My review of Fallout: the Series Season One 9/10

Hawkwing74 said:
Yes, that I can buy into. We see in our own day how MIC corps want endless wars for profit. It would be Greek tragedy for their hubris to get away from them in this manner. I can't imagine any billionaire CEO wants a full scale nuclear war unless they're insane.
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But then you don't get the delicious, delicious pre-war corporation fucking up shit 200 years in the future! War never changes! That means it's always the same!
 
And not to beat a dead horse, but it’s just so frustrating to me that Vault-Tec becomes more villainous and conspiratorial with each portrayal, starting way back in Fallout 2. In the first Fallout they are nothing but a private contractor taking advantage of a bloated defense budget. They built giant bomb shelters that, though impressive and futuristic looking, were little more than security theater. They cut corners wherever they could. They knew Vault 15 was at risk of caving in. They knew the Vault doors couldn’t withstand a direct strike from a nuke, which happened to Vault 12 (somehow, despite being underground but whatever). They knew that the aquifer on the surface that Vault 13 was meant to get water from would become irradiated or dry up or whatever happened to it, I can’t really remember which, and they knew that the backup method of pumping water from underground sources would not be a viable long term solution given the fragility of the technology required to do so, eventually resulting in our broken water chip scenario that kicks off Fallout. They were warned about these things, but they didn’t care, not because they consciously wanted people to die, but because they were too shortsighted and profit-motivated to take these warnings seriously. There’s a lot of parallels between them and fossil fuel companies that were aware of the potential dangers of global warming and the direct affect their industry had on it, but instead simply hoped for the best and convinced themselves that things wouldn’t get THAT bad, because to do otherwise would mean cutting into their bottom line.

I just find the idea that people in power are uniquely evil compared to the common man to be such a boring and simple-minded concept. It divides the world into good guys and bad guys, ignoring that we’re all just animals, products of our environment, evolved to put the perceived wellbeing of ourselves and our tribe first, even when it defies all logic and would actually result in the opposite of wellbeing. But willfully destroying the very world that gave you your wealth and power is something that only the least rational people could possibly think would benefit them or their family.

Honestly, I don’t think most people in the Fallout universe really took the threat of nuclear war seriously until maybe the last couple years leading up to the war. The Cold War had gone on in one form or another for over a century at that point. It looked like the concept of mutually assured destruction would keep everyone safe (in America, at least). It wasn’t until things really started to fall apart in the second half of the 2070s that people started to realize that nuclear annihilation was a real possibility. That’s mostly just my headcanon, anyway.

Edit: https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Vault_locations_v34.129

This is what I based this post on from memory, but apparently it doesn’t say nearly as much as I remember. So I guess most of my post was just headcanon, go ahead and ignore it.
 
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Hawkwing74 said:
I read that overly verbose book. People shutting down their corporations because they are pissed at the government bureaucrats somehow equals nuking the world in your mind? Wow, just wow.
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I'm sorry, but don't try and pull a fast one because the world fucking ends and they repopulate it from Gault's Gulch.

Because in Ayn's world, the working class are a disease who can't exist without the corporate ownership.

Iprovidelittlepianos said:
I just find the idea that people in power are uniquely evil compared to the common man to be such a boring and simple-minded concept. It divides the world into good guys and bad guys, ignoring that we’re all just animals, products of our environment, evolved to put the perceived wellbeing of ourselves and our tribe first, even when it defies all logic and would actually result in the opposite of wellbeing. But willfully destroying the very world that gave you your wealth and power is something that only the least rational people could possibly think would benefit them or their family.
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Being from Appalachia and the millionaire country club set, this is just sad because yes, if you are raised as a spoiled man child who gets everything and are taught to view people who are outside of your class as parasites who prey upon "your" money and natural right to everything, you get some truly psychotic little shits who want to take away school lunches and let the opioid epidemic run wild because it gets rid of the welfare queens.

I don't romanticize the working class but anyone who thinks that the corporate/government class doesn't contain cartoonishly evil people is just dumb.
 
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Iprovidelittlepianos said:
And not to beat a dead horse, but it’s just so frustrating to me that Vault-Tec becomes more villainous and conspiratorial with each portrayal, starting way back in Fallout 2. In the first Fallout they are nothing but a private contractor taking advantage of a bloated defense budget. They built giant bomb shelters that, though impressive and futuristic looking, were little more than security theater. They cut corners wherever they could. They knew Vault 15 was at risk of caving in. They knew the Vault doors couldn’t withstand a direct strike from a nuke, which happened to Vault 12 (somehow, despite being underground but whatever). They knew that the aquifer on the surface that Vault 13 was meant to get water from would become irradiated or dry up or whatever happened to it, I can’t really remember which, and they knew that the backup method of pumping water from underground sources would not be a viable long term solution given the fragility of the technology required to do so, eventually resulting in our broken water chip scenario that kicks off Fallout. They were warned about these things, but they didn’t care, not because they consciously wanted people to die, but because they were too shortsighted and profit-motivated to take these warnings seriously. There’s a lot of parallels between them and fossil fuel companies that were aware of the potential dangers of global warming and the direct affect their industry had on it, but instead simply hoped for the best and convinced themselves that things wouldn’t get THAT bad, because to do otherwise would mean cutting into their bottom line.

I just find the idea that people in power are uniquely evil compared to the common man to be such a boring and simple-minded concept. It divides the world into good guys and bad guys, ignoring that we’re all just animals, products of our environment, evolved to put the perceived wellbeing of ourselves and our tribe first, even when it defies all logic and would actually result in the opposite of wellbeing. But willfully destroying the very world that gave you your wealth and power is something that only the least rational people could possibly think would benefit them or their family.

Honestly, I don’t think most people in the Fallout universe really took the threat of nuclear war seriously until maybe the last couple years leading up to the war. The Cold War had gone on in one form or another for over a century at that point. It looked like the concept of mutually assured destruction would keep everyone safe (in America, at least). It wasn’t until things really started to fall apart in the second half of the 2070s that people started to realize that nuclear annihilation was a real possibility. That’s mostly just my headcanon, anyway.

Edit: https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Vault_locations_v34.129

This is what I based this post on from memory, but apparently it doesn’t say nearly as much as I remember. So I guess most of my post was just headcanon, go ahead and ignore it.
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I hate to ask but can the entire sum of this post be, "Blah blah blah, only Fallout the original was good and everything else sucked?"
 
CT Phipps said:
I'm sorry, but don't try and pull a fast one because the world fucking ends and they repopulate it from Gault's Gulch.
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Very bizarre point you are trying to make. The ending of the book is much more vague than that. It's not like 95% of the people died or anything, like a global nuclear war. She seems to think people will want capitalism back or something after things collapse. She had lots of blind spots in her philosophy.


CT Phipps said:
I don't romanticize the working class but anyone who thinks that the corporate/government class doesn't contain cartoonishly evil people is just dumb.
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Granted, plenty of evil people in powrer.

But why would they upend all their own power and lifestyle to "rule" in a crappy vault? The best vault possible would have to be an incredible lifestyle downgrade. No new entertainment, no new tech, no variety of travel and experiences and food. Even if they crave power, they are reduced to having power over a tiny, tiny percentage of humans compared to their previous state. It's sheer insanity.
 
TheGM said:
So you are telling me the lady who spent the last years of her life holded up in house with her own personal cult that she was eventually ejected from had some blind spots?
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I find it more telling that Randian thought doesn't quite get treated with just how thoroughly it infiltrated certain politicians and bureaucrats' thought.

Alan Greenspan, the fucking 13th Chairman of the Federal Reserve, was one of her inner circle.

It's a bit like appointing Tom Cruise as the head of your department on religious affairs.
 
TheGM said:
So you are telling me the lady who spent the last years of her life holded up in house with her own personal cult that she was eventually ejected from had some blind spots?
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I'm certainly not defending her. And her book was too long and boring.

But she didn't advocate, at least in that book, starting a war to kill off almost all the world. She figured the workers would die due to their own choices and weaknesses.

CT Phipps said:
Alan Greenspan, the fucking 13th Chairman of the Federal Reserve, was one of her inner circle.
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off topic, but I agree we should end the Federal Reserve. :P
 
Hawkwing74 said:
I'm certainly not defending her. And her book was too long and boring.

But she didn't advocate, at least in that book, starting a war to kill off almost all the world. She figured the workers would die due to their own choices and weaknesses.
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Yes, specifically by all the smart people shutting down their companies and retreating to their bunker.

And there's yes, a big war outside.

The thing is that Silicon Valley was envisooned by many as a real life Gault's Gulch and many of the billionaires of today were strongly influenced by her writings that they have used for political thought.

Bioshock had its flaws but it was an unabashedly political game.

I also enjoyed this satire.

atlass-2x.jpg
 
Homer2137 said:
From what I've seen, a black lesbian communist is portrayed as the good guy, despite commiting atrocious things, and Vault-Tec is the one who dropped the nukes, not Communist China. Maybe I'm reaching, but it's enough for this show to be a hidden communist propaganda.
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Or, they used their communist connections in China to launch the nukes, as well as their power on the US side to cause the peace talks to break down causing the US to reach even deeper into East Asia thus forcing their hand (FNV Ceasar level writing there, I doubt it but it's an easy out).

ALSO WHERE THE FUCK WAS POSIDEON OIL IN THE WHOLE SERIES? Am I the only one who missed any reference to them in the show or did they simply forget? Because when Sister Freeze was dying watching the lights of LA light up all I could think about was Gecko. That, and when chicken fucker got the fusion core to fix the foot (when he said how rare these were - I was churning out dumpsters of them in FO4).
 
The fact that this thread has devolved into just debating one of the most braindead retarded philosphers in history is really funny I'm ngl
 
The_Time_Master said:
Or, they used their communist connections in China to launch the nukes, as well as their power on the US side to cause the peace talks to break down causing the US to reach even deeper into East Asia thus forcing their hand (FNV Ceasar level writing there, I doubt it but it's an easy out).

ALSO WHERE THE FUCK WAS POSIDEON OIL IN THE WHOLE SERIES? Am I the only one who missed any reference to them in the show or did they simply forget? Because when Sister Freeze was dying watching the lights of LA light up all I could think about was Gecko. That, and when chicken fucker got the fusion core to fix the foot (when he said how rare these were - I was churning out dumpsters of them in FO4).
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It should be noted that Tim Cain believes that the showrunners are going to reveal that Vault-Tec will have fucked up because that's what all of their plans devolve into it. He says he thinks that they planned to drop the nukes in a few months or weeks but China then preempted them, seeing where they were going and this is why Coop is out with their daughter.

Because, of course, Vault-Tec is never in control and their plan to rebuild the world never happened because the surface never went away.

I think this would be the best way to handle it personally and highlight what was true in Vault-4 that VT is a bunch of idiots with way too much money and power and resources.
 
I think a better way to handle it would've been to not have done any pre war shit at all because that is so beyond not the point of the series
 
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