Slicerdicer
First time out of the vault
Wooz said:
Great we have Beth plants and clone trolls here.
Ashley Cheng: nobody's talking
- Thread starter Brother None
- Start date
First time out of the vault
Great we have Beth plants and clone trolls here.
drakesteele
First time out of the vault
Well, at least I sparked a lively discussion... lol
Ok I will grant that yes, there were attempts at FP RPGs back in the 80s when I had the ol' C64/AppleII/Amiga. But they still weren't the current style hardware-accelerated type that is more and more approaching photorealism. That was the point there. That's what I meant by it being more immersive...
Now I actually like the idea that a couple people have posted, saying that exploration should be FP and the combat system iso. That would work fine for me, and still allow me to have the more immersive exploration and interaction with the world and objects.
As for Jimmious' comment:
Oblivion's predecessor Morrowind, the Ultima IX and the Ultima Underworld series, Dark Messiah of Might and Magic which just recently came out, and of course the others mentioned through some of the absolutely wonderful debate stirred up by my posts.
Glad to be able to spark some good convo in here. lol
- Drake Steele.[/i]
Ok I will grant that yes, there were attempts at FP RPGs back in the 80s when I had the ol' C64/AppleII/Amiga. But they still weren't the current style hardware-accelerated type that is more and more approaching photorealism. That was the point there. That's what I meant by it being more immersive...
Now I actually like the idea that a couple people have posted, saying that exploration should be FP and the combat system iso. That would work fine for me, and still allow me to have the more immersive exploration and interaction with the world and objects.
As for Jimmious' comment:
Jimmious said:
Oblivion's predecessor Morrowind, the Ultima IX and the Ultima Underworld series, Dark Messiah of Might and Magic which just recently came out, and of course the others mentioned through some of the absolutely wonderful debate stirred up by my posts.
Glad to be able to spark some good convo in here. lol
- Drake Steele.[/i]
Re: Well, at least I sparked a lively discussion... lol
Please explain to me how first-person view is automatically more immersive. And don't say 'because that's how you yourself view the world', because I never view the world in that way.
The only 'recent' role-playing game that featured a first-person view (and not even as its primary view) was Vampire: Bloodlines. And even in that case, the combat is widely seen as frantic and badly done.
Now if you look at most recent actual role-playing games, they're largely isometric or something approaching isometric: Neverwinter Nights 2, KOTOR, KOTOR 2.
And that's about as far as I get, because there are very few RPGs even coming out. Heh.
But that has absolutely nothing (and I really mean *nothing*) to do with the viewpoint whatsoever. You could just as easily use that exact same high-tech engine in an isometric game. And in fact, that has been done before. See Civilisation 4.drakesteele said:
And yet another ridiculous assumption. The first-person view is not automagically more immersive. Immersion comes from a believable, consistent and well-modeled game environment, not from a viewpoint.drakesteele said:
Please explain to me how first-person view is automatically more immersive. And don't say 'because that's how you yourself view the world', because I never view the world in that way.
You said most *modern* role-playing games. Again: this is not true. The Elder Scrolls series had a first-person view long before Fallout existed, so that is not a sign of the times. The same goes for the Ultima Underworld series. Ultima IX was a fucked up game. Dark Messiah was widely criticised (except by, ironically, Game Informer) as a poor RPG.drakesteele said:
The only 'recent' role-playing game that featured a first-person view (and not even as its primary view) was Vampire: Bloodlines. And even in that case, the combat is widely seen as frantic and badly done.
Now if you look at most recent actual role-playing games, they're largely isometric or something approaching isometric: Neverwinter Nights 2, KOTOR, KOTOR 2.
And that's about as far as I get, because there are very few RPGs even coming out. Heh.
Just because something is more photo-realistic doesn't mean its more immersive... novels have always allowed me to feel more immersed in the 'world' than most movies and games in general. Its not about a photorealistic view from a first person perspective that allows for immersion. It *could* help depending on the situation, but it does NOT equate to it. What is important is the ground work laid down that describes the background, the setting, the feel and the mood of everything. Graphics alone cannot do that. Perspective alone cannot do that. Get it in your head. The fallout feeling created before was the sum of ALL its parts. Randomly changing key portions of it affects the entire setting, feeling, that which made fallout, 'fallout'. Take any random side-scrolling shooter for example, and change it into a up/down (or left/right) only flight sim and you'd have something that's more 'photo realistic' and in the 'same world' but FEELS ENTIRELY DIFFERENT.
Please inform Steven Spielberg that first person = "teh immersion". I am sure he is eager to make a sequel to Schindler's List shot entirely in full color, first person perspective, now that he is no longer bound by the technical limitations he faced when making the original. He must be chomping at the bit to introduce HDR lighting and bump-mapped textures. Sure, Schindler's List won multiple Academy Awards, but that was back in the primitive days of 1993. There's no market for 3rd person, 2D, black and white movies anymore.
Dracon M'Alkir
Vault Senior Citizen
jfreund said:
Your statement is quite ironic because movies in our current age are infact getting more stupid.
Transformers Movie.
13pm
Water Chip? Been There, Done That
Re: Well, at least I sparked a lively discussion... lol
FP is not too immersive at all. You know, human's perception field is much larger than can be depicted via any display. You see your arms, your body with some small movements of your eyes, you percieve things to the left and right with that side eyesight. And FP games are not immersive by limiting that percepted space.
and also, how can an FP game be immersive when in 99% of such games when you look down you don't see your legs? or they just rotate stupidly with no steps when you turn.
any third person is much more immersive in that case.
drakesteele said:
FP is not too immersive at all. You know, human's perception field is much larger than can be depicted via any display. You see your arms, your body with some small movements of your eyes, you percieve things to the left and right with that side eyesight. And FP games are not immersive by limiting that percepted space.
and also, how can an FP game be immersive when in 99% of such games when you look down you don't see your legs? or they just rotate stupidly with no steps when you turn.
any third person is much more immersive in that case.
