A Return to Form

Kilgore Trout

Gyro Captain
What are some aesthetic features and aspects of lore that we would like to see a new Fallout, one presumably not designed by Bethesda?

For myself, I'd like to see the following:

* Pre-war architecture is once again gothic art-deco, as in the Fallout 1 intro.

* Real examples of post-war architecture. Remember Shady Sands in Fallout? It was not just made out of garbage from the old world, instead it had its own distinct architectural style that matched its own culture. Junktown was made out of garbage from the old world, but it was shaped into something distinctly new. In the new Fallouts, everybody is squatting in hundred-year old buildings that they didn't even bother to repair or repaint. If there's an area where a significant number of old buildings survived, fine, but some variety here would be appreciated.

* NO 50s music - all music should be ambient, and/or reflect the development of new cultures that are completely alien to the old world. Radio, if it exists, should be used primarily as a means of communication between settlements, not to broadcast records that would be considered antiques before the bombs fell!

* More realistic blast damage from warheads - if an area was hit by a nuclear bombardment, it should look like it was hit by a nuclear bombardment, not like it was hit with an economic recession. I'm thinking in particular of the descriptions of the Boneyard in Fallout 1 - think of the kind of bizarre landscape you would get from thousands of skyscrapers being leveled and melted, for example. If communities have developed in a ground zero location, they should have to adapt to the challenges of living in such an environment, and this should be portrayed in an interesting and somewhat realistic way.

* New kinds of mutants, not just super mutants and ghouls - humans with more subtle mutations, or mutations that are *gasp* actually adaptations to a new environment. The Slags from Fallout 2 are an example of how this could be done.

* Dwarves. There were dozens of these guys in the original Fallouts. What happened?

* Supermutants and Ghouls should be somewhat rare and highly intelligent, not just orcs/zombies. Enemy ghouls in particular should be frightening and formidible because of their cunning and centuries of knowledge to draw upon, not just because they are gross. If Ghouls characters are assigned Skills, then they should have many different Skills maxed out to reflect their lifespan.

* Psykers and other psionic phenomena - another feature of the original Fallouts that has been mostly dropped from the world. There should be at least a few people with some level of psionic ability.

* New Factions - especially, NO MORE BOS. If the BOS are present, they should have evolved into something quite different than what we've seen before (the idea of BOS turning into something like the War Boy cult from Mad Max: Fury Road would be awesome). It would be interesting also to see other groups that managed to hang on to pre-war technology, and see them do something different and unprecedented with it.

* Power Armor should grant significant bonuses to strength, etc, like it did in the originals. It should also be rare and hard to come by, or if it is common then it should be integrated into the world in a believable way - for example perhaps it requires an entire community with high level skills to keep a suit in working condition.

* Vehicles - this might be an interesting feature. I'm not talking cars, necessarily, but things like brahmin or other pack beasts, or even Power Armor if it's implemented properly. Make it so that some areas of the map are inaccessible without vehicles. This could be because of distance or harsh terrain.

* Successful examples of Vault Civilizations - like Vault City and Shady Sands. Given the sheer number of people running around, presumably there were more successful Vaults than there were failures, but it seems like we only ever see the wacky results of Vault Tec experiments gone awry. This doesn't seem to match the population numbers.

* Give raiders some kind of community structure, rather than just making them mobs of enemies you have no choice but to kill. Give them settlements, NPCs, ideologies. Every "raider" group should be like the Great Khans and be connected to some settlement hub. It would be cool to finally see the tribal structure of the Vipers or some similar band.

* Have realistic level caps - even in the original Fallout, it was relatively easy to become a god, and it just became easier in each subsequent Fallout. In my opinion, to really make the post apocalyptic world seem dangerous, combat should always have the possibility of a swift and unexpected death, even for high level characters. There should be wasteland creatures that are a serious challenge even for maxed out characters to take down. I'd like to see a Fallout where combat is fun, engaging and doesn't cater to power fantasy.
 
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That souns like a perfect Fallout. Except maybe for the psionic abilities, which I'm not sure I miss to be honest.

As long as there are dwarves in the next Fallout, I'll be happy.
 
* Return of the design style of Fallout 1 and 2, but this time in 3D.
When Fallout 3 came out I found it quite dissociated from its predecessor in style/design, but I had gotten used to it by the time of Fallout New Vegas.
Now Bethesda is pulling this one again and it rather creates a degree of disharmony between the games in my opinion, making them visually mostly unconnected with a few exceptions here and there. (I guess Power Armor does finally feel somewhat like a lot of people imagined it to be and is no longer another armor suit like in FNV)
I really think the style FO1/2 should return for the next Fallout game and artists/designers should stick to it. They can make it more detailed and function, and of course add new material to it as well.
But please not yet another new creative interpretation of Fallout concepts like Ghouls, Super Mutants, various objects, and so on in a new Fallout game. Some visual consistency would be very appreciated.
 
I like a lot of that.

Psykers are neat, but I do seem to recall they were written out just like the Wanamingos.
I'm, not against 50's music; but I am against using actual authentic 50's music in 2277 of so. Their 50's music should [culturally] be like our 90's pop music; pervasive, popular, and safe (in their culture), but not the only music out there. Think of the unsafe music (and popularity concerns)... in similar terms like if Micheal Bublé would take a risk and release album of Aphex Twin or NiN covers... Could he do it ~perhaps, but would he fear it would damage to his career.... That's what I mean by unsafe... Anyone [skilled] can be safe singing popular favorites, and that's what 50's style music would be.

Incidentally: The best Micheal Bublé I've heard was Russian Unicorn. :roll:
(And the same with Cyrus ~"Black Umbrella"; and Black Eyed Peas ~'Everybody Poops'; and the Niki Minaj/WillIam song [Dirty Spaceman] is ~difficult to find anymore... That one must of spawned a serious threat of lawsuit; but as foul as the lyrics are (at times), that's the best one BLR produced IMO.)

*And every one of those songs is better than any of the parodied artist's original tracks.
 
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I'd actually like to become a Psyker in some form. Not anything super fancy or overt, like pyrokinesis, though.
 
I think that Psykers should come 'hand in hand' with serious mental instability; and have that spill over into the dialog, and the way NPCs and companions react to the PC.
Psykers are effectively superpowered, and probably far more disturbing than obvious mutants and ghouls.

*A psyker could be the Fallout equivalent of the Malkavian; just as a ghoul PC could be the equivalent of the Nosferatu.
(Assuming ~and only, that the game fully supported alternate quest & conversation paths for those character types.)
 
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I think that Psykers should come 'hand in hand' with serious mental instability; and have that spill over into the dialog, and the way NPCs and companions react to the PC.
Psykers are effectively superpowered, and probably far more disturbing than obvious mutants and ghouls.

*A psyker could be the Fallout equivalent of the Malkavian; just as a ghoul PC could be the equivalent of the Nosferatu.
(Assuming ~and only, that the game fully supported alternate quest & conversation paths for those character types.)
Hey nice drawback! If the PC becomes a psyker he sacrifices his sanity.
 
To be fair, the blast damage doesn't seem to be depicted too badly. I mean, the Glowing Sea looks suitably apocalyptic.
On the other hand, there's the Cambridge Crater, whatever that is...
 
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If it ever went back to top down/isometric again I'd be interested in seeing what pre-rendered backgrounds such as those in Pillars of Eternity would look like, although 3D like Wasteland 2 is also great.

Wasteland 2 is probably the closest thing to an Interplay-made Fallout 3 we will ever see.
 
If it ever went back to top down/isometric again I'd be interested in seeing what pre-rendered backgrounds such as those in Pillars of Eternity would look like, although 3D like Wasteland 2 is also great.

Wasteland 2 is probably the closest thing to an Interplay-made Fallout 3 we will ever see.

Ehh I don't really like Wasteland 2 now that I've played it.
 
If it ever went back to top down/isometric again I'd be interested in seeing what pre-rendered backgrounds such as those in Pillars of Eternity would look like, although 3D like Wasteland 2 is also great.

Wasteland 2 is probably the closest thing to an Interplay-made Fallout 3 we will ever see.

I'm pretty sure that that was the idea.

WL3 seems to effectively be Fallout Tactics 2, but with more of an RPG focus.

(Which is a great basis for a Fallout sequel.)
 
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Ehh I don't really like Wasteland 2 now that I've played it.
Can see where you are coming from. While Wasteland 2 quite shine on its individual writing pieces, it doesn't have the luxury of well-thought background of Fallout.
 
Yep. Reasons why I LOOOOVE Morrowind and Fallout is that the world is so well thought out.

Wasteland 2 shows the same mistake that made by Bethesda: the world and its society feels like that apocalypse just happened yesterday even though the story take setting 100 years or so after a nuclear war. Strangely enough though, some of the society like Rail Nomads indeed looks like a society that build itself after an apocalypse.


More on-topic, I really agree with the point about more type of mutants. It is very strange to see Super Mutant over and over when they actually the result of an experiment made by one entity and no longer have the ability to spread further to even the Great Plains, let alone East Coast. The United States is big, why the hell the type of mutants that could appear is very limited?
 
Yep. Reasons why I LOOOOVE Morrowind and Fallout is that the world is so well thought out.

Wasteland 2 shows the same mistake that made by Bethesda: the world and its society feels like that apocalypse just happened yesterday even though the story take setting 100 years or so after a nuclear war. Strangely enough though, some of the society like Rail Nomads indeed looks like a society that build itself after an apocalypse.


More on-topic, I really agree with the point about more type of mutants. It is very strange to see Super Mutant over and over when they actually the result of an experiment made by one entity and no longer have the ability to spread further to even the Great Plains, let alone East Coast. The United States is big, why the hell the type of mutants that could appear is very limited?

Yeah it felt too soon... and the world wasn't that fleshed out.
 
To be fair, the blast damage doesn't seem to be depicted too badly. I mean, the Glowing Sea looks suitably apocalyptic.
On the other hand, there's the Cambridge Crater, whatever that is...

I came across this location yesterday and was thinking "So Bethesda can get the right idea, they just don't seem to realize that this is what Washington DC and Boston should look like" (perhaps a little less radioactive though)
 
Very nice, I like all of your ideas except for two.

First off, the 50's music has always been a Fallout thing. Remember the opening of the first game? I do agree you shouldn't have a fully fledged radio station that you can tune into on your pip-boy, but I think having it play on some rusted jukebox in a tavern or on the radio system of a Vault is totally harmless.

Secondly, even Chris Avellone agrees that psykers are done with. They were a one off freakshow created by the Master, and outside of a handful of fortune tellers scattered around the wastes, I think that particular part of Fallout should be buried alongside the talking Deathclaws.

Personally, I'd prefer it if we scrapped or otherwise toned down the idea of the crazy vault experiments. I wasn't even a huge fan of them in Fallout 2. I think my own fascination with the idea of totally self-suficient bunkers that are utterly sealed away and oblivious from the horrors above is clouding my judgement. I'm just in love with the Hobbit-esque idea of a Vault Dweller emerging from the Vault, totally unaware of what the ouside could be like and stepping into a big world of adventure.

I'd also like the overuse of nukes to be toned down as well. Stuff like the Fatman and Liberty Prime's football nukes are just silly. I preferred the Fallout 1/2 depiction of nukes, where they were these unspeakable things that nobody wanted to talk about, scorching the earth and becoming the stuff of legends among the society that emerged after their arrival.
 
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