J.E. Sawyer interview

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J.E. Sawyer has done an interview at Neverwinter Nights 2 News. It is interesting as Sawyer talks about and compares cRPGs with small, but vocal and dedicated fanbases (like Planescape and Fallout) with cRPGs that are simply massive hits (Neverwinter Nights, TES):<blockquote>On the topic Planescape; it is a very highly regarded title even by today's gamers. However, on a commercial level if faired poorly for the most part. How to you rectify that in your mind, a game loved by most all who speak of it yet total opposite results on the balance sheet?

Though Torment fans are little in number, they have mighty voices. Games that appeal to casual gamers often do not elicit such passionate and enthusiastic responses -- certainly not so long after a game has been released. Some argue that Torment isn't really an RPG because it doesn't let you select your own character or that it's not D&D because it kind of treats a lot of D&D rules like an afterthought. But there is no arguing that it is a game made with a very strong vision and a unique direction. I believe that's what people tap into when they become such zealous fans of the game.

Is there something from developers to learn from the example of Planescape? Is the deep, story driven CRPG dead in your view or was Plancescape ahead of its time?

I don't think the deep, story-driven CRPG is dead but I certainly don't see those games being developed as what most publishers would consider "triple-A" titles. If or when they do, I think it's because the publisher has a great deal of faith in the developer. Witness Fable and Jade Empire, two relatively story-heavy RPGs with original IPs. Without Lionhead and BioWare creating those titles, I highly doubt they ever would have been developed.

(...)


When do you feel we will ever see another Fallout, Planescape or BG2 type epic, deep story driven game?

I really believe that developing games with stories like Fallout and Planescape, where the player has a lot of freedom, requires designers to re-focus their attention. You can't build a linear RPG for twelve months and just decide, out of the blue, to transform it into a non-linear, "do what you want" RPG. That has to be the focus from the beginning. Plot critical characters have to be rare in the extreme, plot critical events also have to be rare in the extreme. It requires planning and it requires focus, but I don't honestly believe it's tremendously difficult. It's only hard because designers often want to have it both ways - telling a super tight, super controlled story and allowing some sort of lip-service to non-linearity. Something's got to give, guys.

When will designers decide to do that in an RPG again? Beats me.</blockquote>Link: interview on NWN 2 News

Spotted at RPGDot.
 
Note, I find this whole thing kind of spurious since JE Sawyer has never worked on a high-quality cRPG that garnered an eternally dedicated fanbase.
 
I find it strange that Fallout and Planescape are lumped together considering the latter is quite linear, with an abundance of plot-important characters and events, limited actual gameplay, and very limited replayability, while Fallout is open in the extreme.

Without Lionhead and BioWare creating those titles, I highly doubt they ever would have been developed.

What?

Oh well, J.E. said something, so it's probably worth quoting in Wikipedia somewhere.
 
DirtyDreamDesigner said:
Funny how J.E. has the theory right but sucks in practice.

Conceptual gaming is the future, caveman. While you and the rest of the mouth breathers are drooling over pretty pictures of sunsets and flowers some of us are trying to get to the post-modern era, so kindly step aside and let progress through.







(joking, of course)
 
DirtyDreamDesigner said:
Don't double post. :freak:

I can't leave personal comments in news posts, so I have to double post. Grrrduh.

I find it strange that Fallout and Planescape are lumped together considering the latter is quite linear, with an abundance of plot-important characters and events, limited actual gameplay, and very limited replayability, while Fallout is open in the extreme.

That's not the group he was talking of, though. They were simply talking of "plot-heavy" games, you know, the ones too difficult for console kiddies.
 
i know planescape didn't well on the sale aspect of things - despite having a superb story - but why dont they make games like fallout anymore? ok yes money, but the pc world is flooded with unintelligable, linear games. It seems to me that there is a huge gap in the market for story driven games like fallout just waiting for some bright spark to realise its potential (again). Surley with the massive following of games like fallout and baldurs gate (bethesda take note) developers would be on the money to make such a game??
 
Kharn said:
Note, I find this whole thing kind of spurious since JE Sawyer has never worked on a high-quality cRPG that garnered an eternally dedicated fanbase.

Didn't Sawyer work on... no, wait it was... uh...

Hmm. Well Kharn, when you're right, you're right. Seriously. Sawyer either has bad luck or makes bad decisions because the only thing he ever started and finished was an expansion for IWD and IWD2.

BG3 and FO3 dead. He left Midway. Took over for Ferretface as lead on a game that is being chopped to pieces. When the mighty FU and the rest of Obsidian can't agree whether the game will be 20 hours of play or 30-40, there's a problem.

But then, as for the game being chopped, that's clearly the fault of the publisher, in this case Atari who are, IMO, a joke. Any company so desparate to reinvent it's image that it takes the name of an old company famous for some of the first arcade games is sorely lacking. I wonder how Obsidian will fare after NWN2. The Project New Jersey forums disappeared and some of the Obsidian fanboys think it's simply because there's nothing new to say. Geez kiddies. There never was anything to say in the first place so why would those forums now disappear? Hmm? Maybe because PNJ disappeared? Reading Obsidian's forums is usually good for a laugh at least.
 
I can't leave personal comments in news posts, so I have to double post. Grrrduh.
Since when and why? RPGCodex do that all the time.
Does NMA have owner that forbids any personal comments to be added to newsposts or is it your own decision?
I'm not necessarely an apologist of that kind of attitude, but it kinda spices up the whole thing and I really don't see what's so wrong in having some attitude on the site that's supposedly independant.
 
Gnidrologist said:
Since when and why? RPGCodex do that all the time.

Heh. Yeah. The Codex does.

Gnidrologist said:
Does NMA have owner that forbids any personal comments to be added to newsposts or is it your own decision?

Owner? Well, Odin owns NMA, sure, and he prefers a lack of personal comments on the frontpage.

The thing is, Gnidrologist, that this isn't kharn.myblog.com (or whatever). People don't come to NMA to read my personal opinion on whatever is news.

RPGCodex is pretty much an editorial-only site, shoving its opinions in your face, DaC does much the same, NMA tends to take a more professional journalistic stance. It has for a long time now. It has nothing to do with censorship or even self-censorship, we consider it simple professionalism.

Which doesn't mean we shy away from fistfights, but only when necessary. People don't need to see me mocking JE on the frontpage, it serves no purpose.
 
Heh, well, I understand that, it's fine policy and all, but I find ironic that most people, even die-hard codexers find NMA to be most bitter and angry crpg related sites on the internet.

Not that I find your stance flawed, but it's kinda hipocrytical, especially knowing how Rosh treats people who doesn't suck he's virtual dick all the time. Not that I'm not usually agreeing with most of what he's saying, but I think that baning people because of different views on the matter is just wrong (even if those views are stupid). That never happens on codex.

Ok, I know that newsposts are something different than just posts, but I really doubt that NMA will be know as ''professional'' news site bacause of that, especially when you post your personal opinion just next to the news item.
''Profesionalism'' in today's gaming sites/magazines equal cocksucking combined with overall cluelesness. :lol:
 
Gnidrologist said:
Ok, I know that newsposts are something different than just posts, but I really doubt that NMA will be know as ''professional'' news site bacause of that, especially when you post your personal opinion just next to the news item.

We have 100,000 unique visitors every month. Guess how many of those frequent the forums?

Answer; not many.

The reputation of NMA and the Fallout fan community in general is little based on fact most of the time, and I really don't think our forums are *that* relevant compared to our site and newscoverage overall. But I do know our site is frequently used by people that do not hardly agree with our opinion. And that's their right, hence I don't shove my opinion in their face on the frontpage
 
Gnidrologist said:
Heh, well, I understand that, it's fine policy and all, but I find ironic that most people, even die-hard codexers find NMA to be most bitter and angry crpg related sites on the internet.

Not that I find your stance flawed, but it's kinda hipocrytical, especially knowing how Rosh treats people who doesn't suck he's virtual dick all the time. Not that I'm not usually agreeing with most of what he's saying, but I think that baning people because of different views on the matter is just wrong (even if those views are stupid). That never happens on codex.

Ok, I know that newsposts are something different than just posts, but I really doubt that NMA will be know as ''professional'' news site bacause of that, especially when you post your personal opinion just next to the news item.
''Profesionalism'' in today's gaming sites/magazines equal cocksucking combined with overall cluelesness. :lol:

That's a ridiculous stance, and i feel offended by it. There's no hipocrisy in keeping the news as "newslike" as it can be made by volunteers, and keeping different standards to the opinion side of the site, the forum and comments.

If you check the content side of NMA you'll find a lot of info, to help the visitors in everyway possible, if you check the news you'll find an attempt to be rigorous and detached, and to spur discussion.

But the forum is the hangout of die hard NMA members and they will have stricter guidelines on what they will allow in their home. It's the place where opinion is more important, therefore there's no need to be as detached as in news.

This place is well thought off, there was a lot of work and many problems to create it as it is, and we, who come here a lot, like this work and editorial division as it is, and god damn it there's hipocrisy in that.

And another thing this place is not the Codex or other any site, if you prefer their style fine, but don't try to lecture us on how to do our work, we've been around for much longer than the Codex and we learned the hard way to do things in a manner that suits us and the community, and we're not going to change it just because someone else makes things differently.
 
Oh dear, I'm not lecturing or even criticizing NMA just giving my imperssions. I'm not fan of codexe's way of news presentation, but at the same time I see NMA as much more intolerant place overall, considering the actions of particular admins.

It's amusing and fun to watch sometimes, but there's some incoherence between publicly stated stance and what actually happens here. I find this forum a little less just because people who have even slightly different opinions are banned or scared away so quickly there aren't even chance to flame them properly. It's sometimes feels like gang bang masturbation session and that's kinda makes it less exciting.

Don't take any offence, it's just an observation that might be disputed. News are top notch and I'm glad you are updating relatively often.
 
Gnidrologist said:
Oh dear, I'm not lecturing or even criticizing NMA just giving my imperssions. I'm not fan of codexe's way of news presentation, but at the same time I see NMA as much more intolerant place overall, considering the actions of particular admins.

Particular admins meaning one? And "in your view"?

See, it's this kind of bad-rep roll that has completely villified the entire Fallout community. DaC is recovering nicely through brown-nosing BethSoft, tho'

Gnidrologist said:
It's amusing and fun to watch sometimes, but there's some incoherence between publicly stated stance and what actually happens here.

No there isn't, because we don't actually state a stance publically. Neutrality, dig? It's not like we say we love BethSoft on the frontpage and then flame it to the ground of the forums, which is what you're implying.
 
Gnidrologist said:
Oh dear, I'm not lecturing or even criticizing NMA just giving my imperssions. I'm not fan of codexe's way of news presentation, but at the same time I see NMA as much more intolerant place overall, considering the actions of particular admins.
Not really. The Codex is just as bad in kicking around the same type of people that are kicked around here. The difference is that Rosh bans them if they just go on and on.

It's amusing and fun to watch sometimes, but there's some incoherence between publicly stated stance and what actually happens here. I find this forum a little less just because people who have even slightly different opinions are banned or scared away so quickly there aren't even chance to flame them properly. It's sometimes feels like gang bang masturbation session and that's kinda makes it less exciting.

Don't take any offence, it's just an observation that might be disputed. News are top notch and I'm glad you are updating relatively often.
Which is not really true, there have been tons of interesting discussions over the past years. The problem is mainly that a lot of discussions have been going on for so long that anyone who wants to discuss anything should at least familiarise themselves with previous discussions. Which they never do.
 
Sander said:
Gnidrologist said:
Which is not really true, there have been tons of interesting discussions over the past years.
No quarrel about that.
The problem is mainly that a lot of discussions have been going on for so long that anyone who wants to discuss anything should at least familiarise themselves with previous discussions. Which they never do.
Well, that is the part where I disagree, because I don't think that it's mandatory for newcomers to read tons of past threads so that they could become ''legal'' posters at any site/forum.

People who are simply stupid and comes here to troll around and piss off the regulars are one thing, but someone who's just making culturaly written post in which he expresses he's opinion, even if it's flawed and lacks knowledge, shouldn't be banned or namecalled repetedly just for that.
I've seen quite a few people on codex, who have changed their stances and kinda ''converted'' about lot of things concerning CRPGs and the gaming industry which I consider as a benefit for afore mentioned in general.
And that's mainly because the things are being discussed over and over again. And strangely enough, I don't feel bored even though all those dead horses might disagree. :lol:
 
Gnidrologist said:
Well, that is the part where I disagree, because I don't think that it's mandatory for newcomers to read tons of past threads so that they could become ''legal'' posters at any site/forum.

People who are simply stupid and comes here to troll around and piss off the regulars are one thing, but someone who's just making culturaly written post in which he expresses he's opinion, even if it's flawed and lacks knowledge, shouldn't be banned or namecalled repetedly just for that.
I've seen quite a few people on codex, who have changed their stances and kinda ''converted'' about lot of things concerning CRPGs and the gaming industry which I consider as a benefit for afore mentioned in general.
And that's mainly because the things are being discussed over and over again. And strangely enough, I don't feel bored even though all those dead horses might disagree. :lol:
We have no problems with discussing something, as long as someone first reads what has already been discussed. It gets really, really tiresome to see the (false) '3d rocks because it's newer than isometric' argument over and over and over again. Which is why we tell people who come up with these kinds of arguments again to go read those old threads. If they then still continue without even attempting to do some research, that's their fault.

Look at from the point of view of scientific discourse, no one is going to read a book that starts off with a faulty assumption or argument that has been debased and debunked over time in science, why should we?
 
*sigh*

My pretty post lost in a sea of debating the virtues of NMA's journalistic approach vs DaC and Codex's uh... freeform style.

And to think I was even speculating about the possibly bleak future at Obsidian. Oh wait, they signed that deal with Sega. JE will be the lead on "Sonic: The Lost Years" where the little blue guy has amnesia because Sawyer let MCA write the character's back story.

The future at Obsidian is bright!!!
 
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