PC Gaming: Why I'll Never Console Myself with Second Best

Brother None

This ghoul has seen it all
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PC Perspective has a good piece up on PC vs Console gaming. A topic worth quoting for us is this:<blockquote>Another likely casualty of porting to PC was Oblivion's A.I, named Radiant AI. While Bethesda was having problems with certain Non-Player Character interactions, one can't help but wonder if the AI was lobotomized to make it play well on the Xbox 360. If you never saw Bethesda's pre-release demo videos they displayed at the 2005 E3, you can find them on YouTube. I would suggest the 5th video on which details the complexity of the Radiant AI specifically, as it shows the breadth the original version of the AI would display. If you never played the game, you can see the final implementation in many of the other videos on YouTube, from bizarre domestic violence to the death penalty for stealing bread. One of the most rabid fan bases for a PC game are having a collective convulsions in dread of what Bethesda will do to their favourite franchise. Fallout 3 is going to be released on the Playstation 3 and Xbox 360 as well as the PC, and will use the Radiant AI system. Go check out the forums at Bethesda's Fallout 3 site, or No Mutants Allowed to see how this news is being taken. Be sure to wear sunscreen, asbestos underwear and JooJanta 200 Super Chromatic Peril-Sensitive Sunglasses.</blockquote>The entire article is a good read.

Link: PC Gaming: Why I'll Never Console Myself with Second Best.

Thanks Briosafreak.
 
We've all heard the news by now, gaming on the PC is dead; the console has won.

That makes me sad. Not only does the computer have more gaming power available, it's just cooler. Bethesda sure is getting it, aren't they?

:cry:
 
While I agree with much of the article, I still disapprove of the console bashing that seems to go along with any discussion of PC gaming. I've been playing console games since I was a kid, when I got a Sega Genesis with Altered Beast for Christmas. I've also been playing PC games since I was a kid on my dad's Macs; I have fond memories of King's Quest, Space Quest, Escape Velocity and its sequels, Sim City 2000, the Marathon trilogy (the games that introduced me to FPSs and made me a huge Bungie fan), Fallout 1 and 2 (of course) and tons of other games. Still, at the same time, I was playing and loving Sonic the Hedgehog, Ecco the Dolphin, Vectorman, going over to my friend's to play Mario and Zelda and Duckhunt.

May I'm too unsophisticated to be a PC-only gamer.

Anyways, still, it is disheartening to see the direction that game development is going nowadays. I certainly don't want to see the made-for-PC games going away. I like to have both the PC and the consoles available for me to waste my hours away on.
 
Reading articles that mention NMA tend to give me a surreal feeling, despite the fact I know how big NMA is... I just can't process it.
 
I used to like consoles, back when they were consoles. To me a console was/is an arcade machine for your living room, something to play with friends (next to you) and have a quick blast on when bored.

As of late though, they are increasingly turning into PC-Lites complete with dumbed down PC games. I wouldn't care if it wasn't for the fact pish is working it's way upstream.... To this end, I increasingly find myself loathing next gen consoles like the 360/PS3 :(

I do however admit to being fond of the Wii. It offers a different form of gaming altogether - it's fun, innovative and makes me feel like a kid with his first NES again.
 
nice article

regarding RadAI
i'm still very sure its just another case of the emperors new clothes.

like the AI in stalker .. it would work and it would interact .. but who cares if you dont percieve it as meaningfull and intended events ....

when it works it works like advertised but just doesnt impress. NPC bubbles iff-ing each other for mini-scripted actions. nothing new .. its just hype
 
Nim82 said:
As of late though, they are increasingly turning into PC-Lites complete with dumbed down PC games. I wouldn't care if it wasn't for the fact pish is working it's way upstream.... To this end, I increasingly find myself loathing next gen consoles like the 360/PS3 :(
Aye... I want to defend consoles, but I have to admit this is true. Consoles are great for what they are, but with "next-gen" consoles, in many ways they're trying to make them into something which they're not (or shouldn't be anyway). I've got a PC, I don't need my console to do things my PC does for me already.

The Wii is simply fun. Unfortunately, my friend didn't like it, so she traded it in for a 360. Which is alright, there are a few 360 games I'm anxious to play. But if I ever get a good cash supply going, definitely going to pick up a Wii of my own.
 
Kyuu said:
when I got a Sega Genesis with Altered Beast for Christmas.
That game is brilliant. Simple, pure fun. I played it through so many times as a kid. The memories. Another well made game was Michael Jacksons moonwalk. Both held so much quality in its design. Solid.

Kyuu said:
Anyways, still, it is disheartening to see the direction that game development is going nowadays. I certainly don't want to see the made-for-PC games going away. I like to have both the PC and the consoles available for me to waste my hours away on.
Personally I don't think pc games will disappear until the pc dies. People are making games for every gadget there is. As long as there are indie developers, there will be games for everything. And as long as there is a demand, it will be there. But as I said, until the pc dies. If the console makers manages to outrun the pc in more than one way, heck, it might. They still have a long way to go though.
 
monsharen said:
Another well made game was Michael Jacksons moonwalk.
Haha! Wow, I totally would've mentioned that game if I'd remembered. It's odd to say this about something Michael Jackson themed, but it really was such an amazingly fun game (of course, back then, I think he was still black and making awesome music). Too bad one of my brother's stupid friends stole it a long, long time ago and I no longer have it. Argh...
 
The way *I* see it it is a good thing people think PC gaming is dead. For me, it was never alive to begin with. PC gaming doesn't deal well with the kind of attitude game houses are having. PC's are not for mainstream hits nor for mainstream gamers, as game houses want it to be. That's partly the reason why they say it's dead, and in what concerns me, the deader the better, as it's surely a sign those houses are going away from him. Even though the biggest best-seller in the gaming industry is PC only (The Sims), that doesn't mean PC isn't an "underground" "hardcore" machine by default, that pleases at the same time both an extremely casual audience and the most hardcore audience of them all. PC's are made for game lovers/maker/fans. You don't make a game on a console, you make it on PC and then port it. You don't mod a game on a console, you mod it on PC, and that's that! People don't want to face it, but the only reason why PC gaming is dead is because game studios never cared and never really will care (I belive) about those kind of gamers: the hardcore gamers, the PC hardcore gamers.

[edit]I felt I missed something: if you don't believe in what I say, think a bit. Remember how big consoles where some years ago? like the 80's and 90's? PC game has NEVER had such a mainstream audience, that's a fact. Remember Simon the Sorcerer and the likes? By that time, what were the hot games on consoles? Mario, Zelda, Sonic? I don't know, but all those names I referred are more than games, they are mainstream non-gamer icons that get spread all over. They are cultural icons sometimes, Mario and Sonic at least. That NEVER happened with any PC franchise, as it has been always bound to the hardcore audience. Just the same way, there are a lot of large sequel threads on the consoles, while in the PC you only have a few of those. Ultima? Might and Magic? And that's probably it. And those were never mainstream hits to begin with, at least not mainstream in the sense we give it now. Think about it.[/edit]

As for hardcore definition, no professional gamer is hardcore, so that leaves CS compulsive players out of the equation. Also, no game junkie is hardcore by any means, so that also leaves WOW players out of the equation. Graphic whores are not hardcore too, unless they have something else. What's that something else? Understanding of gaming. If you don't understand what you're playing, you are not hardcore. You understand, you are. And console gamers don't usually understand what they play, unlike PC gamers.

Now, I'm certain there are a lot of PC assholes that understand as much about games as my grandma and still play them fervorously. But that kind of gamers were brought by the mainstream wave of PC games, or are just beginners. It is my belief, and I am almost certain of it, that if you only play PC games for more that two/three years, you will either quit PC gaming for a more cheap platform, or you'll become hardcore.

As a matter of fact, PC gaming is not dead by ANY means. It outsells ALL consoles by a large margin. A very very large margin. Remember: games bought online are not taken into account, online fees such as WoW's are also not taken into account, casual games are usually not taken into account too. I don't have references here though, and I don't like that, as I'd love to prove it... :( Anyone?
 
Games on PCs will not go away anytime soon. PCs have too large an installed base for that. Many AAA game developers put out a version of their game for all the major platforms (PC, 360, PS3) since all represent profit potential.

Consoles are a bargain. When released to market, the 360 (for example) sold for ~$400, it matched a PC selling for ~$1500. Of course, time marches on and the value advantage becomes less every year (on the other hand, console prices drop too). Because they are a bargain, a lot of people who cannot afford a high-end gaming PC are better off with a console.

However, developers sometimes develop to the lowest-common-denominator of the platforms (PC, 360, PS3). At times, that does "screw" the owner of a higher-end PC gaming machine.

I would rather see game versions customized to get the best out of each platform -- which happens occasionally but not always.
 
I think that PC games market will not die, because there are a lot of small/independent developers that make games without the absurd costs of console game development.

I think PC gaming will go back to the state when developers like Microprose or Origin ruled the market...
 
Allen63 said:
Consoles are a bargain. When released to market, the 360 (for example) sold for ~$400, it matched a PC selling for ~$1500.
bullocks...

you're missing that:
1) if you dont count the TV into the Xbrick price, you shouldnt count that screen in the PC price. 1500$ is a stupid amount pulled out of your ass. unless you strictly shop at HP or Dell ofc. (and yeah, i can watch tv on my pc...)
2) a PC is far more multipurpose and versatile than an xbrick. added features are not taken into account.
3) price of brandnew games and extra content are not mentioned. a PC game on average costs 33% less than an Xbrick360 game (or even less in cases of small publishers).

all added together? the PC is a bargain...
 
I owned a nintendo 64 and later bought myself a gamecube

with both i had a lot of fun while i was playing pc games too (dune 2000 <3<3<3)
however, after the gamecube (which was imho a really great console, probably even better than the xbox, but because of nintendo there were only a few 3rd party games :< ) i decided not to buy one of the current generation consoles

xbox360- hardly any games, and if there are good ones, they are mostly released on pc as well (or a bit later)
wii- for casual gamers, and a pretty trashy console (inaccurate remote control thing)
ps3- too expensive, and as opposited to its predecessors, there aren't many third party games, which is very annoying because i would have bought the ps3 exactly for those (and for the ps1 /2 games- then they removed the chips in the european version -_- )
well, ps3 would be my favourite choice, but it's too pricy, it should be reduced to about 400 euro. Then a lot more people would buy it, the 3rd party game developers would notice that and react on it by making games for ps3 (probably also some exclusives) and in the end there would be a lot more ps3 sales because there are more games available for it....

it's just shit :D
 
Wait when did the console win against the PC?

Last time I checked every genre that isn't Street Fighter / Mortal Combat / Tekken / Whatever-Beat'em Ups is hands down better on the PC than on a console.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think I am.
 
Allen63 said:
Games on PCs will not go away anytime soon. PCs have too large an installed base for that. Many AAA game developers put out a version of their game for all the major platforms (PC, 360, PS3) since all represent profit potential.
I think the point is that games made specifically for PCs are declining, not that the number of games available to be played on PCs as a whole is declining. Cross platform games don't count, because if it's made concurrently on the console or made on the console first and ported to the PC, at the very least concessions were made for the fact that the game is going to be controlled with a controller rather than the keyboard and mouse combo. Of course, due to the attitudes of most major game developers, you also get other concessions to the console market as well (i.e. dumbing down, foolish things like mandatory Achievements (which I hate), etc. and so on).
Mura said:
Wait when did the console win against the PC?

Last time I checked every genre that isn't Street Fighter / Mortal Combat / Tekken / Whatever-Beat'em Ups is hands down better on the PC than on a console.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think I am.
Well you're wrong. There are plenty of great games on consoles asides from fighting games that do in fact beat most PC games in terms of quality.

It's not really about consoles "winning" against the PC. The whole idea of a platform war with winners and losers is absurd in the first place. Attitudes need to shift from the foolishness of platform loyality to an attitude of quality game loyality. Unfortunately, in a society driven by money, it's inevitable that any large game developer is going to give in to lowest-common-denominator game development, because the men-in-suits want their money. They don't care about quality games. So it's up to the consumers to speak with the voice they have: their wallet.

'Course, problem always is that stupid and/or uncaring people's money spends the same as anyone else's. And there's a lot more of 'em.

Hrm, not sure my ranting is entirely decipherable, but ah well.
 
ID and Epic games should be looking at themselves instead of blaming DX10 cards.

Their poor PC sales aren't caused by a lack of people with powerful enough PCs, it's caused by mediocre sequels of sequels that only boast new graphic engines but still have the same gameplay as Quake 2.

Look at Half Life 2, when released you needed a top of the line PC to enjoy the maximum settings, but it was highly scalable for lower end PCs. Also it had fun gameplay with some cool innovations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_video_games
Half-Life 2 (4 million)[109] Does not include sales through Steam.

Don't say PC gaming is dead when it's simply PC gamers refusing to buy your trash games.
 
Time again for Dark Legacy's amazing simplification skills:

PC Gaming - "I want to have fun alone."
Console Gaming - "I want to have fun with, or entertain my friends."
 
Who else believes that the demo of the radiant A.I that was shown at the E3 was nothing but a big scriptfest ? I mean, seriously...Compare that to the actual AI in Oblivion.
 
It's not like they hadn't used scripts with Oblivion before for E3 and maybe other such showcases and then called that AI.
 
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