U.S. veterans ask Bush to halt B.C.'s 'tribute to cowards'
- Thread starter John Uskglass
- Start date
Venerable Relic of the Wastes
Cowards, malingerers, deserters, defeatists and wreckers are to be summarily executed.
No mercy for Traitors
No mercy for Traitors
welsh
Junkmaster
Funny how we are refighting a war that most people who remember it personally think it was a pretty crappy war to begin with.
Why did we go to war in Vietnam? That's a mystery that has still to receive a good answer.
Why did we go to war in Vietnam? That's a mystery that has still to receive a good answer.
Let them run away and hide if they wish, but to build a monument honoring those who abandoned their country when it told them to fight is disgusting. Disagree with the war all you want, call it illegal, unjust and moronic, but I will not ever believe a man brave for running away to another country when his own country demands of him the basic duty of a citizen. Perhaps another country is the best place for them, one that matched their own perspective and attitude, but building a monument honoring those who fled offends me.
welsh
Junkmaster
OK, Lauren, but would your attitude change if you got drafted?
Because next time around, college is no way out and chicks get to go too.
Frankly, I dig chicks in camo, face painted and combat knives. But would you feel the same if you were shipped off to Vietnam-
ANd remember, there was probably a better reason to go to Iraq than Vietnam.
Because next time around, college is no way out and chicks get to go too.
Frankly, I dig chicks in camo, face painted and combat knives. But would you feel the same if you were shipped off to Vietnam-
ANd remember, there was probably a better reason to go to Iraq than Vietnam.
Yes I have NO problem serving my country. I come from a long line of distinguished soldiers though and have expected most of my life I'd serve at some point. I'm also married to a soldier who has served in Iraq and will be deploying back again about the same time as our beloved Elissar.
Military service to me is something one can avoid, but getting out of it by running away should not be honored.
Military service to me is something one can avoid, but getting out of it by running away should not be honored.
... Unless it forces you fight another war than one where your country's directly attacked by another country.
No, I'm all for wars of conquest too. The workers of every nation deserve the freedom and stability the Party can offer.
John Uskglass
Venerable Relic of the Wastes
Heh. You're sounding more like a Neocon then a Commie. Not that there's much diffirence.
... Between totalitarian systems.
True dat.
True dat.
John Uskglass
Venerable Relic of the Wastes
No, not at all, NeoConism is about enforced Kemalism (ie enforced Dictators with Democratic futures).
Damn Anarchist. You'll fight in ANY revolution.
Why change "DICKS" in middle of a screw?
Vote for Nixon for 2004!
As a vet and from someone who comes from a family of veterans, including three surviving Nam vets, I respect the honor of duty and I dislike the shirking of such duty.
Choosing to waste American lives in a bullshit invasion that is mostly selfishly political is a far more tasteless thing. A repeat of such is nothing more than a slap in the face after the "apology" of the Vietnam Memorial. Frankly, I really doubt anyone in their right state of mind would go into a "war" that was little more than a "planned failure of old bomber types" in order to push for new models, and one where a lot of the chemicals our soldiers are being treated for were manufactured and used by us in the first place.
I can understand duty to one's country, but when the "country" shows that much disregard of its own citizens' lives for some politician's pride, I can understand and even excuse running to Canada to avoid the draft. The draft was instated to provide military personnel to keep the country free and to protect the liberties of the citizens, not act like said politician's personal invasion force. The kids get to dodge bullets for crap pay while the politician gets even richer and has the Secret Service to make sure he doesn't get the ".22 Impeachment". Or they are the ones who do such themselves, depending on which conspiracy around assassinations you'll believe. Frankly, I don't think it's a good idea to have a president that makes himself into the target of countries that used to be staunch allies. Someone might try something other than bullets and take out innocents.
Speaking of which, it's nearing November. Get ready for Bush to pull Osama out of his ass.
Vote for Nixon for 2004!
As a vet and from someone who comes from a family of veterans, including three surviving Nam vets, I respect the honor of duty and I dislike the shirking of such duty.
Choosing to waste American lives in a bullshit invasion that is mostly selfishly political is a far more tasteless thing. A repeat of such is nothing more than a slap in the face after the "apology" of the Vietnam Memorial. Frankly, I really doubt anyone in their right state of mind would go into a "war" that was little more than a "planned failure of old bomber types" in order to push for new models, and one where a lot of the chemicals our soldiers are being treated for were manufactured and used by us in the first place.
I can understand duty to one's country, but when the "country" shows that much disregard of its own citizens' lives for some politician's pride, I can understand and even excuse running to Canada to avoid the draft. The draft was instated to provide military personnel to keep the country free and to protect the liberties of the citizens, not act like said politician's personal invasion force. The kids get to dodge bullets for crap pay while the politician gets even richer and has the Secret Service to make sure he doesn't get the ".22 Impeachment". Or they are the ones who do such themselves, depending on which conspiracy around assassinations you'll believe. Frankly, I don't think it's a good idea to have a president that makes himself into the target of countries that used to be staunch allies. Someone might try something other than bullets and take out innocents.
Speaking of which, it's nearing November. Get ready for Bush to pull Osama out of his ass.
I think we can all agree with the right of people to disagree with the war (I have yet to hear a single person justify it to my satisfaction) And I even think its forgiveable for people to flee the country to avoid service. I just do not think that action should be honored with a monument for all to see.
Roshambo said:
Hahahaha! Indeed. Maybe for Thanksgiving.
Ontopic, a nitpicker could say that since there are monuments for those who go to war based on a bullshit reason, there should also be one for those who refuse to conform to waste or endanger their lives for said war...
While it WOULD follow the pattern of erecting monuments to every thing that seems to be popular now a days, its not a very good idea. We don't erect monuments to the American Nazis who bravely tried to sabotage American industry during the second World War. Yes they were Americans and yes they did what they believed in, but its not something you build a monument for.
If it points out how bullshit some things are and that some people decided to choose freedom instead of being a politician's statistic, then I think that's a point. Or they didn't want to do what some of the people already there were writing home about (but used post outside of the military mail post, which was often read), how the military had to "secure" certain areas regardless of who was there by order of those higher up (and often due to security reasons or recovering downed aircraft - which was frequent), and nobody wants that blood on their hands like that if they can help it. It is a bit different than shooting someone who is trained to fight, but then again in some areas you had kids with cocktail trays of Coca-Cola & Shrapnel Grenades run into groups of soldiers.
Of course, not many consider monuments for those who died from being shot while protesting by National Guardsmen. Not many remember them today, either. Traoitorous and saboteur actions are a far different matter than non-violent protest and handling protests properly when they start to get out of hand, and opting to choose to just not become someone else's meat puppet.
Of course, not many consider monuments for those who died from being shot while protesting by National Guardsmen. Not many remember them today, either. Traoitorous and saboteur actions are a far different matter than non-violent protest and handling protests properly when they start to get out of hand, and opting to choose to just not become someone else's meat puppet.
Well, the American Nazis trying to sabotage WW2 production lines are a bit different than the mostly hippy/pacifist oriented people fleeing the draft, don't you think?
The nazi saboteurs were supporting a new imperium, based on a hatred ideology which tried to take over and cleanse Europe.
Draft dodgers just ran away from a bullshit war.
The nazi saboteurs were supporting a new imperium, based on a hatred ideology which tried to take over and cleanse Europe.
Draft dodgers just ran away from a bullshit war.
Roshambo said:
That is an excellent point. Death in the defense of civil liberty, even if you arn't fighting for it in some foreign country, deserves recognition. I am hesitant to call hiding in Canada fighting for civil liberty but I see how it can be spun that way, and I agree that its something that takes determination to do.
My first impulse is still just to have NKVD officers shoot the cowards though, I can't help it
Commissar Lauren said:
Morals == Cowardly.
Okay, I'll relay that to some people who had to kill off innocents because they were ordered to, when refusing to follow direct orders would generally earn you a shot to the head depending upon the situation. That is the standard treatment for those who refuse to follow direct orders in the field and in a time of war.
Is it so hard to understand that people who have been taught to cherish freedom and the rights of others, taught so their entire life and into their way of living, would find massacring innocents to be worth fleeing from? If it meant less innocent blood on their hands, most people with common sense would try to avert that if they could. For those who haven't grasped it yet, it was the US troops having to follow orders akin to behaving like Nazi Germany that alienated a good portion of the world from the US during the Nam invasion.
Is this clear now?