Fallout 2 - Burst

T

titoi78

First time out of the vault
Hi,
I'm new to fallout 2. My question is the following:
when I burst a target from reasonable range (say 3 hexs), a lot of bullets often miss, while the chance to hit shows 95%. For example,
I have the 10mm SMG, I aim on the target, it shows 95%, I fire, 10 bullets get fired, and then I get miserable 4 dmg on target ! (which means that 1 bullet has hit and 9 have missed). I thought that each individual bullet was treated individually when regards to CtH. Then I should have 9 bullets on targets and 1 miss, on average.
Can you light my candle on this issue ?
Thxs,
N_D
 
titoi78 said:
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Well, the burst fire has a combined CtH, at least in theory.
So, if a gun that has only 50% chance of hitting an opponent... fires 2 shots, it's combined chance of hitting is 75%... fires 3 shots it's combined chance of hitting is 87.5%... So your change of hitting was actually quite low... in theory.
 
On top of this you should take into account enemy's damage resistance and damage threshold. Adding that 10mm SMG has not the best ingame ammo, even zero damage would not surprise me.
 
txhs for your replies. So if I understand correctly:

In burst mode, CtH on cursor means "chance to hit at least once".
So for example, 90% does not mean 90 % to hit for EACH bullet, but rater 90% chance that ONE bullet hits (so it means it is computed as 1 - (1-CtH for each bullet)^(number of bullets) ).

In that case, that sucks a bit. I'd rather start a new game as a sniper (I chose Fast Shot trait).

But does the CtH shown on cursor takes into account AC (armor class) of the target ? Or is the final CtH equal CtH-AC or something like that ?

Thxs for ur help,
N_D
 
It should be for each bullet, but unless you're standing right next to someone, only a third of the bullets or so are actually rolled for.
 
Your target's DT & DR are crucial also. DT shaves off a small number of damage from each bullet that hits. DR shaves off a certain % more. The final amount of damage your bullets do will be substantially reduced against decent armour, and some will do zero damage even if they hit.
 
And bullets tend to hit dead bodies (yet another bug). If there's a corpse between you and your target (including the hexes you're both standing on), all but one bullet will hit the dead critter.
 
I find aiming at the eyes on single shot mode works alot better then burst. Much easier on the old ammunition reserves too. That being said burst mode has saved my ass many a time, I usually use it as a contingency plan though rather then heading into battle with burst on.
 
Much easier on the old ammunition reserves too
Click to expand...

This made me giggle. Like by the time you get the .223 you aren't leaving ammo on corpses because it's not worth carting around. Although I guess you have to reload less often.
 
Ok guys thxs.
To summarize, I'm disappointed by burst fire (it's much better in JA2).
I'm going to restart a new game without Fast Shot or use a savegame editor to remove it.
Thxs,
N_D
 
Well I was mostly referring to the use of the SMG early on in the game. By the time I get the .223 I've already got so much .223 ammo for my hunting rifle I'm shooting at anything that moves.

Mind you I don't ever even use the SMG much anymore. Normally I use spiked knuckles until I get a hunting rifle, then stick to that until I get a .223.
 
No need to lose Fast Shot, just lose the fixation on Burst. Use Burst weapons if they're better than your single shot, but the 10mm SMG is only effective against the very lightly-armored (or unarmored) opponents of the early game -- though you really can kill almost any enemy with almost any weapon. In Fallout 2, by the time you get the 10mm SMG you've got access to a .44 Magnum; I'd give that a try, if you can't find the .223. I regularly make pistol-wielding characters with Fast Shot; when you get Bonus Rate of Fire, you'll be able to fire most pistols for a measly 2 AP a shot.
 
Sorry for resurrecting old thread, but it would be good to point, based on my experience (and some experimenting), that exactly 1/3 of the bullets from burst fire (ROUNDED DOWN) go to the designated target, if fired from non-point blank range (at point blank, ALL bullets go to the target).

That means 2 bullets for Assault Rifle (burst fires 8), 3 from SMG (fires 10), or just one for CAWS (fires 5).

If chance to hit is low (instead of 95%) it is also possible to get hit with less bullets then 1/3 instead getting complete miss.

Anyway, ammo cost divided by 3, and rounded down, is good guideline when comparing possible damage with burst compared to single fire.

You don't want to use Assault Rifle in burst, if you have 10AP and can fire 2 single rounds instead, for example.

Or use CAWS or similar shotguns with burst when at range at all (exempt against group targets when stray bullets can hit those around primary target).
 
This means that if I'm at 1 hex from an enemy, a CAWS burst could hit no more than a single shot, even with 95% to hit? And basically bursting is almost pointless if not at melee range? Two thirds of the bullets are considered missed if at any range, no matter what?
 
Yep, pretty much that.

Of course, it's not pointless if using big weapons, due to high damage and number of bullets in burst. 1/3 is not so bad, if you can't get in melee range with them. Still, if you can get "in melee", go in melee with them.

Anyway, anything with less then 9 bullets per burst, is poor chose for ranged burst (if having 10 AP). Especially, if it's 5 or less.

As for the rest 2/3 of bullets, when firing in range, they can hit creatures nearby primary target. In fact, those stray bullets have no 1/3 per target limit. You can get with CAWS two hits on creature one hex from primary target, for example.
 
Yes, people seem to have the misinterpritation that busrt must be better since it has an action point cost of 6. Its main function is when fighting multiple apponents that get groups toghether, be it in a bottleneck like a door, or melee enemies attempting to reach you. While it may seem to do measily damage to a single enemy at a fair range, it deals out horrendous damage to multiple enemies at a decent range. Its basically a way to even out the odds at the expence of your ammunition reserves.
 
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