I got robbed by the NYPD!

Von Drunky

Von Drunky

Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
Hey Guys, I’m writing a letter to stick it to the man but before I do so I need to be sure my argument is sold, that’s were the fine minds at NMA come in. I got a summons for $50 for talking up “more then on seat on the train” at 4:45am. I was coming back from a bar on Thursday (technically Friday morning). I got on the 2 train, this is an image of a pervious event but this is what the inside of the 2 train looks like:
cribz.jpg


This time however since I was by myself I sat right next to the railing so if I would snooze off I would have something to lean on, my head would remain on the railing. I had my massager bag on my lap the entire time so it wouldn’t take up any room. Next thing I know a black cop wakes me up at the last stop (Flatbush Ave I think it was it’s a bit of a hood area.) he ask me for my id I give him my student id, he ask for something else so I give him my state. He then starts felling out a summons for “taking up more then one seat” then he tells me how his sick of people passing out and getting robed and running to the cops to do something, so instead the NYPD robs me of $50. I mean aren't they suppose to protect and serve the innocent? Then I’m telling him how it was impossible because when he woke me up both of my feet were on the ground and I was leaning on the railing. He then tells me that when he was saw me my head was almost on some girl’s lap, which is impossible because I woke up with my head on the railing. Then the other cop comes in this one white and tells me that my feet were starched out across the opposite seating which doesn’t make sense either because my feet wouldn’t even reach the opposite side. So now I have two b.s stories and a $50 summons and an insult on top of that there is a box on the summons where they have to put down your place of employment or school, although I presented the officer with a student id at first that asshole put me down as unemployed instead of the prestige name of Pace University.
Now let’s say I was taking up more then one seat it was 4:45am rush hour did not start yet mean there was plenty of seating which means I was not interfering with anyone’s comfort. Here is a quote from the MTA NYC train. Website

http://www.mta.info/nyct/rules/rules.htm
Section 1050.7
Disorderly conduct.
No person on or in any facility or conveyance shall:
J. (1) occupy more than one seat on a station, platform or conveyance when to do so would interfere or tend to interfere with the operation of the Authority’s transit system or the comfort of other passengers; (2) place his or her foot on a seat on a station, platform or conveyance; (3) lie on the floor, platform, stairway, landing or conveyance


Since it was 4am I don’t see how I did anything wrong, do you?
As a counterpoint I also quoted this section

C. sleep or doze where such activity may be hazardous to such person or to others or may interfere with the operation of the Authority’s transit system or the comfort of its passengers;

Let’s say I got robed in which case sleep would be hazardous to me. However it doesn’t really matter because the charge is “taking up more then on seat”

I don’t know is this bullshit or is it just me?
 
It's bullshit to be sure, but I doubt there's anything you can do except bend over and take it in the ass. If you lived in a smaller town, you might be able to argue the point, but NYC judges are probably so sick of seeing people that they don't really care about anyone's freedoms anymore.

It's a shame we let the police get so dug in. It's like an infection; we'll probably never get rid of them, since we're taught (read: programmed) to need them just as soon as we stop sucking on our mother's tit.

There's a reason nobody I know has anything but a semi-positive response to news stories of police getting shot.
 
Its not Criminal Court, it’s the MTA court the judges are not that much of assholes. I’ve beaten a bullshit MTA summons before. It’s just the fact that it’s going to be a waste of my time. I just want to see if the summons was indeed justified.
 
Seeks said:
It's a shame we let the police get so dug in. It's like an infection; we'll probably never get rid of them, since we're taught (read: programmed) to need them just as soon as we stop sucking on our mother's tit.
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Yeah, it's certainly not possible that your environment and/or upbringing has taught (read: programmed) you to resent the police and distrust them no matter what. Because it's not like, you know, police are just people doing their jobs, and that on the whole, police provide a positive and valuable service for the community. I sure as hell would not want to live somewhere where there was no law enforcement agency. The only alternative is personal retribution and vigilantism, which is what primitive human societies often have an abundance of. In such societies, murder is often the most common cause of death. Not my idea of a nice place to live.

Note, I'm not saying cops can't be stupid, wrong, or just plain assholes. They're people. That'll happen.

Anyways, on the topic at hand, the charge is bullshit, and it's up to you whether it's worth the effort of fighting the charge to escape a $50 dollar fine. I myself would, since you were not in fact violating the ordinance, judging by your recollection of the events and the parts of it you quoted. Likely the cops were a) looking to fill their quota (which is an unfortunate and foolish mechanism for a law enforcement agency to have), b) felt like being jerks, or c) were honestly mistaken. In any case, no reason you should have to pay for their mistake.
 
I understand that if they do not fill in their quota that puts them on the spot, and they do have to put food on the table it is just unfortunate that they pick on the innocent for trivial matter as oppose to dealing with real scum. Its pretty sad I do my share of scumbag shit which if I got caught doing I would except the charges.

But another thing that pissed me off was as I was walking out of the train I saw this black guy doing the same thing and when I pointed it out the black cop he said that he wasn’t taking up more then one seat. Fucking bullshit! It’s like here is a drunken college student who actually wants to contribute to society and here is a minority who probably lives off the government and has no real ambition to do anything. But lets only give the summons to the one who looks like he actually has money.
 
DarkLegacy said:
Hey now, let's not descend into racism. We all know stereotypes aren't true. :roll:
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I somehow i feel as if racism had a small role in the matter. But i agree stereotypes are not true. Like you walk around Coney Island and see a bunch of asshole doing jack shit with themselfs but all it takes is one person from the hood actully working their ass off, there goes your stereotype. okay back to the subject before we get carried away.
 
Seems you got off relatively easy.

If a cop would have found you half-drunk, sleeping in the Warsaw subway, he'd kick you in the ribs, cuff you, and send you to the "Sobering Facility" in which they strap you up to a bed and pump you full of purgants and water, only for you to pay the bill in addition to the fine the cop would have given you.
 
Wooz said:
Seems you got off relatively easy.

If a cop would have found you half-drunk, sleeping in the Warsaw subway, he'd kick you in the ribs, cuff you, and send you to the "Sobering Facility" in which they strap you up to a bed and pump you full of purgants and water, only for you to pay the bill in addition to the fine the cop would have given you.
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Dawn Warsaw sucks dude, then again if i was there i would stick to my limits or just take a cab back. Which is funny because for 60 bucks i could have just cab it and be home within the hour.
 
You should at any time wear a bomb belt so that if anything like this happen you can tell the cops to fuck off or else you'll blow up the whole train.
 
Wooz said:
If a cop would have found you half-drunk, sleeping in the Warsaw subway, he'd kick you in the ribs, cuff you, and send you to the "Sobering Facility"
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First of all, subway trains don't run in Warsaw at night, and second, you're blowing this whole thing outta proportion. A cop can't lawfully do anything to you unless you stir up shit while drunk or pass out in a dangerous manner, e.g. on the middle of the road.

That is not to say that some cops aren't mindless fucks no other than a common yob, who would pound you just for the heck of it, but you're exaggerating by making this a rule.

And yeah, the "House of Sobriety" is no fun, guys, it makes you poorer by some $100. So next time take a cab.

Also, work on your spelling, all of you, I'm sick of native speakers not knowing the difference between "there" and "their" and I'll start handing out fines. You can imagine I'm a nigga while I do :P
 
Race relations have a HUGE role in our legal system, that much is obvious. But aside from that, if you can sacrifice the time go see if it's worth it. He should have woken you up and given you a warning at the most. So you might be able to win.
 
Siley said:
First of all, subway trains don't run in Warsaw at night
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Oh, they do. You must've missed the whole reforms done by our beloved mayor Hannah. We got new night bus lines and the subway up and runnin' most of the night.
 
It was the will of the people!

Ayup, I was pretty sure the subway was dead after midnight, so I just used the cabs. You can actually catch a ride less expensive in Warsaw than most other cities.

Night busses are where the suck is at, I imagine the same goes for night subway.
 
actually for non-criminal cases where a length of imprisonment cannot exceed 364 days and any fine amount in excess of $20, you do have the right to defend yourself under UCC 1-207 and request a trial by jury if you dont want it decided by a judge. when you choose to defend yourself under UCC 1-207, you must sign the ticket or official court summons with " without prejudice UCC 1-207 " along with your signature, and then they must demonstrate the purposeful intent of violating the law AND that your violation of the law caused monetary damages.

if they cannot prove that you intended and did cause monetary damages ( which the fine will be used to repair/replace ) and that you purposefully intended to violate the law ( this is where ignorance of the law HELPS you ) then they cannot find you guilty of the offense.

you can of course research this more at your lesiure :) but for this case it would not help you because you did not sign the ticket/summons as required to request protection under this statute. maybe next time eh?
 
Kahgan said:
You should at any time wear a bomb belt so that if anything like this happen you can tell the cops to fuck off or else you'll blow up the whole train.
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Yeah, then they bill you for all the SWAT teams equipment, the people to defuse it, and they probably'd make you pay for your time in jail too! XD
 
Von Drunky said:
But lets only give the summons to the one who looks like he actually has money.
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Been


there. It's 'justfied' since it was written. That's all it takes these days. If you can beat it, great. You certainly don't want this to turn into a he said/he said moment for the obvious. Like was already said, that cab must be looking very pretty about now.
 
I'm sorry :( for you, but I think you really should take the 50 USD summons (or fine?) If you're going to fight it, I hope your university has a law school or offer free legal advice. I'm saying this since you probably will be paying at least 500 USD to a lawyer (in the US) just to get him or her to look at the case.

I do think that they needed to fill a quota pr. night maybe or or pehaps they needed to meet this week's quota of handing out tickets, fines or summons. You are sure they were regular police officers, not traffic controllers? I'm asking since in Denmark we have these traffic controllers who boards the subway trains to check if people have valid tickets and such.

As for your actions, I do think that perhaphs 99% of all Danish trafic controllers would let you sleep, or maybe just wake you up a bit to check if you were OK. As I understand it, you sat up against the railing next to the door? with your bag on your lap. And your bag didn't get robbed? Instead, you got a 50 USD summons (or fine?).

I would say that this seems to be in the very small opr detail department. And there are such things as conduite and flexibility. Neither was shown by the two police officers...I think...
 
A lawyer is not necessary, all i need to do is come in on any day before or on the due date, or i can sign the back as TheWesDude suggested at get a hearing by jury. I'm not going to make that much of a fuss over $50 dollars. A friend of mine got the same summons for stretching out his hand over an additional seat. The cop came in and had a whole essay written out, as oppose to my friend who was working off the top of his head. Basically the judge was convinced that he was trying to bullshit his way out of it. I am afraid that it is going to be my word against the police officers. Which is why I quoted the rules of conduct, the train was practically vacant at 4am.
 
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