Civilian Vs Military and Energy weapons in general

fenrir1536

First time out of the vault
I know that Fallout 3 and Fallout 4 have really muddied this but is their any official stance on this?

I know that the BATFL is a joke but from an in-universe perspective either laser weapons had been around for a while before the bombs fell or they were so significant on the civilian market that the ATF was adjusted to account for them in a significant way.

On top of that what were civilian energy weapons? Is the wattz series of pistols and rifles basically the civilian market guns while the AERXX series are the military pistols and rifles?

Plasma is just a mess from a lore perspective, here is my understanding.

-Plasma Casters have origins as re-purposed industrial equipment near the end of the war
-Compact and purpose built P-94 from Tactics looks like an plausable military weapon
-Urban Plasma Rifles/Pistols (Fo3/NV) look post-war manfactured
-Urban Plasma Rifles/Pistols (Fo4) manufactured weapons and seen on trade magazines

This is my headcannon reconciliation for the real reason of differing art teams and emphasis of design because fuck it why not.

Lasers are not that complicated, the wattz 1000/2000 series is a civilian market laser rifle and pistol which is either old decommissioned military pattern (think M1A/AR-15 etc.) or straight to civilian market firearm. The AERXX series are the current military combat troop equipment and side arm, most rear units and home defense are still using conventional firearms because of existing pre-resource war era stocks and existing logistical supply chains. (explains conventional gun prevalence post-war while lasers still supplanting)

Plasma is way more difficult to reconcile but here is how I see it. Plasma casters although powerful have significant drawbacks on the battlefield being hugely heavy and bulty, only seen with early power armor units before a crash program to produce a real weapon is introduced. The P-94 Rifle was that crash programs' result in scaled down version of the caster, less powerful but more portable with limited service before the great war.

The Urban variant is a completely independent design that accomplished the same task. The design seen in Fallout 4 is the actually pre-war manufactured version of the urban plasma rifle, with its own ammunition and much more solidly constructed design. (not sure why they are in the commonwealth...proximity Canada to put down possible rebellion I guess) The version we see in Fallout3/NV is the Enclave post-war attempt at the same design, similar but more hodgepodge construction and reliant on much more common MFC to power the weapon. its as if they had the real designs and specifications but had to adapt them to fit what they could power/build.

Thinking on it now the nature of plasma weapon development and how much of a cluster fuck it is reflects how desperate the pre war united states would be for any significant military advantage. As the resources dried up and the world went to hell they would scramble for any "miracle weapon" which works in this lore mess of different developers' visions. lol

Pulse guns are a wholly post-war Enclave developed weapon system. I always found their absence in Fallout 3 to be really baffling, they even fit in really well ascetically with Bethesda doubling down on the 50's scifi-future ascetic and the technological superiority of the faction...just odd they weren't there.

I haven't played every fallout game to completion so if I have any gaps or if you have your own ideas let me know. IDK why but this has always both bothered me and fascinated me about these games.
 
Oh yeah your totally right the New Vegas gun was a prototype right? So the YKXX guns from Fallout 2 would be the production version of the concept I guess.
 
I was under the impression that the P-94 was an military weapon based on a type of industrial equipment, which begs the question: what would a piece of equipment that shoots superheated globs of matter be used for in the industry?
 
I was under the impression that the P-94 was an military weapon based on a type of industrial equipment, which begs the question: what would a piece of equipment that shoots superheated globs of matter be used for in the industry?
The only thing I can think about plasma and industry in the real world are plasma torches (they are plasma blowtorches) but I am no expert on plasma and never looked for more information about how it can be used in industry.

Maybe for mining, instead of using explosives or for dismantling heavy vehicles like tanks or stuff like that?

Just a couple of ideas :confused:
 
The only thing I can think about plasma and industry in the real world are plasma torches (they are plasma blowtorches) but I am no expert on plasma and never looked for more information about how it can be used in industry.

Maybe for mining, instead of using explosives or for dismantling heavy vehicles like tanks or stuff like that?

Just a couple of ideas :confused:

Plasma torches are used for cutting, the p-94 would leave a chunk of hot, melted material. Not very pratic for dismantling.
And on mining, probably the some problem, it would leave a half-melted chunk of rock. Explosives would work better, I think.
 
Plasma torches are used for cutting, the p-94 would leave a chunk of hot, melted material. Not very pratic for dismantling.
And on mining, probably the some problem, it would leave a half-melted chunk of rock. Explosives would work better, I think.

Well plasma can't melt anything besides flesh and robots, as shown in all Fallouts.

PLASMA IS FALLOUT IS A LIEEEE
 
This just goes to show how plasma weapons are such a convoluted mess.

The Winchester P-94 isn't a military weapon, it's an industrial grade weapon.

It seems that the P-94 is a general code for the industrial equipment derived plasma weapons instead of an actual designation. The Winchester P-94/Turbo models are the Big Guns variant of the gun while the Whinchester P-94 Military is scaled down rifle variant seen in Fallout Tactics.

Actually, NV establishes that the urban plasma rifle was created pre-war by Repconn Aerospace.

I basically said that in my post. My only qualifier is that the Fallout 3/NV version looks more like a Enclave redesign to take advantage of more plentiful MFCs rather then the rare plasma cartridges seen in Fallout 4. It helps explain the similar but different designs, appearance in magazines, and more haphazard look to the Fallout 3/NV of the design.
 
On the subject of plasma, the ShoddyCast did a really good video about why plasma weapons "make no god damn sense." I don't have the link, but you guys should Google it. It's really good.
 
fenrir1536 said:
I basically said that in my post. My only qualifier is that the Fallout 3/NV version looks more like a Enclave redesign to take advantage of more plentiful MFCs rather then the rare plasma cartridges seen in Fallout 4. It helps explain the similar but different designs, appearance in magazines, and more haphazard look to the Fallout 3/NV of the design.
No, in NV it shows that the pre-war model created by REPCONN Aerospace uses MFC. As for FO4 and the previously unheard of "Plasma cartridges" it doesn't adhere to any kind of previously established lore. And really, I, and most others here consider FO4 non-canon. And also, for the record, before Bethesda got their hands on the IP, the lore on plasma weapons wasn't so messed up. Obsidian tried to fix it in NV, but Beth went and fucked it up again in FO4
 
No, in NV it shows that the pre-war model created by REPCONN Aerospace uses MFC. As for FO4 and the previously unheard of "Plasma cartridges" it doesn't adhere to any kind of previously established lore. And really, I, and most others here consider FO4 non-canon. And also, for the record, before Bethesda got their hands on the IP, the lore on plasma weapons wasn't so messed up. Obsidian tried to fix it in NV, but Beth went and fucked it up again in FO4

Ah ok, I knew that New Vegas established the REPCONN origin but not its use of MFC. I suppose you could infer it through the Q-35 but I figured you could chalk that up to being a prototype as well. Unfortunate as it would of been an easy excuse for the change in ammo type and weapon model in FO4.

No, the plasma weapons were messed up before bethesda got its hands on the franchise they just messed it up more. I'm not an apologist for their shitty design decisions but thats just not fair. Its something I had totally forgotten in my OP about but the existence of the Glock plasma pistols in fallout 1-2 always felt odd. Plasma weaponry seemed to be this very advanced end of the war tech that was difficult to miniaturize but not only has a pistol been manufactured but one by a foreign company. That and the P-94 military rifle in Tactics again kinda goes against this idea of the P-94 being this bulky but very power piece of weaponry established in FO1/2. Then there is the naming convention problem of this big underslung weapons being called the P-94 and a compact rifle-like counterpart being called the P-94.
 
IIRC, Tactics is only semi-canon (i.e. high level story events did occur, but some smaller details may be non-canon) so you are probably safe ignoring anything it says about weapons and such. And yeah, I'll admit it's kinda odd with the P94 being a huge bulky weapon, but the Glock plasma defender being so small and compact. But that's the thing, it doesn't really contradict itself or break lore, it's just kind of odd.
 
I gotta disagree with you there, discounting tactics makes the Plasma defender/glock plasma pistol stand out even more.

The whole idea with the Winchester P-94 Military (Rifle Variant) was that the military commissioned a scaled down version of the P-94 Plasma Rifle/Caster. That in turn means that the 50's era military industrial complex portrayed by fallout had to lean on the private sector or at provide assistance to get this large piece of equipment down to a rifle size. This suggests that the tech could even be scaled down at all, without that then the Glock makes even less sense. Not to mention GLOCK is an Austrian firearms company that presumably wouldn't have access to Resource Wars american technology.

IDK this is a dumb lore discussion ultimately but the Glock plasma pistol/defender seems inconsistent as hell. Its a stand out in a game universe pre-bethesda seemed pretty consistant in even things as minute as weapons development and technology.
 
To be honest I don't think that there is any canon about plasma being an american only technology.

Maybe the american army bought a few of the Glock to study and make their own plasma pistols?

It's is just my opinion since I don't remember if plasma weaponry is proper explained in the lore or not.
 
To be honest I don't think that there is any canon about plasma being an american only technology.

Maybe the american army bought a few of the Glock to study and make their own plasma pistols?

The real life glock manufacturer is headquartered in Austria, so that´s a possibility.
 
To be honest I don't think that there is any canon about plasma being an american only technology.

Maybe the american army bought a few of the Glock to study and make their own plasma pistols?

It's is just my opinion since I don't remember if plasma weaponry is proper explained in the lore or not.

This is a interesting idea.

Lets say plasma tech was more widespread then suggested in fallout canon by the nature of the Glock Plasma Pistol. Maybe the European Commonwealth by extension had a more advanced or deeper understanding of Plasma tech then even the United States. I guess the assumption that the US would be at the forefront of any advanced tech is presumptuous on my part.
 
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