Europa Universalis Rome question

CloudlessDruid

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Problem in Europa Universalis Rome (vae victis):

Its a pretty simple question: I am doing a pretty good game, but almost ALL the senators are from the populist faction, and I cant figure out how to change this. I keep giving the other factions some significant positions like Dux or turning them into generals, but it doesnt change much.

Someone can help?
 
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I advise you restart your game : limiting the populists is something you must plan from the start, since sometimes, those naggers will reach a critical mass from where it's really hard to go back to other factions ; make sure to promote populist GOOD leaders and make them change their allegiance, imprison/ban/frame the troublemakers and have strong members of other parties hold good (influence changing) position so to attract more senators. Make sure to please everybody, otherwise they'll just go fatten the populist ranks... It's a lot of work, but if you plan early, it makes things easier.

From this simple guide :
Appendix A: Populism
One of the most common questions in the forums is: how do you deal with populists? Most people start to get concerned about the populist faction when they have 50% or more Senate influence, but some people have reported a populist faction with 90% influence or more!

First, it's important to note the distinction between the populists in the Senate and populist characters. There is no direct link between characters and the senate. Having characters in office might increase a faction's political attraction, and having a strong faction might influence some events that affect characters, but by and large you should think of them as being entirely different mechanics.

Populist Characters
Characters have "conviction" towards each of the political factions. Conviction is measured as a numerical value: the highest of these values determines which faction a character will join. You can see this number by checking the tooltip for the character's portrait. This is a picture from earlier in this guide:



You can see the conviction in parentheses just after the words "Military Faction". His other convictions are deliberately hidden to keep the player guessing, but I find that if a character has less than 15-20 conviction for a specific faction then he is still pretty easily converted to another faction.

Now, how to convert a character to another faction? The easiest way to do this is to give him the jobs that he desires. If a character has an objective, achieving that objective usually gives him conviction towards a specific faction. For example, a character wanting to be a general will gain Military conviction if he gets that job; as such, I find it helpful to have a "spare" army for just such characters (which is, incidentally, very handy for taking out revolts).

If a character has an objective to gain a title and doesn't have any titles at all, he'll automatically gain populist conviction at a rate of 0.1 per month. This means that after a couple of years, he'll likely join the populist faction, which you'll usually want to avoid. There are also some events that may increase a character's populist conviction. If he's an important character, chances are you'll want to avoid these.

Populist Senate
In the senate, there are factors that contribute to each faction's "attraction". Attraction is a percentage value that shows how much that faction will grow in the following months. The faction with the highest attraction will gain senators in the following months, while the other factions will lose senators.

Note that the 2.3 beta patch has changed a number of these attraction factors (and has thankfully opened them up for modding!), so I won't go into great detail about them, while the main factors are already explained in the main guide. The first thing you'll need to do is simply remove any populists from public office.

The populist faction leader's Charisma value has a higher impact on his faction's attraction value than any other. Other factions gain a bonus equal to (charisma -1)*1, populists instead get a bonus equal to (charisma -1)*4. So, a Military leader with 5 Charisma would only give a bonus of 4%, while a Populist leader with 5 Charisma would give a bonus of 16%. As a general rule of thumb, I like to avoid having populist leaders with a Charisma level greater than 4. Just imprison any populist leader who is too influential, it's far safer than trying to assassinate them (less of a Tyranny penalty).

Now, there may come a time when you simply cannot control your populist senate. You may have neglected to check the screen for a few years during an intense war, or you may not have known how to do it. Either way, there are two ways to get rid of the populists. The slow way involves the same principles as above. The quick way involves allowing a Populist Civil War, which may weaken your state considerably but will re-balance your senate immediately. It's up to you which way you want to go.

To trigger a populist civil war, the populists need to have a majority control of the senate, but your consul needs to be a non-populist. Note that a regular civil war will not balance the senate. The stronger the populists are, the more likely it is that a civil war will start.

Once you've won the civil war, you can then follow the normal anti-populist measures mentioned above and you shouldn't have a problem with them again.
 
Santoka said:
I advise you restart your game...
No! Do the civil war! Civil wars are one of the best things about EU:R.

Figure out which side is against the Populists and support that side - which means, if the side you're playing supports the Populists, you can lose intentionally.

You do have to pay close attention to the Populist faction in the senate, and plan ahead so they don't gain too much ground. There are lots and lots of steps to doing this. You never want the leader of the Populist faction to have a Charisma higher than, say, 4. If he has a high charisma, it's usually worth the risk/penalties to assassinate him, imprison him, or exile him. Also (this is my favorite) pick a young character with a 1 or a 0 charisma, and groom him to be the future Populist leader.

The other things involve preventing characters from drifting toward the Populist faction in the first place, or influencing them away from it. Don't have lots of unused trade routes, try to have an omen invoked most of the time, don't appoint Populist faction members to positions in government, and fulfill the ambitions of characters whenever possible to keep them non-Populist. And if it looks like a Populist is going to be elected Consul, smear his reputation.
 
rcorporon said:
The populists are a major pain in the ass...
They keep the game fun! :)

Besides, once you figure out how to keep them in check, it's not that hard. They never stop being a major consideration for republics though.

One of the best things about EU:Rome is the way republics get harder and harder to govern as they get larger and larger.
 
I couldn't agree more UniversalWolf. I'm glad they are there, but they are a major pain!! :)

EU:Rome took a bit of a beating in terms of sales, but it was a great addition to the series IMO.
 
rcorporon said:
EU:Rome took a bit of a beating in terms of sales, but it was a great addition to the series IMO.
I think it was quite incomplete when it first came out (pretty standard Paradox M.O.), which caused lots of complaining. I waited until Rome Gold came out with the expansion, and I was pleasantly surprised to find a very fun, solid game. It's still got some quirks to be worked out, but I expect there will be another patch one of these days to clear up most of them (also standard Paradox M.O.).

Don't forget the mods, either. I'm playing with the Epigoni mod at the moment, and it's really good.
 
What does that mod do ? I tried Imperium and Improved map so far, I didn't know there were many more completed working mods...
 
Santoka said:
What does that mod do ? I tried Imperium and Improved map so far, I didn't know there were many more completed working mods...
I haven't tried Imperium or RIMP, so I can't compare them, but Epigoni is a compilation of several mods that adds many new countries and tribes in Africa, Gaul, and the Balkans area, adds all the items from the Wonders mod (the pyramids, the statue of Helios at Rhodes, the lighthouse of Alexandria, etc.), adds a bunch of new titles (the Romans can win awards in combat, for example, and Macedonians can be part of Alexander's royal bloodline), and some other things I can't remember off the top of my head. Epigoni has its own subforum in the ROME mods forum at paradoxplaza.com.

It's a considerable improvement over vanilla.
 
A faction of the Senate (the others being Militarists, religious, traders and civics) and a big threat to the health of a republic in the game.
 
Well, I tried lots of things but they are still majority (but I could reduce a bit their numbers imprisoning and killing populist important members). I guess I'll just start a new game. I didn't really get this stuff of civil war. If I have for instance, a military consul, I have to win the civil war and then everything is going to be fine, and on the other hand, if the other factions start a civil war, I have to lose on purpose?
 
Radiated Heinz said:
Well, I tried lots of things but they are still majority (but I could reduce a bit their numbers imprisoning and killing populist important members). I guess I'll just start a new game.

If it's frustrating, then go ahead and start a new game. Make sure you read this thread if you haven't already:

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/showthread.php?t=393106

It's the Unofficial Strategy Guide for Republics, by the poster Cheexta. Very easy to understand and packed with helpful information!

Crni Vuk said:
a stupid quesiton. What are populists ?

In EU:Rome the populist faction is the revolutionary part of the governing body of repubilcs. Basically, they increase in size and influence if the republic is not healthy and decrease if the republic is running smoothly. Once they get a large influence in the government, they're extremely hard to get rid of without a major civil war.
 
Radiated Heinz said:
Well, I tried lots of things but they are still majority (but I could reduce a bit their numbers imprisoning and killing populist important members). I guess I'll just start a new game. I didn't really get this stuff of civil war. If I have for instance, a military consul, I have to win the civil war and then everything is going to be fine, and on the other hand, if the other factions start a civil war, I have to lose on purpose?

If you're new to the game (I don't know your level of experience) I'd recommend playing something that isn't a republic... they are tricky beasts to play, although quite a bit of fun.
 
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