Inflexibility of Main Quest

[VoidVector]

I am an old schooler who is not bothered by the aesthetics or mechanism changes in Fallout 3. What I am upset about is the inflexibility compare to original Fallout particularly the main quest.

I remember Fallout 1 and Fallout 2 each had only 2 main quests. For Fallout 1, the two main quests were the water chip and mutants source. For Fallout 2, the two main quests were the GECK and rescue Arroyo residents. Even though some of the side quests were required, player was still free to choose their own selection of side quests that would allow them to complete the main quests.

In Fallout 3, everything involving the main quest is bundled and itemized, so it pretty much destroys the feeling of flexibility. Even though you can skip many of those quests, I think the fact that you given them is a poor choice.

For example:
[spoiler:3611f1b264]
Why should I need to go through Three Dog to find Dr Li and Rivet City? Why can't I find Rivet City via caravan trail and meet Dr Li myself? Fallout 3 allows me to do the latter, but the quest log gives itemized instructions on how to solve it like all the other canned RPGs out there.

Why should I need to go through Dr Li to find my father in vault 112? If the main quest was designed to be flexible we should get numerous quest routes leading to the discovering of Vault 112 (intentional or unintentional).
[/spoiler:3611f1b264]
That's my take on the disappointment of this game.

P.S. The same philosophy can be extended to gameplay. For example, you can forcibly open a normal door at least 3 different ways in Fallout 1/2 (lockpick, bash, explosive), but bashing and explosives does not work in this game.

*Pope - Added spoiler tag.

 

[Photeus]

I can't help but reply.

How was Fallout 1 much different in this regard?

If I recall correctly, there was only 1 way to learn that Necropolis had a water chip - that's through the water merchants who, if you follow the quest line by talking to certain people, you are eventually lead to. Or, if you knew what was going on, you could skip directly to Necropolis.

In fact, on my first Fallout 3 play through, I decided I wasn't going to give Moriarty the caps for info, and went exploring on my own.

It was actually in my visit to Rivet City, on Moira's quest, that I got there. As I was screwing around, being told Dr. Li would talk to no one...I decided to chance it anyway. Imagine my pleasant surprise when she had information about my pa, and pointed me to to Jefferson Memorial, and thus into the main quest again.

So I'm not sure of the issue here.

 

[Black]

I can't help but reply.

How was Fallout 1 much different in this regard?

If I recall correctly, there was only 1 way to learn that Necropolis had a water chip - that's through the water merchants who, if you follow the quest line by talking to certain people, you are eventually lead to.

y halo thar.

 

[Rev. Layle]

Well, honestly Fallout 1s main quest is a bit more polished. The conversation scripting is OODLES (you determine what factor OODLE is ) better. Some of your actions are just hamstrung by completely arbitrary plot devices (i.e. the "knockout" grenade in V87 - so is there like only ONE of those? If not, why not use it against you again). And the final choices are kinda retarded, esp. if Fawkes or Charon is with you.

I can go on a bit more... but, i don't want to, well, right now. Read the Raven Rock thread posted a few days ago.

 

[Photeus]

In reply to the pick showing one of the holodisks:

It never says in there where 'Bakersfield' is. From playing the game so much (I LOVED that game) I know of course where it is, what it is, and how quickly I can nab the waterchip.

So, on your first play through this 'additional direction' is pretty much useless.

I agree that F1 is much more polished in some areas, and I like that you can be waylaid (if you see fit) and kidnapped to the Military Base so early. I do miss those things.

The knockout bomb was kinda dumb...at first I though "so they hit me with a pulse grenade?"

Also, being 'quick on my feet' I asked Fawkes to start the chamber. He said "This part is your (my) destiny"

I forgot that this Super Mutant, living in the bowels of Vault 87 for sooooooo long (his whiny words, not mine) knows my destiny. Honestly...he's nearly immune to radiation so for what good reason should he NOT do it? I should have shot him on the spot.

Anyway, regardless, as far as getting to the point of the main quests, I don't think Fallout 3 executes much differently. Yeah, it's not as polished, and sometimes the quest itself is nonsensical. However, it still follows the basic idea (not saying that's good or bad, simply arguing there is no difference)

 

[Rev. Layle]

I forgot that this Super Mutant, living in the bowels of Vault 87 for sooooooo long (his whiny words, not mine) knows my destiny. Honestly...he's nearly immune to radiation so for what good reason should he NOT do it?

THIS! I have nothing to add, but this is an especially important point that really irked me.

 

[Black]

In reply to the pick showing one of the holodisks:

It never says in there where 'Bakersfield' is. From playing the game so much (I LOVED that game) I know of course where it is, what it is, and how quickly I can nab the waterchip.

Of course it doesn't tell you exactly where it is, but the holodisk (or disc, can't remember) mentions only 3 vaults- 13, 15 and 12. Meaning that 12 can't be too far. And that it's underground. That's enough hints to tell you that you should examine any sewers you can find.
Also, I think Butch can add Necropolis to your map.

 

[zioburosky13]

"Main quest in FO1: Find water chip.
Go to Vault 15 ->stumble across Shady Sands.
Player can either continue to Vault 15 or ask Ian and go to The Hub.
From the hub, player can:
1)ask water merchant to deliver water to Vault 13 to extend the time with the risk of getting your vault discover by super mutant.
2)Get the holodisk and learn the location of other vault.
3)Ask Butch the surrounding area.
4)Explore the surrounding area freely and find Necropolis.
From option 4),
player can learn that there is a water chip in the underground vault. Options player can choose: fix the water pump and remove the chip, remove the chip but don't fix the pump."

Main quest in FO3: Just follow the marker in your pipboy and head straight...

 

[DOF_power]

I can't help but reply.

How was Fallout 1 much different in this regard?

If I recall correctly, there was only 1 way to learn that Necropolis had a water chip - that's through the water merchants who, if you follow the quest line by talking to certain people, you are eventually lead to. Or, if you knew what was going on, you could skip directly to Necropolis.

In fact, on my first Fallout 3 play through, I decided I wasn't going to give Moriarty the caps for info, and went exploring on my own.

It was actually in my visit to Rivet City, on Moira's quest, that I got there. As I was screwing around, being told Dr. Li would talk to no one...I decided to chance it anyway. Imagine my pleasant surprise when she had information about my pa, and pointed me to to Jefferson Memorial, and thus into the main quest again.

So I'm not sure of the issue here.

I actually found river City via Moira and Replicated Man quest.
I honestly had no idea that I suposed to go via GNR/Tree Dog. She talked to me too.

 

[DOF_power]

"Main quest in FO1: Find water chip.
Go to Vault 15 ->stumble across Shady Sands.
Player can either continue to Vault 15 or ask Ian and go to The Hub.
From the hub, player can:
1)ask water merchant to deliver water to Vault 13 to extend the time with the risk of getting your vault discover by super mutant.
2)Get the holodisk and learn the location of other vault.
3)Ask Butch the surrounding area.
4)Explore the surrounding area freely and find Necropolis.
From option 4),
player can learn that there is a water chip in the underground vault. Options player can choose: fix the water pump and remove the chip, remove the chip but don't fix the pump."

Main quest in FO3: Just follow the marker in your pipboy and head straight...

Not true.
You can explore the map Oblivion style and get to River City via either Moira or Replicated man quest (or mindless wandering) and you can talk to Dr. Li (but I don't know what the check requirements are, just that it worked for me).

Just remember exploration can/should be done Oblivion sandbox style not map mode Fallout 1/2 style.

 

[Spoonfeed]

Just remember exploration can/should be done Oblivion sandbox style not map mode Fallout 1/2 style.

so, this game is nothing like fallout? And someone is playing the game wrong if they play it like the original?

WHAT A FURPRISE!

 

[zioburosky13]

Just remember exploration can/should be done Oblivion sandbox style not map mode Fallout 1/2 style.

I prefer the map mode for suspense element. Even with the msg of "Do you wish to encounter of xxx" knowing what kind of critters you will meet, you still can't tell the total number of the critters and their formation, which create the element of surprise.

In FO3, I know everything of the above and you quickly lose the feeling of surprise as soon as I see my foe and their numbers.

 

[ScottXeno]

Just remember exploration can/should be done Oblivion sandbox style not map mode Fallout 1/2 style.

I prefer the map mode for suspense element. Even with the msg of "Do you wish to encounter of xxx" knowing what kind of critters you will meet, you still can't tell the total number of the critters and their formation, which create the element of surprise.

In FO3, I know everything of the above and you quickly lose the feeling of surprise as soon as I see my foe and their numbers.

Even more, a simple spin around while toggling VATS mode will alert you to any possible threat that you might not have noticed with your own eyes. It feels horribly cheap. No one has been able to sneak up on me in the game.

 

[Photeus]

Fallout 3-

Main Quest: Find your father (unlike a water chip, he's been to several places and people happen to have information about him and where he's gone)

1) Follow the main quest line, eventually everything puts you at Vault 112 (unfortunately there is no time limit, I actually enjoyed that part of Fallout 1)

2) Follow Violin Lady quest/Get to Vault-Tec Headquarters and find the locations of the Vaults, search Vaults and viola

3) Randomly explore the Capital Wasteland and happen across Vault 112

4) The Sheriff in the first town gives you the location of Rivet City, main quest line can begin that way(no different than butch giving you Necropolis if you have no knowledge of water-chip location beforehand) Otherwise, you can happen upon Rivet City randomly or follow Moira's questline. (If you choose, combine this one with number 1 - Fallout 1 didn't really have a 'main quest line' so it's different in that regard here, but regardless there are ways to start the main quest line without talking to those people)
[I'd label the above 'deviations from main questline, yet following peices]

Now, I'll be fair. I have my gripes about 'skipping ahead', mostly that the character seems to know EVERYTHING going on regardless of what they've done. This is most pronounced if you go straight to Vault 112.

Personally, I'm wanting to go back to play the game to see at what points the main quest line can be skipped.

 

[DOF_power]

I prefer the map mode for suspense element. Even with the msg of "Do you wish to encounter of xxx" knowing what kind of critters you will meet, you still can't tell the total number of the critters and their formation, which create the element of surprise.

In FO3, I know everything of the above and you quickly lose the feeling of surprise as soon as I see my foe and their numbers.

I'd preferred to have had both the sandbox exploration and the F1/2 map mode.