Saw 2 is coming!

Big T said:
[Movies are] just another way to get retards to buy more overpriced tickets, soda, and candy.

See, I don't agree: I think most -Hollywood- movies are. But if you watch some of the real artistic stuff, you'll find some good brians behind them. recommendations: 'Metropolis' and 'Nosferatu'; two black and white classics, as well as 'Amilie' and 'Momento'; two newer, more mainstream gems. Plus, theres a fair number of hollywood movies that are better than the average shit that go unnoticed because they don't make it big: one great example is 'Road To Perdition', the Tom Hanks gangster movie that came out a few years back, as well as 'The Big Lebowski' by the Cohen brothers in the late 90's.

As for 'Saw', I admit the idea had some potential. But I'm sick of movies based on shock value and glorification of wickedness. If you want a movie to make you vomit, watch anything by John Waters (particularly 'Pink Flamingos'), but when I go to the movies I want to see something that took some talent and thought to create.
 
How exactly Saw is glorifying wickedness or violence or whatever is beyond me. Apparently now everything that is over-violent (and really, Saw wasn't) is glorifying violence. *yawn* Give me a break!

Oh, yeah, Saw 2 sucked. Saw 1 was OK, almost good.
 
I'm not saying that everything overly violent glorifies it, far from it. Example: Oliver Stone's "Natural Born Killers" is a movie that shows Violence in a purposely glorified way, in order to show how crazy a society that glorifies violence is. Another similar example is Kubrek's "Clockwork Orange".

But as for 'Saw', I see it like this: by showing a serial killer who slaughters people inorder to test their morality, it somehow places the killer above morality. Also, by alowing this killer to escape unharmed, and having those who are trying to bring him to justice only get killed, that makes the killer, the guy doing all the evil, wicked, violent things, glorified. As far as I'm concerned, it'd be a far strech for anyone to say that 'Saw' doesn't make the serial killer look undefeatable, and it's hard for anyone to say that by making him undefeatable, it doesn't glorify him.

Also, I think it'd be a far strech to say that 'Saw' isn't overly violent. The guy saws his own foot off with a hack saw and a woman has a reverse bear trap about to rip her face open. That sounds pretty damn violent to me. Blood is blood, gore is gore, and you'd be hard pressed to find a mainstream movie with an
R rating that is more violent than 'Saw.' Again, not that that is a bad thing.

However, I won't deny that I think it's a pretty okay movie. Granted, from the technical aspects of it (camera work, editing, lighting and sound) it's fairly unorigional and boarders on cleche', but the story has some good ideas, the lines were fairly well written, and the acting was good. But the movie is good for one, more important reason, that being that we're talking about it. Any movie that has the power to stimulate conversation and get people arguing is a pretty good movie on that fact alone. Also, when I saw this movie, it pissed me off. Litterally, watching it made me angry, and I also believe that any movie that can provoke serious emotion (unless it's anger because the movie is so bad) is a good movie. So overall, I'd have to say that 'Saw' was a good movie that I absolutely hate.
 
and I also believe that any movie that can provoke serious emotion (unless it's anger because the movie is so bad) is a good movie.

Ah, yes, here I agree with you completely.

But I still don't think Saw is glorifying violence directly and intentionally. I think it's a fairly simple movie that tries to be shocking and mostly it succeeds. Let's be honest now, it's not like it's such a deep movie... the philosophy behind it it's n00b stuff, really.

Natural Born Killers

I'm curious, what do you think about this movie? I for one think it's a masterpiece, along with A Clockwork Orange.


Edit: And speaking of over-violent movies, have you seen Beyond The Limits? That's what I call an over-violent movie. People being cut in half, having their flesh ripped off their bones, their eyes pulled out of their sockets and such seem more violent than a sawed off foot and a bear trap. Anyway, the movie sucked. It only relied on violence to appeal, everything else being throwed in just to fill the time between the gory scenes.
 
Natural Born Killers is another movie that's really, really good that I don't like very much haha. See, I can say all the same things about NBK that I can about Saw, except that it's VERY well written, VERY well acted, and VERY well directed. It's a very well made movie in all the ways that Saw is mediocre. However I still don't like the ending much since they get away in the end. I don't enjoy watching the movie because of the way the violence in the movie is portrayed. However, that's exactly what Oliver Stone was trying to do, so I think it's an excelent movie. If the movie had ended in a way similar to "Bonnie and Klyde" (spelling on Klyde?) , where the romanitcised criminals get shot to bits at the end, then I'd absolutely adore the movie. If you can't tell, I'm the sort of person who likes movies where the bad guys get what's coming to them. However I'm also the sort of guy who will admit that just because I don't like a movie personally doesn't mean it's not a great film. Saw was mediocre, even if I disregaurd my personal opinions about the storyline, but NBK was a really good movie, not nessesarily in my top 10 but pretty good none the less. I especially liked the stylised, TV sitcom sequences. Really creative.

However I have to say that I'm a hypocrite about justice being served to bad guys when it comes to some movies, like The Godfather. There was a bit of an uproar when that movie hit theatres because Don Vito Corlione (Brando) dies of natural causes, rather than being imprisoned or killed. There was no justice: this criminal mastermind grew old and died happy. I didn't have a problem with that ending, but this might have been because it's in a different context, that being the business of organised crime. Also, Vito Corlione was a champion of the people, a public servant of sorts for the italian community in that movie, and he didn't murder people in cold blood for no good reason.
 
I definitely agree that NBK glorifies violence by making the killers the cool, romantic guys. It doesn't get off the hook by having the cool killers lash out against violence glorification for a spot. It's also hypocritical in that killing white people is OK, hey, you gotta act out a little, they got it coming etc., but killing wise old Indians is BAD and that's SURE to change the way you look at things.
 
NBK isn't even in the same league as Saw... it's not even on the same planet. Saw is just another "clever" :roll: serial killer movie with a small niche. NBK is a classic trippout movie. If you ever did drugs, you probably watched it high. "The Wall" and "Wizard of Oz" are the same. Speaking of which ( and this is totally off subject) have you ever synched up "The Dark Side of the Moon" by Pink Floyd with "The Wizard of Oz"? :wink:
 
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