Knowing- thoughts

welsh

welsh

Junkmaster
Howdy-

Just saw Knowing last weekend. What did you think of it?

I thought the "determinism vs probablism" argument that starts the movie was interesting as one of the themes of the film seems to be "the future might be determined, but we don't quite have that ending yet.

That said... hmmmm..

What did you think? Please don't give spoilers.
 
welsh said:
Howdy-

Just saw Knowing last weekend. What did you think of it?

I thought the "determinism vs probablism" argument that starts the movie was interesting as one of the themes of the film seems to be "the future might be determined, but we don't quite have that ending yet.

That said... hmmmm..

What did you think? Please don't give spoilers.
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That this would be imaginable if you see it with the Newton's laws and view of the world but on the other side untrue with perceptions of Quantum mechanics, like for example Heisenbergs Uncertainty principles.

Its at the moment still a point which is in debate. Though what scientists have discovered is that 2 Photons always share the same value of informations regardles of their distance with no loss of time how it seems from tests. So if one has a negative charge the other photon has it as well. They seem to have a conection with each other that is not in relation with time and space even if the information is changing. This kind of behaviour though is somewhat in contradiction with a few imaginations. Like with the speed of light or the transfer of informations cause at the moment there is still a general rule that nothing can have higher speed then light.

I doubt that anyone will find that soon a satisfying answer. Even Einstein made the one or other big mistake around it. So does God play dice or not ?
 
This was the first Nick Cage movie I was actually looking forward to seeing but we've been sacked with a couple of blizzards so I was not able to go see it.

I hope to see it before it leaves the theater. Then again I'm not even sure if we have it. Haven't looked.
 
Well, it has a couple very nasty catastrophe moments. Watching a subway basically steamroll a subway platform full of passengers was pretty brutal.

But then, maybe I am getting a bit too old for gratuitious violence.

(Then again, I still love the Wild Bunch).
 
welsh said:
But then, maybe I am getting a bit too old for gratuitious violence.
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Yeah, you're definitely getting too old for gratuitous violence. I'm too old for it, and I had the same reaction. The first disaster was hideous. I was thinking that the subway car had too much inertia, too. The worst bit was the violence at the end (you know what I'm talking about - no need to spoil it). There was absolutely no need to show that at all, since you knew it was going to happen. It added nothing to the story and it wasn't as cool as how I might have imagined it.

[spoiler:5faa2dfe8c]Would everything really busrt into flames? Wouldn't everything just be baked and sterilized by radiation?
[/spoiler:5faa2dfe8c]
Have I heard right that Knowing is fairly devisive, with some people liking it and some people not liking it? I can see why. I'm torn over it myself. It's pretty creepy and tense, so it's good in that respect, but overall I didn't like it because it's a "spiritual" movie masquerading as science fiction. Too "Art Bell" for my taste, if you know what I mean. I could tell within the first five minutes that it was going to be one of those movies where the skeptical materialist becomes convinced that the universe really does have Meaning™.

[spoiler:5faa2dfe8c]So how are the angels/aliens able to see the future anyway? Kind of a glaring omission not to address that. I think the aliens have some ethical problems, too. They're pretty confident in their right to decide who lives and who dies. If they're so smart, why didn't they bring more ships? Or better yet, why didn't they do something to divert the solar flare a few degrees to the left? I mean, they've known about it for at least 50 years, right? I guess since they can see the future, they knew they weren't going to save the Earth. :wink: [/spoiler:5faa2dfe8c]
 
Haven't seen the movie yet.
But when it comes to the topic of a determined future, the same question allways pops up in my head:

Does it matter?
 
Dreadwolf said:
Does it matter?
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That's a question beyond the scope of Knowing. It's not that profound.

And also,
[spoiler:fabc6d0c99]If the Whispering Ones can see the future, why do they destroy Lucinda's entire life by filling her head with images of destruction from the time she's a little girl? Why don't they just talk to Nick Cage's kid when the time comes? Those "angels" are pretty diabolical, if you asked me. :seriouslyno: [/spoiler:fabc6d0c99]
 
Not completely parallel with the topic but I think I should ask you're take on compatibilism. If hard determinism, which I guess the movie is trying to push and fails, and liberalism are inherently flawed, by deductive reasoning is Compatibilism true? If it is and we are set in motion only to be controlled by our desires, what controls our only like to freewill, our desires.

I've been pondering on this topic.

Plus I'm not surprised the movie had gaping holes in it's plot.
 
ManiacMutant said:
Not completely parallel with the topic but I think I should ask you're take on compatibilism. If hard determinism, which I guess the movie is trying to push and fails, and liberalism are inherently flawed, by deductive reasoning is Compatibilism true? If it is and we are set in motion only to be controlled by our desires, what controls our only like to freewill, our desires.

I've been pondering on this topic.

Plus I'm not surprised the movie had gaping holes in it's plot.
Click to expand...
First let me say that my criticisms about Knowing were not intended as a support or criticism of any particular branch of philosophy. It's a flawed movie, and all I intended was to point out those flaws and poke some fun at them. It's pushing a form of spiritual determinism, yes, but the real problem is that it doesn't do a very good job of it. If it did a good job it would be a better movie; which is not to say it doesn't have some good points too. In the instances it uses determinism as an artistic device, it tends to be quite effective.

When it comes to determinism versus free-will or compatibilism...I would say I'm a pragmatist. I don't think it's possible to know whether one or the other is true, or whether they exist together in any particular combination. Therefore I assume I have free will, and act as though I have free will, even though I acknowledge the possibility that I may not. Either I don't have free will, in which case my decision to act as though I do doesn't matter, or I do have free will, in which case my decision to act as though I do is the right one.
:crazy:
How about you?
 
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