Realistic Arroyo, Fallout 2 setting improvement project v.1

[Human Shield]

I made this simple mod for Fallout 2. Download and extract to Fallout 2 folder.

It replaces the temple of trails with a short path, provides a reason for the crops failing, changes most of the dialogue. The village knows about technology (they have been trading), only the Elder and Shaman talk of holy quests and Chosen Ones. The GECK will save the village and that is what matters. Arroyo is a small, isolated shady sands type place now; not a group of primitives then filled a temple with traps and has a town full of guns close by.

I'd like you guys to try it out. I would've liked Fallout 2 being remade to solidify the setting, but I guess I'd have to do it myself. It will mostly be rewriting dialogue, I would spent a lot of time looking up functions and working the mapper to create new things is annoying, so help would be nice.

Future plans:

Limit Easter Eggs.
Reduce talking Death Claws to primitive group with only one leader, few able to parrot words and point to things.
Remove Hublogists.
Fix New Reno to trading center with rival groups, not prohibition-gangster/"OMG drugz and whorez" town.
Overhaul San Francisco, no more Kung-Fu town with scientists and advanced weapons; probably the most changes.
Remove force fields and advanced tech from NCR.
Take out easy loot from Navarro base, try to improve balance.
Do something with Redding.
Change real-world weapons.
Would like to find a way to replace gold coins with caps (have HUB influence).
Maybe change Vault City, and make it the only advanced place.

Sugguestions?

 

[Big T]

Re: Realistic Arroyo, Fallout 2 setting improvement project

Interesting idea I always thought that Arroyo's total descent into tribalism was stupid (after only 80 years from being founded by somebody at least somewhat familiar with technology) and it would make more sense for it to be a "rural backwater" type village rather than a tribal one. But I do have one problem with the further ideas:

Would like to find a way to replace gold coins with caps (have HUB influence).

That would render Redding completely useless, as well as some of the caravans.

 

[Human Shield]

Why isn't Redding being taken over if they have the only gold mine and can magically mint coins. The HUB routes and influence would say around, NCR worked on caps when it was Sandy Sands.

And I liked the caps and plain didn't like gold coins.

 

[Wild_qwerty]

God work! I will try and get the time to download it and try it out.

 

[Big T]

Why isn't Redding being taken over if they have the only gold mine and can magically mint coins. The HUB routes and influence would say around, NCR worked on caps when it was Sandy Sands.
And I liked the caps and plain didn't like gold coins.

I never said it was a bad idea, I was simply pointing out that it would involve quite a large change to the game world.
I have no big problem with gold coins, it is posible, if not plausible, but bottle caps do fit better.

 

[Tannhauser]

Human Shield, may I say good work, and good luck on your project.

I have made a news post about you, so this thread garners more attention. Hopefully advice from people pointed here will help you out.

I also suggest you upload the mod to NMA, you can do so here.

 

[Tempistfury]

I thought the HUB got wrecked by the Mutants (atleasty thats the ending I always got in FO1)

I always felt the Gold counts looked like crushed bottle caps. (bottle caps covered in gold?)

Redding isn't being taken over because aparently military intervention woul dstart a war? New Reno, Vault City and NCR were all influencing redding in an attempt to take it over non violently. Personally I never understood why the NCR didnt just come in and TAKE EVERYTHING, what with their massive population and all (i think it was 900,000 some people)

Uh oh yeah, anyway, I'm gonna give the mod a Try, and If I dont like it just get rid of it. Cant hurt to give someoneelses view of the Fallout Universe a shot.

 

[Do0Fu5]

i have seen a few mods and i must say some of them were interesting. but i feel this one is changing things to how this particular person thought fallout should be. i think your perceptions on it are a moot point. perhaps they should have been like that, but they werent. and now all the things that you are trying to 'fix' are actually some of the qualitys that define fallout.

easter eggs were ace in fallout. it showed you the programmers were real people having fun making the game as we were having fun playing it.

bleh i have to go play cs. nutshell, ur changes suck.

 

[Ashmo]

I thought the HUB got wrecked by the Mutants (atleasty thats the ending I always got in FO1)

I always felt the Gold counts looked like crushed bottle caps. (bottle caps covered in gold?)

Redding isn't being taken over because aparently military intervention woul dstart a war? New Reno, Vault City and NCR were all influencing redding in an attempt to take it over non violently. Personally I never understood why the NCR didnt just come in and TAKE EVERYTHING, what with their massive population and all (i think it was 900,000 some people)

Uh oh yeah, anyway, I'm gonna give the mod a Try, and If I dont like it just get rid of it. Cant hurt to give someoneelses view of the Fallout Universe a shot.

I think the 900,000 was all of the NCR, not only Shady (formerly Shady Sands, in FO2 just "NCR"), wasn't it?

The one thing I always did when tinkering with the game was putting swag into the Arroyo village: a 10mm pistol without ammo, sunglasses, stuff like that. Mostly junk, but having that stuff around made the village feel a bit less degenerated.

 

[Torpedo]

I think this looks interesting.

There was a lot of things in FO2 that, IMO at least, didn't fit or broke the continuity. My main gripe was the "real" weapons they decided to add to the game (OK, FO1 had the Mauser and the Desert Eagle, but 2 entries can be ignored). According to the FO Bible, the FO timeline diverged violently from ours some time after WWII. Assuming that the specific weapons manufacturers still came to be AND created the exact same weapons as they did in our timeline is a pretty big leap of faith for me.

 

[Do0Fu5]

just for the sake of whoever edited my post, firstly, you are IS you're, you retard, and i meant ur, because i was in a rush. im aware 'fallout fans have an imagie of being arseholes to keep up' but chances are im a bigger fan than you are, so chill

 

[Oracle]

just for the sake of whoever edited my post, firstly, you are IS you're, you retard, and i meant {I'm trying to say your, you are, or you're, but I'm likely too stupid to know which to use.}, because i was in a rush. im aware 'fallout fans have an imagie of being arseholes to keep up' but chances are im a bigger fan than you are, so chill

lol. Sorry but I thought that was pretty funny....
It's automatically done by the forums. You better edit your post or you make you self look retarded...no offence tho


On topic I like your idea. I'm surely going to try on my next run. I hated the temple that why i always sneaked through the bushes back to the village. Jus tag your sneak skill and check out that one special tree ....... Actually that wasn't a bad idea was it ? I just removed some trees to skip the temple. It was alway a pain in the ass when you where trying new mods

I wish you good luck with you mod. hope it turns out well

 

[Do0Fu5]

lol yeh, that is pretty funny actually. but i dont much care lol, shows i deserve me name

 

[Melchoir]

Very good work Human Shield.

Maybe I'll download it sometime and check it out.

 

[mad]

Great work Human Shield . . if you ever feel like working in a team, you might wanna apply to NWS

 

[Per]

Re: Realistic Arroyo, Fallout 2 setting improvement project

Take out easy loot from Navarro base, try to improve balance.

A simple way to do this without taking anything out is to put a level restriction (say, 15) on Matt's quest. You'd have to apply this to the Shi and Hubologist replacements as well, since they also put Navarro on the map.

Would like to find a way to replace gold coins with caps (have HUB influence).

The bottlecap economy wouldn't make any sense on a large scale, or at the very least, it couldn't possibly be the only form of currency around. I'd stick with the gold.

 

[mEtaLL1x]

no offense, but this mod is NONSENSE!

In pursuit of realism you actually intend to crush the very foundation of Fallout, it's originality, it's diversity!

Limit Easter Eggs.

No way! Fallout has probably the best easter eggs I have ever seen and you wish to limit them?

Fix New Reno to trading center with rival groups, not prohibition-gangster/"OMG drugz and whorez" town.

If you do this, Reno will lose all its charm. If you think that "mobster" style was stupid, then think again. It is one of the most stylish towns in FO2.

Maybe change Vault City, and make it the only advanced place.

Oh my god! How can such racist/conservative town be the only advanced place??? Maybe after Chosen's intervention it *may* become advanced, but otherwise it's shithole, it doesn't even have a stable power-supply. And the problems with Gecko... This town is doomed.

Would like to find a way to replace gold coins with caps (have HUB influence).

HUB was leveled in FO1, what hub influence are you talking about?

Overhaul San Francisco, no more Kung-Fu town with scientists and advanced weapons; probably the most changes.

Why the hell do you think that Kung-fu and science can't coexist? Is kung-fu some nonexistent, alien thing?? No.

Reduce talking Death Claws to primitive group with only one leader, few able to parrot words and point to things.

Please refer to Fallout Bible for info on Deathclaws. There were intelligent specimens, it cannot be denied! If you change that, you'll ruin the game design.

Anyway, the only reasonable change is

Take out easy loot from Navarro base, try to improve balance.

because fast APA-runs in the beginning of the game is a cheat and it would be good to have it eliminated.


Summary:
You should first read Fallout Bible more closely, and then try to make fallout "realistic"!
Here's one excerpt:

The decision to make the Arroyo culture "tribals" was most likely a game logic/thematic one (as plot devices tend to be). There was a certain atmosphere that the F2 initial design team established with the tribal culture in Fallout 2, and I think they just wanted to play around with the fact that the player was from a primitive, non-technological, ancestor-worshipping culture. It was a way of bringing the history of the Vault Dweller from the past into the present, and provides a nice backdrop for the events in the game.

In terms of game design, tribal Arroyo is a very good thing. It shows that after nuclear war the civilization is tattered and along with gauss rifles there are also spears.


You may think I'm too zealous to keeping the old standarts, but I just want to keep the spirit of Fallout!
It's just my opinion, so you may ignore me.

 

[Ashmo]

no offense, but this mod is NONSENSE!

In pursuit of realism you actually intend to crush the very foundation of Fallout, it's originality, it's diversity!

Look, smart-ass, there are people who consider Fallout 2 to be quite un-Fallout-y.
This is a mod that makes Fallout 2 more like Fallout 1.

Limit Easter Eggs.

No way! Fallout has probably the best easter eggs I have ever seen and you wish to limit them?

Even people who liked Fallout 2 a LOT have agreed it's overrun by easter eggs. I think even some developers stated that they went a bit overboard there.

Fix New Reno to trading center with rival groups, not prohibition-gangster/"OMG drugz and whorez" town.

If you do this, Reno will lose all its charm. If you think that "mobster" style was stupid, then think again. It is one of the most stylish towns in FO2.

New Reno has been agreed on to be one of the least Fallouty places in Fallout 2. Play Fallout 1 before you claim that a town like this fits in perfectly.

Maybe change Vault City, and make it the only advanced place.

Oh my god! How can such racist/conservative town be the only advanced place??? Maybe after Chosen's intervention it *may* become advanced, but otherwise it's shithole, it doesn't even have a stable power-supply. And the problems with Gecko... This town is doomed.

It's the only town that really did the transition insisted by pre-war technicians: Vault -> GECK -> City. They are also the only city with a working vault contained within.
It makes a lot of sense.

Would like to find a way to replace gold coins with caps (have HUB influence).

HUB was leveled in FO1, what hub influence are you talking about?

Hub was leveled in FO1 for many people, but not for all. There was an internal timer determining how far the mutants would come if you weren't fast enough. That doesn't say anything about how Fallout ends. Apparently FO2 is based on the best possible ending.

Overhaul San Francisco, no more Kung-Fu town with scientists and advanced weapons; probably the most changes.

Why the hell do you think that Kung-fu and science can't coexist? Is kung-fu some nonexistent, alien thing?? No.

It is not exactly typically Fallout. I don't think there was an awful lot of kung fu in 50s science fiction pulp.

Reduce talking Death Claws to primitive group with only one leader, few able to parrot words and point to things.

Please refer to Fallout Bible for info on Deathclaws. There were intelligent specimens, it cannot be denied! If you change that, you'll ruin the game design.

The deathclaws in Fallout 1 couldn't talk. The ones in Fallout 2 were a subspecies, they were advanced. Having every deathclaw in the game be capable of talking is a flaw in the design. Even the deathclaws stated talking would be difficult to learn for them.

Anyway, the only reasonable change is

Take out easy loot from Navarro base, try to improve balance.

because fast APA-runs in the beginning of the game is a cheat and it would be good to have it eliminated.

That is the only potentially unneccessary change as it is a player decision to exploit Navarro.

Summary:
You should first read Fallout Bible more closely, and then try to make fallout "realistic"!

You should first get a clue before you post "facts".

Here's one excerpt:

The decision to make the Arroyo culture "tribals" was most likely a game logic/thematic one (as plot devices tend to be). There was a certain atmosphere that the F2 initial design team established with the tribal culture in Fallout 2, and I think they just wanted to play around with the fact that the player was from a primitive, non-technological, ancestor-worshipping culture. It was a way of bringing the history of the Vault Dweller from the past into the present, and provides a nice backdrop for the events in the game.

In terms of game design, tribal Arroyo is a very good thing. It shows that after nuclear war the civilization is tattered and along with gauss rifles there are also spears.

The design was flawed and exaggerated. It also lacked logical justification. Just that the design was based on "playing around" with an idea doesn't mean the design fits with the design of Fallout 1. If Fallout 1 were like its initial design you'd possibly see lizardmen or something run around in Fallout 2 by now.

The idea of this mod is to make Fallout 2 a better sequel, not to improve the game as a stand-alone title.

You may think I'm too zealous to keeping the old standarts, but I just want to keep the spirit of Fallout!
It's just my opinion, so you may ignore me.

You don't want to keep the spirit of Fallout, you want to keep the atmosphere and design of Fallout 2, which enough people dislike to justify the existence of this very good mod.

Before you offend a very innovative mod just because you personally don't like it, please look at what other people who know a lot about Fallout have said about the same issues the mod addresses. In this case you would have noticed that this mod intends to solve a lot of the issues pointed out as major flaws in the storyline and consistency with Fallout 1.

Hadn't you wanted to offend the maker of this mod, you wouldn't have called it "nonsense", which really just is a parent-safe term for "bullshit".

 

[mEtaLL1x]

As I said, it's my opinion.
Don't like it? Ignore it.

Anyways, I got your point.

there are people who consider Fallout 2 to be quite un-Fallout-y.

But tell me please, what is "fallouty" then?

 

[Ashmo]

As I said, it's my opinion.
Don't like it? Ignore it.

Anyways, I got your point.

there are people who consider Fallout 2 to be quite un-Fallout-y.

But tell me please, what is "fallouty" then?

Maybe... ::drum-roll:: Fallout 1?