Let's rework ALL of the damage ranges for the FO weapons.

[Dove]

I can't imagine it's easier to speed-load a revolver than it is to reload a magazine-fed pistol, but that's how it is in Fallout 2 (Of course if someone's actually done both, please speak up!)

It takes almost exactly the same amount of time in skilled hands.

And an M-60 can be loaded by one person, in about twice the time of reloading an assault rifle. It's not that difficult. It's called a crew served weapon, not crew loaded, because you need someone to feed the ammo in, so it doesn't get tangled, but can be loaded, and reloaded by the operator.

 

[dude_obj]

PsychoSniper: last time I checked,"Big Guns" and "Energy Weapons" were separate skill classes in the Fallout games..

Yes but energy weapons can have the Big Gun flag in their prototype, like the Gatling Laser. One thing I find strange is that there doesn't seem to be an Energy Weapon flag in the prototypes. Does anyone know how the engine determines that you need Energy Weapon skill for any given weapon? Ammo type doesn't make sense, because some melee weapons use energy cells. I hope its not a bunch of hardcoded PID numbers, because that's a poor design. Anyone know for sure? This is a fairly important thing to know for adding new weapons!

EDIT: I did a few quick tests, and it looks like even though an energy weapon can be flagged as Big Gun, the game engine only uses the energy weapon skill for it. I get the same % to hit with the Gatling Laser whether big gun skill is 10 or 100. Also, it is not determining that its an energy weapon by object PID, because I created a new PID number and tested it. It looks to me like its a combination of ammo (energy) plus attack type (ranged) that flags it as a weapon need energy skill.

 

[Colt]

Dove beat me to it, or rather I waited to see if anyone else would help me ramble about firearms, but he is correct. Speedloaders on revolvers can work very fast, especially if the revolver is breakaction. Also correct about the M60. The second man is mostly there to help feed the belt into the machine and have another belt ready to feed.


Sander, not to be contrary just for the sake of it, but I disagree. Pistol shots regularly can kill with one shot. In a police shooting study it was found that .40 S&W loaded with JHP rounds regularly stopped, if not killed, with one shot to the torso. .45 ACP would be even more devastating in most cases. Rifle rounds, like 7.62x51mm NATO, are more likely to leave a clean hole through than a pistol slug. - Colt

 

[Lord 342]

My point with Crew-served (thanks for the clarification; I forgot that...) weapons is that it's difficult for one person to use it, not impossible, and that should be reflected in the AP cost. Making it impossible is a big beef of mine in FPS games... especially WWII games that use the German MG42 as a generic "Mounted Machinegun" when the MG42 was in fact man-portable and could be used by one man! I've seen it done!

PsychoSniper; the Rocket Launcher does not support called shots. NO big guns do, this is a defining characteristic, it seems. If I were reworking the system, I'd give large autofire weapons the option of a short burst or a long burst (basically just how long you hold the trigger for) so you could hit one guy with just a few rounds but spill half a belt into a large group. This would more acurately model the use of full-autofire weapons while not breaking the Turn-based environment.

 

[Dove]

Just to add something to Colt's post.

Pistol rounds normally are hollow points, or frangible to a certain extent. This is to keep bullets from travelling through the target, and striking something, or someone you don't want shot. This makes it more likely to kill the target, because it causes much more trauma to tissue than a "ball" round would.

High powered rifle rounds normally come in two types; full metal jacket, which is lead completely covered in copper, and soft point, which the point is left bare. Soft point rounds at high velocity, mushroom just like a hollow point pistol round, but keep the accuracy inherent in a fully formed point and are used primarily for hunting. Full metal jacketed rounds are meant to wound the target primarily, per the Geneva Convention rules defining warfare.

 

[Sander]

Sander, not to be contrary just for the sake of it, but I disagree. Pistol shots regularly can kill with one shot. In a police shooting study it was found that .40 S&W loaded with JHP rounds regularly stopped, if not killed, with one shot to the torso. .45 ACP would be even more devastating in most cases. Rifle rounds, like 7.62x51mm NATO, are more likely to leave a clean hole through than a pistol slug. - Colt

Methinks that depends on the bullets, though you may very well be right. My knowledge of firearms is probably inferior to yours, so I'll just assume that you're right.

 

[PsychoSniper]

It definatly sounds reasonable, since studies have shown that anything over .40 will stop someone.

 

[jlamb]

They'd like us to think that 7.62 and 5.56 NATO are likely to leave nice clean wounds, but i've heard that the reality (especially with 5.56) is that because of their low mass and high speed they are very likely to tumble and bounce around inside the target after penetration, ripping and tearing important things in the way.

I believe this is most likely to happen beyond a certain range (though it isn't very far) and especially after punching through something like armour into the nice gooshy insides of a person. I think bones also tend to mess up a nice clean trajectory. Luckily this internal damage won't prevent the body from being identified.

Also, armor and even heavy clothing play hell on a low velocity round's ability to damage, much moreso for hollowpoint/softpoint rounds. A high velocity FMJ round is more likely to penetrate and actually damage vitals.

http://www.firearmstactical.com/tacticalbriefs/volume4/number2/article421.htm
Is some info on handgun wounds. The parent site has some other interesting reads on ballistics stuff too.

http://home.snafu.de/l.moeller/military_bullet_wound_patterns.html
Another neat article comparing the wound cavities of several FMJ rifle rounds. It supports that these rounds will always tumble because of simple physics, and it doesn't seem to be related to distance. Fragmentation of the 5.56NATO however is: the core "leaks" out of the jacket and takes apart tissue in the temporary wound cavity quite a bit at 100m, and decreases over greater distances.