Why you don't need a katana

VirtualAlex said:
Why don't they have a Katana video? Also, why don't they cut through metal armors? That would be cool to see. Can it stab through a breast plate?
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well he did use the "zweihander" to stab through a car hood...pretty much any sword can stab through a metal armour, it's what you got beneath it that makes the whole diference.
 
Kahgan said:
well he did use the "zweihander" to stab through a car hood...pretty much any sword can stab through a metal armour, it's what you got beneath it that makes the whole diference.
Click to expand...

This is why I don't understand the "evolution" from Roman-like combat to Medieval-like combat. Was this all because of the ideal of chivalry? I just can't fathom how wearing a heavy suit of armor outweighed(Haha! Me so funny, love you long time) the disadvantages of encumbrance during combat.

I guess that's something to research Monday. As for now, I'm blowing this Popsicle stand.
 
ooooooo.... dont hurt me!!

vikcu5.jpg




i have sharper krom steel knives in my kitchen right now. probably more durable too. its not important being sharper about swords. there are two things that makes a sword good: the easiness in using the sword and the parryabilty of the opponent sword. this is the only reason that rapiers and curved swords win straight ones. its pretty much easy to throw your oppoenents sword on air with a curved and thin sword.
thats why modern military sabers are a mix of katana, scimitar and rapier:

SZ910918TS_s.jpg


couse they are much more deadly than a lasor sharpened platinium uranium titanium uberium blade.
 
You forgot to mention a blade's balance. If the weapon is as balanced as a lump of iron, it's useless.

This is why I don't understand the "evolution" from Roman-like combat to Medieval-like combat. Was this all because of the ideal of chivalry?
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Eh?

I guess you're talking about how military tactics degraded after the Roman empire. Well. The Roman empire collapsed, you know? And with it, most of its military strategy models and tactics. The Byzantines aside, no-one was 'advanced' enough in military doctrine to form a huge semi-professional army.

I'm talking about Europe, ofkoz. Different stories in Asia.
 
Kahgan said:
well he did use the "zweihander" to stab through a car hood...pretty much any sword can stab through a metal armour, it's what you got beneath it that makes the whole diference.
Click to expand...
Non-two handed swords can't stab through a real plate armor. You need a specialised anti-armor weapon like a warhammer or warpick to do that.
 
Sorrow said:
Kahgan said:
well he did use the "zweihander" to stab through a car hood...pretty much any sword can stab through a metal armour, it's what you got beneath it that makes the whole diference.
Click to expand...
Non-two handed swords can't stab through a real plate armor. You need a specialised anti-armor weapon like a warhammer or warpick to do that.
Click to expand...

if the wielder is an ox that can throw his own horse around then they can.

also a cars hood is a poor example for plate armor. real plate armor at least.
 
VirtualAlex said:
Why don't they have a Katana video? Also, why don't they cut through metal armors? That would be cool to see. Can it stab through a breast plate?.
Click to expand...

They do have a video of a katana.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=yhzX9GZ3qKE&mode=related&search=

The Katana isn't designed to stab but it can. While the japanese didn't often use metal armor their helmets were usually metal and a katana could cut though that. It would probably do better to try and take out the neck or under the arms rather than try and face a western breast plate. That said a good knight who knew what he was doing could defend weak spots in his armor.

I still say knights beat samurai and as definitive proof I show this video... I mean just look at those funny sandals! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZOoBDaPNiY
 
123123 said:
i have sharper krom steel knives in my kitchen right now. probably more durable too. its not important being sharper about swords. there are two things that makes a sword good: the easiness in using the sword and the parryabilty of the opponent sword. this is the only reason that rapiers and curved swords win straight ones. its pretty much easy to throw your oppoenents sword on air with a curved and thin sword.
thats why modern military sabers are a mix of katana, scimitar and rapier:

SZ910918TS_s.jpg
Click to expand...

Those weapons were developed after "heavy" armour was rendered useless.
You wouldn't use that one against an armoured medeival oponent with a regular medieval sword and shield...

Sorrow said:
Non-two handed swords can't stab through a real plate armor. You need a specialised anti-armor weapon like a warhammer or warpick to do that.
Click to expand...

Believe me, a one-handed medieval sword can, maybe not a viking sword as they were designed rather for cutting than thrusting.
That is, a metal armour alone (And I'm supposing we are talking about plate armour, not maill)
But if you count all the padding that you would have underneath the armour then yes, it's a lot more dificult, and most people wouldn't manage to thrust through it.
A *real* medieval plate armour isn't really that thick, and not that heavy or cumbersome either.
During the late viking age and further into the medieval ages all swords developed to be more wedge-shaped (thiner tips) and better designed for thrusting because cutting was getting less effective due to better and more covering armour.

http://www.vikingsword.com/

Pluss, thrusting damages your weapon less than cutting.

It might have been a slight exaggerattion to say that "pretty much any sword can" though :)
 
Kahgan said:
Those weapons were developed after "heavy" armour was rendered useless.
You wouldn't use that one against an armoured medeival oponent with a regular medieval sword and shield...
Click to expand...
while there are swords that can penetrate armor, they were almost never used.

european knights far prefered warhammers, maces and flails.
this is very misrepresented in old paintings and new media.

PS: twohanders were mainly used to slice through the pikemen's pikes, spears or halberds. (so little Wallace-style crap actually happened)
twohanders with an uneven edge were mostly used against armor.
 
Makagulfazel said:
This is why I don't understand the "evolution" from Roman-like combat to Medieval-like combat. Was this all because of the ideal of chivalry? I just can't fathom how wearing a heavy suit of armor outweighed(Haha! Me so funny, love you long time) the disadvantages of encumbrance during combat.
Click to expand...

Because that when sitting on a horse that is covered with heavy armor you can charge trough pretty much anything that gets in your way.

And as has been said before, when the roman empire fell apart there was no system that could train the professional armies, that was required to field infantry soldiers, that again had the discipline to fight the heavy knights.

That and the introduction of the feudal society and introduction of the stirrup. Amongst other things.
 
theres no evolution from there to there. roma falls, chaos starts. people preferred individual groups instead of large, one-being armies. use of equipment changes that way. also west were introduced with modern asian warfare. which didnt help the roman style to stand. yet it made a good stand anyway.
 
SuAside said:
while there are swords that can penetrate armor, they were almost never used.

european knights far prefered warhammers, maces and flails.
this is very misrepresented in old paintings and new media.
Click to expand...

Besides, a mace is much more brutal and fierce :twisted:

PS: twohanders were mainly used to slice through the pikemen's pikes, spears or halberds. (so little Wallace-style crap actually happened)
twohanders with an uneven edge were mostly used against armor.
Click to expand...

Aye, twohanders were really just a kind of "experiment" it's useless in combat with a lighter weapon.

And they look silly, like alot of medieval stuff. That's why I prefer the viking age.
 
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