama draws his money from small donations from regular folks. He's less support by special interests and draws his finance and support from a broad cross section.

For the past few decades, politics has been bsed on winning a majority, not winning the mass. If you win the majority you need only pay off those factions within the majority that really matter and merely continue to scar those that don't matter into supporting you. This is the 51% solution. You should win a bare majority and nothing more. Because if you win more, you might need to do more than you have to. Its only 51% to win.

WIth Obama, I think its different. He's not playing that game. Instead he's reaching out to a broader slew of society. In the end, he's going to have to make choices. "How do you stand on a woman's right to choose vs right to life?" - that question is coming. "How do you feel about gun control" or "how do you feel about gay rights or the sanctity of marriage." Those are divisive issues and he won't be able to duck them.

Which is unfortunate because, essentially, those are bullshit issues. What really matters is- how are we going to deal with global warming, how are we going to repair the economic infrastructure? How are we going to prevent recession and undertake economic reform? How will we reduce social inequality?

So far the election has emphasized the later issues- a nice change. But as the election draws near it will be the devisive ones that come up.

 

[Ah-Teen]

Christian conservatives suck at social tolerance.

Yeah, sucks.

And yes according to christianity(not just mormons) the devil is the brother of jesus...

If more christians actually took the time to read their own damn book they'd realize this.

I only hammer this point, to point out how idiotic a lot of christian conservatives are.

 

[xdarkyrex]

What, where in the hell does the bible say that?

I don't remember that.

Lucifer was like #1 angel up n heaven and tried to start a rebellion and take gods position, but there was no relation between Lucifer and god other than one being creator of the other (but not father), and then god cast Lucifer and the rebellious devils down to the earth as fallen angels.

...then some time later Jesus was born to the virgin Mary in a fucking manger in Bethlehem and being artificially inseminated by an angel with a magic touch (but the magic teleporting semen was not the angels, it was indeed gods).

I fail to see which part of that makes them into brothers, unless you mean half brothers or blood brothers somehow in the same vein as Odin and Loki?

I'ma need an excerpt if you are right, and if you got one I will gladly agree and renounce my false perception of Christianity (lol as if it matters)

According to the first result on google:

The Mormon teaching that Jesus and Satan are brothers is based on their concept of God being the Father of all pre-existent spirits. Since Jesus is the son of the Father and all other spirits, including Satan, are sons and daughters of the Father then all are brothers and sisters! This idea has been part of Mormon teaching from the time of Joseph Smith and continues today. Few LDS authorities have been bold enough to plainly state this.

That sounds like a cop out to me, neither actually believes them to be brothers, as "father of all things" is a metaphor, he didnt literally give birth to them.

Jesus is no more the brother of Satan than he is the brother of me.

 

[Ah-Teen]

What, where in the hell does the bible say that?

I don't remember that.

Lucifer was like #1 angel up n heaven and tried to start a rebellion and take gods position, but there was no relation between Lucifer and god other than one being creator of the other (but not father), and then god cast Lucifer and the rebellious devils down to the earth as fallen angels.

...then some time later Jesus was born to the virgin Mary in a fucking manger in Bethlehem and being artificially inseminated by an angel with a magic touch (but the magic teleporting semen was not the angels, it was indeed gods).

I fail to see which part of that makes them into brothers, unless you mean half brothers or blood brothers somehow in the same vein as Odin and Loki?

I'ma need an excerpt if you are right, and if you got one I will gladly agree and renounce my false perception of Christianity (lol as if it matters)

According to the first result on google:

The Mormon teaching that Jesus and Satan are brothers is based on their concept of God being the Father of all pre-existent spirits. Since Jesus is the son of the Father and all other spirits, including Satan, are sons and daughters of the Father then all are brothers and sisters! This idea has been part of Mormon teaching from the time of Joseph Smith and continues today. Few LDS authorities have been bold enough to plainly state this.

That sounds like a cop out to me, neither actually believes them to be brothers, as "father of all things" is a metaphor, he didnt literally give birth to them.

Jesus is no more the brother of Satan than he is the brother of me.

Foxes and cats cannot possibly be related on any level because their testicals are placed in to very different spots....

Yeah, thats about what you just said.

According to mormons(and the old testament, but that doesn't matter anymore except when bashing gays), spirits are the literal children of god. Born of male and female parents. Yes god does have a wife, its right there if you look.

I'm not going to look it up unless you reaaally piss me off because I have better things to do than thumb through a really bad drama story written and re-written, and raped up the ass thousands of years ago.

I garente I've had more god banter than you and living though it sucked.

Google is not a signifigant source of religious information and should be use for technical issues and porn.

Few LDS authorities have been bold enough to plainly state this.

Only whispered in every Sunday school class ages 6-months to death. Your googleing has lead you to religious nuts who hate mormons. Poor source but good for laughs if you actually know what mormons are hawking.

PS they don't play basket ball in the temple naked ether.

PSS Fucking awsome sig ^,,^

 

[xdarkyrex]

God never had a wife in modern Christianity (and the modern Catholic edited bible). If you want to debate the paganistic roots of Christianity prior to the rise of the Catholic church, this is clearly a very different discussion.

Praise the LORD! Praise the LORD from the heavens, praise him in the heights! Praise him, all his angels, praise him, all his host! Praise him, sun and moon, praise him, all you shining stars! Praise him, you highest heavens, and you waters above the heavens! Let them praise the name of the LORD! For he commanded and they were created. And he established them for ever and ever; he fixed their bounds which cannot be passed.Praise the LORD from the earth, you sea monsters and all deeps, fire and hail, snow and frost, stormy wind fulfilling his command! Mountains and all hills, fruit trees and all cedars! Beasts and all cattle, creeping things and flying birds! Kings of the earth and all peoples, princes and all rulers of the earth! Young men and maidens together, old men and children! Let them praise the name of the LORD, for his name alone is exalted; his glory is above earth and heaven. He has raised up a horn for his people, praise for all his saints, for the people of Israel who are near to him. Praise the LORD! (Psalm 148)

The fact is that Mormons use the King James old testament, where in fact god has no wife, there is only one god, and that one god is divided into three divine forms, the holy Trinity. So, in reference to MODERN Christinaity, the monotheistic god is the only being to preclude the spirits that exist in heaven and as such is a creator and not a literal father of said spirits. There is obvious debate over this based on interpretations and what-not, but the common interpretation is of a single god, no wife, no other gods, no other progenitors of creation.