Lets Build a new computer for Fallout 4

I did a bit of updating of things on this Mac Mini running win 10 under bootcamp including some updated bootcamp drivers (apple has you generate these while running OS X and the utility builds a thumb drive taking a bit over 3 Gb for this mini. when one is created for the 5K 27" iMac the thumb drive is about 4GB used... one trick of boot camp use is to make a fresh thumb drive when your windows 10 gets its regular updates. sometimes on this mini for example new Intel iris drivers are installed by windows and they are not compatible withe version that apple uses in the mini and grabbing a new thumb drive and running it in windows is a needed step.

today after doing the new thumb drive trick i fired up new vegas and Skyrim and they ran very well at 1920 x 1200 at high settings on the mini so I am more than curious about how 4 will do tomorrow on the two macs under boot camp
 
Dragula said:
How so? The Skylake is perfectly fine for all those needs. The I7 even performs great when compiling etc, there is no need, like, ever, for a Xeon.
Click to expand...

Check out this though:
http://ark.intel.com/products/88182/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E3-1230-v5-8M-Cache-3_40-GHz
http://ark.intel.com/products/80806/Intel-Core-i7-4790-Processor-8M-Cache-up-to-4_00-GHz

Both are based on Skylake architecture, both have 4 cores/8 threads. /edit: lel no, i7-4790 is Haswell actually.
Technology - Xeon 14nm, i7 22nm
Clock - +200MHz for i7
Xeon support ECC (arguably useless for gaming) and goes without integrated graphics - better TDP, cheaper for ~50 bucks.

Since OP is going to use dedicated graphics card, what makes you think that i7 is actually a better choice here?

Also, fun fact - there are troubleshooting threads for i7-4790 owners affected by overheating problem, one thread specially for i7-4790 + Gigabyte MOBO (combination suggested to OP)
https://communities.intel.com/message/245999#245999
https://communities.intel.com/docs/DOC-23517
 
Last edited:
As I expected the Mac Mini running win 10 under bootcamp can not run Fallout 4... when the installation finishes the installer says it does not recognize the Iris graphics and even setting everything to the lower res windowed mode it just goes to a black screen for a moment with the blue doughnut cursor for a moment then snaps back to the desk top.... the fact that this thing runs Skyrim so well at medium gave me a bit of hope that I would be able to do thinks like crafting on it but it looks like I am shopping for a Pure Windows PC for my living room.
 
The good news is that my other Mac runs fallout 4 like a champ under Windows 10 Bootcamp, its a 5K 27" iMac I do need to back it off down to 2560X1440 from its native res of 3840X2160 to get good frame rates
------------------
System Information
------------------
Time of this report: 11/10/2015, 20:03:41
Machine name: DESKTOP-OLI74M5
Operating System: Windows 10 Pro 64-bit (10.0, Build 10240) (10240.th1.150819-1946)
Language: English (Regional Setting: English)
System Manufacturer: Apple Inc.
System Model: iMac15,1
BIOS: IM151.88Z.0207.B05.1509081314
Processor: Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-4790K CPU @ 4.00GHz (8 CPUs), ~4.0GHz
Memory: 16384MB RAM
Available OS Memory: 16324MB RAM
Page File: 2312MB used, 16443MB available
Windows Dir: C:\Windows
DirectX Version: 12
DX Setup Parameters: Not found
User DPI Setting: 144 DPI (150 percent)
System DPI Setting: 96 DPI (100 percent)
DWM DPI Scaling: Enabled
Miracast: Not Available
Microsoft Graphics Hybrid: Not Supported
DxDiag Version: 10.00.10240.16384 64bit Unicode


------------
DxDiag Notes
------------
Display Tab 1: No problems found.
Sound Tab 1: No problems found.
Sound Tab 2: No problems found.
Input Tab: No problems found.


--------------------
DirectX Debug Levels
--------------------
Direct3D: 0/4 (retail)
DirectDraw: 0/4 (retail)
DirectInput: 0/5 (retail)
DirectMusic: 0/5 (retail)
DirectPlay: 0/9 (retail)
DirectSound: 0/5 (retail)
DirectShow: 0/6 (retail)


---------------
Display Devices
---------------
Card name: AMD RADEON R9 M295X
Manufacturer: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.
Chip type: AMD Radeon Graphics Processor (0x6938)
DAC type: Internal DAC(400MHz)
Device Type: Full Device
Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_6938&SUBSYS_013A106B&REV_00
Display Memory: 12231 MB
Dedicated Memory: 4069 MB
Shared Memory: 8162 MB
Current Mode: 2560 x 1440 (32 bit) (60Hz)
Monitor Name: Generic PnP Monitor
Monitor Model: iMac
Monitor Id: APPAE01
Native Mode: 3840 x 2160(p) (59.997Hz)
 
So you don't have to build new PC after all? That's good.

I'd like do bump @Dragula now, since he's been wasting his free time with pirated Fallout 4 since yesterday when I checked The Order, and try to confont our differing oppinions some more. Are you here, sir? Care to share your superior knowledge with such dumb ignoramus as me? :wiggle:

Why would you suggest to buy more costly CPU, when you can have cheaper one with the same architecture, instructions set, number of cores and threads, with several advantages as lesser power consumption, ECC support, and higher stability in long term run since Xeon is actually designed for 24/7 load? We and I are awaiting your ingress, sir, since you were implying that you know what the fuck you are talking about. Halp, answer my dumb question plox!

Don't make me think that you were pretending to have some knowledge by accusing me of pretentiousness please, because that would make you meta-pretentious ass actually.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
valcik said:
So you don't have to build new PC after all? That's good.

I'd like do bump @Dragula now, since he's been wasting his free time with pirated Fallout 4 since yesterday when I checked The Order, and try to confont our differing oppinions some more. Are you here, sir? Care to share your superior knowledge with such dumb ignoramus as me? :wiggle:

Why would you suggest to buy more costly CPU, when you can have cheaper one with the same architecture, instructions set, number of cores and threads, with several advantages as lesser power consumption, ECC support, and higher stability in long term run since Xeon is actually designed for 24/7 load? We and I are awaiting your ingress, sir, since you were implying that you know what the fuck you are talking about. Halp, answer my dumb question plox!

Don't make me think that you were pretending to have some knowledge by accusing me of pretentiousness please, because that would make you meta-pretentious ass actually.
Click to expand...

Because the Xeon-processor is built for server load and does not perform well in games at all?
 
Dragula said:
Because the Xeon-processor is built for server load and does not perform well in games at all?
Click to expand...
I think that his is depending on clock and number of cores solely. Since there's not any game supporting more than 4-core multiprocessing, putting a 16-core Xeon into gaming rig would be useless. The same goes for clock - i7 can be overclocked easily due to unlocked multiplier. Are you sure though that Xeon running at the same clock as i7 would perform worse? Due to what reason?
 
valcik said:
Dragula said:
Because the Xeon-processor is built for server load and does not perform well in games at all?
Click to expand...
I think that his is depending on clock and number of cores solely. Since there's not any game supporting more than 4-core multiprocessing, putting a 16-core Xeon into gaming rig would be useless. The same goes for clock - i7 can be overclocked easily due to unlocked multiplier. Are you sure though that Xeon running at the same clock as i7 would perform worse? Due to what reason?
Click to expand...
First and foremost, are we comparing an E5 or E7? Those cost about 10 000$, so the pricing alone makes it redundant. If we are comparing to the older Xeon models they are nowhere near performance wise to a Skylake 6700K.

[h=3]PassMark (Single Core)[/h]

Xeon E5-2699 v3
1,928




Core i7 6700K
2,319






As you said, most games are poorly supported for multithreading.
 
Dragula said:
First and foremost, are we comparing an E5 or E7? Those cost about 10 000$, so the pricing alone makes it redundant.
Click to expand...
I was referring to E3 V5 Xeon in comparison with i7-4790 suggested to OP, look at this:
http://cpuboss.com/cpu/Intel-Xeon-E3-1231-v3
http://cpuboss.com/cpu/Intel-Core-i7-4790K
Xeon doesn't look that bad in this benchmark, whilst being cheaper significantly, what do you think? Single-core performance score almost the same.

If we are comparing to the older Xeon models they are nowhere near performance wise to a Skylake 6700K.
Click to expand...
So are nowhere near price wise too, you'll pay much more (almost twice as much) for newest Skylake i7.

edit:
Dragula said:
Xeon E5-2699 v3
1,928
Click to expand...
This is older Haswell architecture, running at 2.3 GHz - no surprise it performs badly in comparison with Skylake i7@4.0 GHz. Tried to find E3 1230 v5 benchmark with no luck, looks like there's not any of those being tested yet; that's Xeon running at 3.4 GHz produced in Q4/2015 for workstations, based on Skylake architecture, with suggested price ~$250. I'm highly positive that the benchmark numbers would be quite better with this one.
 
Last edited:
The 4790K is an excellent processor for gaming, though. Also allows for way more performance as they overclock really well. I'd still go with that one. But each to their own.

valcik said:
So are nowhere near price wise too, you'll pay much more (almost twice as much) for newest Skylake i7.
Click to expand...
Well yes, but even compared to the 4790K, the Xeon underperforms. It is just not made for gaming. It's made for keeping a server running with lots and lots of RAM.
 
Dragula said:
The 4790K is an excellent processor for gaming, though. Also allows for way more performance as they overclock really well. I'd still go with that one. But each to their own.
Click to expand...
Well, I'm all against overclocking, since I'm too lazy for yearly upgrades. Overclocking comes at the price of decreased hardware lifespan, higher temperatures/cooler loudness, and lower stability of your system. Yep, each to their own.

I had found benchmark comparing two Skylake processors at the same clock - E3 1230 v5 vs. i7-6700:
http://www.cpu-monkey.com/en/compare_cpu-intel_core_i7_6700-520-vs-intel_xeon_e3_1230_v5-599
 
"Well, I'm all against overclocking, since I'm too lazy for yearly upgrades. Overclocking comes at the price of decreased hardware lifespan, higher temperatures/cooler loudness, and lower stability of your system. Yep, each to their own."

Seriously, neither of these are true if you cool your system.
 
Dragula said:
Well yes, but even compared to the 4790K, the Xeon underperforms.
Click to expand...
That depends. When you compare two Haswell processors, cheaper Xeon is a little slower than more costly i7 - that's because Xeon is running at inferior clock. However, you can get Skylake Xeon which is cheaper for 50 bucks (E3 1230 v5 vs. i7-4790) and there's no way older and more costly Haswell i7-4790 would perform better than Skylake based Xeon, so I still can't see any reason why to go with i7-4790.

It is just not made for gaming. It's made for keeping a server running with lots and lots of RAM.
Click to expand...
This is true only for advanced Xeon models with high number of cores, because those models come with higher amount of L3 cache memory, which allows them to shuffle big amounts of data much faster than their mainstream i7 counterparts with lesser L3 cache. Single-socket Skylake Xeon intended for workstations do have the same amount of shared L3 cache memory as Skylake i7-6700 processors though, so this is completely irrelevant here - it doesn't affect performance at all!

As you can see in the benchmark posted above, there's just 3-5% difference in the performance test between Skylake based CPUs (Xeon E3 1230 v5 vs i7-6700) running at the same base clock. That's just because i7-6700 is running for about 200 MHz faster in its full power (turbo) mode. So, the only question here is whether you consider 3-5% better performance worth $100, because that's the difference between cheaper E3 1230 v5 and more costly i7-6700.

Seriously, neither of these are true if you cool your system.
Click to expand...
Which means either more loud fan - running at higher RPM, or more costly water cooling in addition to more costly CPU.

Okay, that's enough from me. I'm still not convinced that such remarks as "LOL XEON! or "there is no need, like, ever, for a Xeon" are tangible, since you can build significantly cheaper Xeon based system with only 3-5% lower performance in comparison with i7, granted both CPUs are based on the same architecture, with the same amount of cores/threads. Whether more than 100 bucks is worthy of such a small difference in your FPS, that's up to each to decide - for me it is not, since both CPUs are capable to run modern games with high graphics settings without any troubles. Thanks for your input anyway!
 
Last edited:
valcik said:
This is older Haswell architecture, running at 2.3 GHz - no surprise it performs badly in comparison with Skylake i7@4.0 GHz. Tried to find E3 1230 v5 benchmark with no luck, looks like there's not any of those being tested yet; that's Xeon running at 3.4 GHz produced in Q4/2015 for workstations, based on Skylake architecture, with suggested price ~$250. I'm highly positive that the benchmark numbers would be quite better with this one.
Click to expand...

I'm curious about the suggested price thing. Is the retail price usually anywhere near those numbers?
 
Do you mean at ebay? I can't avoid it, whatever I'd buy here it would be taxed properly. That's why I prefer local shops, since you never know how carefuly was such delicious part as CPU handled by its previous owner selling it over at ebay. Especially with i7, which could've been heavily stressed by overclocking for a long time, you just never know. :look:
 
valcik said:
Do you mean at ebay? I can't avoid it, whatever I'd buy here it would be taxed properly. That's why I prefer local shops, since you never know how carefuly was such delicious part as CPU handled by its previous owner selling it over at ebay. Especially with i7, which could've been heavily stressed by overclocking for a long time, you just never know. :look:
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's the problem with living in eastern Europe. I try to not buy anything at the local stores, as they are a bunch of crooks, so if possible, i use amazon.de.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top