Playstation 2...

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Okay it has been a while since I last posted anything on this Message Board but I think the following argument deserves some attention. I think the most dubious facet of Fallout 1 & 2 is the fact that it was released solely on the system that it was. I think FO 1 & 2 should have been released on a console four and three years ago and taking into consideration how much the set top console industry as grown in the past three years I can see no reason for Fallout 3 not to make an apearance on a forthcoming console, most notably the PS2. I'd love to hear any arguments for and/or against.

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Umm... FO just would not work on a console, and besides, the more developer friendly Gamecube would be a better choice if they did port it (yeah right).
 
The Dreamcast is going to disappear come the next system (as all Sega systems do). PS2 is the worst system in terms of power. Gamecube will be catering to the younger crowd (although, I'll buy it if they release Metroid & Zelda). Which leaves the X-Box.

Skie
 
This is something I always hoped Interplay would try and do. If Fallout 1 or 2 was on one of the consoles I believe it would have sold very well (considering some of the shit games on those consoles outsold Fallout 1 and 2 combined). Gamecube and/or XBox are much better suited for Fallout 3 than Dreamcast or PS2. Hopefully Interplay and Black Isle will take this into consideration at least.
 
It's all about which system has the best third party developers. Without them, you wouldn't have games like Silent Hill or Metal Gear Solid. The system that can get most of these developers working for them will get my gaming dollar. Anyone agree?
 
I don't think Fallout would be produced for a console unless they tone down the sex a bit. You know, it's weird that violence is O.K., but the thought of sex scares some people. You know that console producers try to keep "objectional" material off the market, or toned down, right?I just think a lot of what Fallout is would be lost when they tone it down.

Bring on the criticism!:P
 
Right. The PS2 will sell TREMENDOUSLY much more than either the X-box or the Gamecube (wasn't it called Dolphin? Never mind), because it has a reputation for being the... i don't know, not best, but it's... maybe it's because it's cheap? At least the PS is the most popular. It may be because, as you said, the best games are for the PS. Nintendo can only make cuddly pokemons and Yoshi's stories, and the dreamcast doesn't seem to have anything but sports games, if i'm right. The playstation has Metal Gear Solid.

Maybe it's the marketing? Maybe it's the design? Maybe it's the color? Anyway, Sony is the clear winner in consoles.
 
Well, to be honest, I more into the vein of Silent Hill. Damn creepiest game ever made... I love it!
 
It may sell more, but not as a console system. In fact, there is only about one game sold for every two consoles, not good at all.

Not to mention that fact that it's an absolute bitch to develop for. For example, Yoshiki Okamoto, director of Capcom stated that "The graphical limitations of the PlayStation 2 hardware could be reached only if the system had four times as much RAM." Ouch. Furthermore, Hideo Kojima, the man behind Metal Gear Solid 2 said, "When PlayStation 2 was first announced, Sony said you could get Hollywood movie graphics quality, and that is true. But if we tried to create Metal Gear Solid 2 trying to maintain that quality of graphics throughout the game… we cannot do it. If you take a game like Tekken Tag (a fighting game from Namco) where you have only two models and rendered backgrounds, you can probably do it. But with Metal Gear Solid and its 3-D environment, you just cannot do it." That's not as bad as what Okamoto said, but further disapproval from Kojima was shown by this excerpt from an interview by MSNBC:

MSNBC: Did you have any idea you could get such great graphics out of PlayStation 2?

Kojima: "I was actually expecting something much better, and we were not getting what we expected. In the early days I really dreaded going to work because I knew we were not going to get what we expected."

He "dreaded going to work"? Ouch! I hate to burst the bubbles of the many Sony fans out there, but it's shaping up to be Gamecube for this generation of consoles.

Sorry to rant.
 
What? I thought MGS1 had really good graphics for a PS1 game. Why do they need so realistic graphics? It'll always the best game ever made anyway.

Silent Hill didn't do it for me. There has never been such a moment in gaming as when you stand crack-reflexed ready with your FAMAS, ready to fire at sight, and you burst to death the first Genome soldier that comes out, only to hear him say "Snaaaake" in Meryl's voice.
 
Why in the hell would anyone of you people want Fallout on consoles when u have computers anyway?

The concern is to port console games to computers not computers to console games.

Playing Starcraft on a N64 is just downright weird...
 
cause fallout 2 works crappy unless you have an ultra fast computer. you know, slow load time and save gliches
 
In reply to arguments against:
Every new system has a learning curve when it comes to development whether you'd like to admit it or not and Nintendo are a company who would be the least I'd trust. The only companies who have their paws on one of these Gamecube development tools is those companies with a deep vested interest within Nintendo besides Gamecube looks like one of those waste bins you find in a public park, it is goofy to say the least. The use of Matsushita's optical discs is a poor move compared to Sony's use of an industry standard CD/DVD because Matsushita's discs only carry up to one and a half GBs whilst DVD can store in excess of 6 GBs as well as being able to take advantage of the huge libraries of audio CD and constantly growing, consistently supported DVD movie format. The question for the regular consumer becomes "Should I by a 100 dollar VCR or 300 dollar DVD player or a 300 dollar playstation library/ new entertainment devise/ DVD player/ audio CD player/ internet devise to replace my ten year old VCR?" The Xbox is one that I feel has a good running with PS2 and I'm not one to compare the two because I feel they both have very bright futures.
I think it is far too early to assume which system would be best for FO3, anyway they could all support FO3 perfectly. I think it's safe to say that it should be released on a console or how Sony puts it a "Computer Entertainment System" because while you can play it on your computer I think that the series could reach a much wider audience on a set top box.


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"Every new system has a learning curve when it comes to development whether you'd like to admit it or not"

I never denied that, nor did I imply that. The simple fact is that it's a bad sign when an experienced developer dreads going to work, regardless of the learning curve. It's also important to realize that if a system has a very large learning curve, it's going to affect games and turn off developers. This is shown well with the N64. The system was very difficult to develop for and as such came up second.

"Nintendo are a company who would be the least I'd trust"

I'd like to answer this, but there is a definite lack of supporting arguments so I'm not really even sure what you're refering to when you say trust.

"The only companies who have their paws on one of these Gamecube development tools is those companies with a deep vested interest within Nintendo"

Many major development companies (including Square) have kits and several minor companies have received software tools. The Gamecube is going to launch with a very nice selection of titles including 5 first/second party games, an original Resident Evil game and possibly Too Human, which was cancelled for the PS(nya nya! :P) and revamped for the Gamecube.

"besides Gamecube looks like one of those waste bins you find in a public park, it is goofy to say the least."

While it is rather odd looking, I personally don't care how a system looks. Instead, I prefer to look at performance and games when making a purchase.

"The use of Matsushita's optical discs is a poor move compared to Sony's use of an industry standard CD/DVD because Matsushita's discs only carry up to one and a half GBs whilst DVD can store in excess of 6 GBs"

This initially shocked me, too, but I soon realised that it didn't matter too much. 1.5GB should be more than sufficient for any game that will be released in a system's life. After all, one only needs to look at current examples. I wouldn't have expected to see the Resident Evil games, one of the PS's most profitable series, on the N64 and yet Capcom managed to cram all of RE2, including cinematics, on a 64MB cartridge and even included a hi-res mode and surround-sound support! Also, most of the PS2 games, all but one or two in fact, at the Japanese launch were on CDs, which only hold about 650MB. It's clearly not that big of an issue.

"The question for the regular consumer becomes "Should I by a 100 dollar VCR or 300 dollar DVD player or a 300 dollar playstation library/ new entertainment devise/ DVD player/ audio CD player/ internet devise to replace my ten year old VCR?""

By the time the Gamecube launches, most people will have DVD players and nearly everyone will have some kind of CD player, so it's really a moot point. In fact, it could end up working in Nintendo's favor. Since a, thusfar, relatively small percentage of PS2s sold are even accompanied by a game, developers might shy away from the system.

"The Xbox is one that I feel has a good running with PS2"

It's really to early to judge, considering that we don't even have Xbox's final stats yet. However, I think that the Xbox is going to suffer because of cost and development difficulty. All in all, this is going to be an interesting console war.

PS-Please take some time when you reply, you can have as much as you'd like and your last message was so rushed that it was nearly incoherent.
 
Why not the Playstation 2...

I can think of one huge reason not to have Fallout 3 on a console.. The lack of save game storage space.

Ever wonder why console RPGs are basically linear and fairly low on content? That's because they can't afford much in terms of depth. You only have so much space for quest bitfields, character info, and party info. This is DRASTICALLY opposed to Fallout and Fallout 2 where it had to save all the information from every town you've done something in.
 
RE: Why not the Playstation 2...

>I can think of one huge
>reason not to have Fallout
>3 on a console.. The
>lack of save game storage
>space.
>
x-box and gamecube will have hard-disks,so that shouldn`t be a problem.
ps2 was going to be released in the states and europe with a hard-disk, i think they`re going to be sold separately now,i`m not sure.
look, consoles are getting more and more like pcs, so more devellopers are going to release their games in several platforms, combyning the huge console sales with the better profits by unit sold of the pc.that may apply to f3, i`ll leave that discussion for you
 
The X-Box will be quite easy to develop for due to directx and opengl which are both excellent API's. A PC game will be easily ported to the X-Box if MS holds true to their word.

http://www.crazyvasey.f2s.com
 
If there's one thing all consoles miss...

Its a GOOD, NON-LINEAR RPG! However, till now that wasn't possible, there were just to many options in the REAL RPG's. But now, the next generation of consoles will be able to support these, think keyboards and mousepads.
It isn't THAT bad an idea. As for the graphics and sound, Fo (2) would have easily ran on the PSX or Nintendo 64, it's all in the options.

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I’m going to reply in a design similar to Doyle’s.

“The simple fact is that it's a bad sign when an experienced developer dreads going to work, regardless of the learning curve. It's also important to realize that if a system has a very large learning curve, it's going to affect games and turn off developers.”

You are in effect saying “A learning curve is unlearnable.” The reason Playstation 2 is “so hard” to develop for is because it is so open ended. Are you a developer? Does “assembler” mean anything to you?

“The Gamecube is going to launch with a very nice selection of titles including 5 first/second party games, an original Resident Evil game and possibly Too Human…blah blah blah”

That’s seven games right? PS2 is going to release with T_H_I_R_T_Y, one, two, thwee tymez TEN.

“1.5GB should be more than sufficient for any game that will be released in a system's life. After all, one only needs to look at current examples. I wouldn't have expected to see the Resident Evil games, one of the PS's most profitable series, on the N64 and yet Capcom managed to cram all of RE2, including cinematics, on a 64MB cartridge and even included a hi-res mode and surround-sound support! Also, most of the PS2 games, all but one or two in fact, at the Japanese launch were on CDs, which only hold about 650MB. It's clearly not that big of an issue.”

B-U-L-L-S-H-I-T!!!!!!!! Memory is EVERYTHING! In two years the average computer will have over 2GB of RAM! I haven’t played RE2 on the N64 and I don’t plan on it but I doubt all 1000 MBs of RE2 could fit on a N64 cartridge. B-U-L-L-S-H-I-T!!!!!!!! You aren’t convincing anyone.

“By the time the Gamecube launches, most people will have DVD players and nearly everyone will have some kind of CD player, so it's really a moot point. “
Yeah and most of those DVD players will be PS2s, trust me, anyway no one wants to buy a 400 dollar purple cube to stink up their living room. The only people that the Gamecube might attract are children who won’t be allowed to play Fallout and they won’t have the money either, so it’s really a moot point. “moot point?”

PS-Go back to the cave you dug yourself out of. You gave advise and I give you advise yu mrn.:P


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"You are in effect saying “A learning curve is unlearnable.”"

Umm... No. But I am saying that a very steep learning curve is a bad thing. When Sony developed the PS2, they paid no attention to ease of development, and as a result ended up with a machine that, while powerful, is less than the sum of it's parts. This will undoubtedly turn off many developers.

"The reason Playstation 2 is “so hard” to develop for is because it is so open ended."

No, it's hard to develop for because, like I said earlier, Sony paid little to no attention to making the maching easy to develop for, I've already provided you with quotes that prove that.

Are you a developer? Does “assembler” mean anything to you?"

No, but it doesn't matter if I'm a developer. I gave you quotes from major developers supporting what I say.

"That’s seven games right? PS2 is going to release with T_H_I_R_T_Y, one, two, thwee tymez TEN."

No, those were specifics that I listed. In fact, all but the RE title are first/second party games, with very nice franchises like Mario, Donkey Kong, and Metroid. There is no doubt that Nintendo and their second party developers make the best software in the world, and five of those titles will be accompanied by numerous third party games. The Gamecube won't suffer a lack of good software by any means.

"B-U-L-L-S-H-I-T!!!!!!!! Memory is EVERYTHING! In two years the average computer will have over 2GB of RAM!"

First of all, RAM is completely different than disk space, which is what you are talking about. Since you consider it to be so important, I'd like to take this oppurtunity to point out that the NGC will have more RAM then the PS2.

"I haven’t played RE2 on the N64 and I don’t plan on it but I doubt all 1000 MBs of RE2 could fit on a N64 cartridge. B-U-L-L-S-H-I-T!!!!!!!! You aren’t convincing anyone."

Once again, you seem to be throwing out your arms and screaming "I AM IGNORAGNT AND PROUD OF IT!!!!" Since you have never played RE64, I suggest you check out reviews from reliable websites and magazines. Hell, I'll do it for you!

"The Nintendo 64 version of Resident Evil 2 plays identically to the PlayStation game of the same name" -IGN64 http://ign64.ign.com/

Go ahead and visit the site, on the RE2 review, you'll find media of the cinematic sequences. As for you declaration of PS2's vast superiority for having larger disk capacity (by the way, it holds 4.7 gigs, not 6 like you said earlier) the NGC disk supports hot-swapping, so capacity isn't a problem in the least bit. Plus, the disk reads faster than a PS2 disk and is *much* more resistant to piracy, which is going to save money for both Nintendo and developers.

"IGNcube: So do you think the decision to go with the 8cm Gamecube Disc is kind of a statement from Nintendo that Gamecube doesn't play DVD-movies?

Jim: You have to decide that you don't want to play DVD movies before you can go to the smaller disc. So there were a lot of design ideas why we wanted to go with the smaller media. There were technological advantages to it over the standard DVD. Aside from the fact that standard DVD applies conformance to the regular shape and capacity, it also applies a royalty to the DVD Consortium -- something we didn't need to pay if we weren't going to offer movie playback. But the piracy issue is also a really big one for us and having the smaller format addresses that. There are also speed issues that are of benefit with the 8cm discs too."-From an IGNcube (http://cube.ign.com/) interview with VP of Corporate Affairs Perrin Kaplan and Technical Director Jim Merrick for Nintendo

"no one wants to buy a 400 dollar purple cube to stink up their living room"

Well, more blatant ignorance on your part. The NGC(Nintendo Gamecube in case you haven't picked up on that yet)has already been shown in nine different colors and more will be ready before launch, so the ludicrous purple color isn't an issue at all. More importantly, the NGC won't cost $400; it will be about $200. Needless to say, price is a major concern with most buyers and will be a major factor in the console wars.

"The only people that the Gamecube might attract are children who won’t be allowed to play Fallout"

Uhh.... ok. As I mentioned earlier, the NGC will probably lauch with an original RE game and Too Human, not to mention the fact that it will have games like Perfect Dark and a sequel to the promising Eternal Darkness on the way. It will easily cater to more adult audiences.

"children who won’t be allowed to play Fallout"

Fallout isn't coming out on a console, and I doubt it ever will.

P.S. Do some research when you post; you'll look less foolish.
 
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