As I understand it, the pre-war looked like—practically was—the 50's envisioned 'World of Tomorrow', but it had a deceptive government; one that was actively lying about the danger to the public from an atomic war. I also get the impression that there is a little bit of a Starship Troopers inspired style of patriotism in it; as visible in the public news reel... assassination, and playful wave to the folks at home.
Some of those things (not the song though) are the retro-futuristic design choices we've been talking about but when you take them literally and think "oh, the prewar world looked like the 50's" then what do you make of those soldiers with power armor?
I think it proves the opposite point... the armors look exactly like what one might expect from a retro 50's.
Cain simply talks about the style of ray guns, not the overall style of the game. Mind you, Forbidden Planet is a sci-fi that doesn't take place in the 50's.
I believe that you miss the point. It does not matter that Forbidden Planet was set in the future—and not the 50's. The point of it is that The movie itself is a product of the 50's era, and clearly shows their concept of a far future; and of what was futuristic to them (the pop-culture of the 1950's). That's why it was considered a touch-stone. Fallout was set in a future that was inspired by what was futuristic to them. This is the reason behind the design aesthetic. This is why the power armors look the way that they do; and why the vehicles look the way that they do, and the Gothom City~esque building ornamentation you sometimes see done on major civic and commercial construction.
Bethesda's unforgivable (and probably deliberate) gaff, was in making everything look like the 1950s, rather than look like the 50's imagined future. There should not have been collapsing cement overpasses, Happy Days style dinners, and Rocket ship themed gas stations. Those are futuristic constructs of the 1950's, when they should have been 1950's styled constructs of the future. Fallout's Hub was in the middle of nowhere... Bethesda set their game in the District of Columbia, it should have looked closer to a nuked set from the Jetsons.... or plausibly a few decades behind them.
Look at the image of Chicago from Fallout Tactics:
It looks like the same masonry buildings in the style of the (pre & post) early 1950's—which is what's wrong with it.
(But doubtless they thought it easier to market it as a simpler product. — IE. It's like the 50's were... but in the future. )
This is just one more of the reasons why they made—and make—such terrible sequels.
I believe that you miss the point. It does not matter that Forbidden Planet was set in the future—and not the 50's. The point of it is that The movie itself is a product of the 50's era, and clearly shows their concept of a far future; and of what was futuristic to them (the pop-culture of the 1950's). That's why it was considered a touch-stone. Fallout was set in a future that was inspired by what was futuristic to them. This is the reason behind the design aesthetic. This is why the power armors look the way that they do; and why the vehicles look the way that they do, and the Gothom City~esque building ornamentation you see done on major civic and commercial construction.
I believe it's not me who's missing the point, as I've never disagreed with anything that you wrote in the paragraph above, all I've been saying is that the pre-war world of Fallout did not look like "the 50's", but partially looked like "the future which people of the 50's imagined" and mixed with stuff from the 80's. I think there's been a misunderstanding going on.
Bethesda's (probably deliberate) gaff, was in making everything look like the 1950s, rather than look like the 50's imagined future. There should not have been collapsing cement overpasses, Happy Days style dinners, and Rocket ship themed gas stations.
That's exactly what I've been saying all along. Fallout should not look or feel like "the 50's", the original games did not. And I wouldn't object to it at all if Bethesda's Fallouts felt like "a sci-fi from the 50's", e.g. Forbidden Planet.
But this is implied by "retro-"; as in retrofit. It is as perhaps they would have made it, had they been able to.
I believe it's not me who's missing the point, as I've never disagreed with anything that you wrote in the paragraph above, all I've been saying is that the pre-war world of Fallout did not look like "the 50's", but partially looked like "the future which people of the 50's imagined" and mixed with stuff from the 80's. I think there's been a misunderstanding going on.
As I understand it, the pre-war looked like—practically was—the 50's envisioned 'World of Tomorrow', but it had a deceptive government; one that was actively lying about the danger to the public from an atomic war. I also get the impression that there is a little bit of a Starship Troopers inspired style of patriotism in it; as visible in the public news reel... assassination, and playful wave to the folks at home.
I think it proves the opposite point... the armors look exactly like what one might expect from a retro 50's.
I believe that you miss the point. It does not matter that Forbidden Planet was set in the future—and not the 50's. The point of it is that The movie itself is a product of the 50's era, and clearly shows their concept of a far future; and of what was futuristic to them (the pop-culture of the 1950's). That's why it was considered a touch-stone. Fallout was set in a future that was inspired by what was futuristic to them. This is the reason behind the design aesthetic. This is why the power armors look the way that they do; and why the vehicles look the way that they do, and the Gothom City~esque building ornamentation you sometimes see done on major civic and commercial construction.
Bethesda's unforgivable (and probably deliberate) gaff, was in making everything look like the 1950s, rather than look like the 50's imagined future. There should not have been collapsing cement overpasses, Happy Days style dinners, and Rocket ship themed gas stations. Those are futuristic constructs of the 1950's, when they should have been 1950's styled constructs of the future. Fallout's Hub was in the middle of nowhere... Bethesda set their game in the District of Columbia, it should have looked closer to a nuked set from the Jetsons.... or plausibly a few decades behind them.
Look at the image of Chicago from Fallout Tactics:
It looks like the same masonry buildings in the style of the (pre & post) early 1950's—which is what's wrong with it.
(But doubtless they thought it easier to market it as a simpler product. — IE. It's like the 50's were... but in the future. )
This is just one more of the reasons why they made—and make—such terrible sequels.
Power armour, as well as the power fist and ripper are heavily inspired by Warhammer 40k, so you could put it in Fallout's pulpy 80s influences.
Looking at the comparison of those two cityscapes, it is more understandable that ignorant reviewers thought that the bombs dropped in the actual 1950's, rather than an dystopian alternative reality 21st century, inspired by what they thought the future would look like in the post-WWII period.
Not entirely sure if this is a thread necro, but I actually rather like the 50s aesthetic myself--although I suppose I'm a smidge biased when it comes to "vintage" everything. For the record, NV is the only fallout game I've actually played, although I can't say that the art-design choices in the other games is much of an issue.
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