Blind Anti-Americanism. What's it good for, y'all?

[Ozrat]

Hey everybody. Last night I had the great pleasure of discussing polotics on MSN Messanger with a gal from my school. She brought it all up by herself by all of a sudden saying that Canadians hate Americans. Well, duuuuuuuh. You think that after living here for almost a year and a half that I still haven't picked up on the negative vibes? Weird. Anyways, here's the best parts of the "debate" that took place. Names have been edited. Spelling has not been touched at all, so don't think that I changed her words around just to make her look bad. She did that all by herself. The only things that have been edited are certain lines have been taken out just to show what was said more concisely and with more clairity.

Also, please note that I am against the war and against the Bush Administration. The only thing I'm trying to say in this entire "debate" is that you can't be ignorant of the facts or reality and expect to be knowledgable about the whole situation.

Read on, and please try not to get very disturbed by reading this. The reality that a university student can be this ignorant is very scary and shocking to say the very least.

If you really can't be bothered to read this entire thing, just scroll down to the bottom where I hold my conclusion.

not to offense u...but canadians hate em cuz of the war they did on iraq? bush is idiot... he wasted that time.. its like america would com to canada and said "o we dun like ure prime minister and we'll try to kill him and govern around ther..." u kno? my roomates were talkin about it with ppl..here at my apartment till 6am mornin

now bush askin for help of other country LOL..i mean...*ahem* is ne country want to help him?
no no...is an examples...cuz they dun like sadam...i kno ppl who are iraq's...told me...thier country isnt bad at all..they are doin really well..they are rich...the one's i kno...now usa are killin the poor innocent ppl
which why we dun like bush
no one does in this world
cuz of what he did
no one want to help me
him*

we dun like that the fact..they are killin innocent ppl, tryin to rule out, damagin a country ther...which is a huuuggee deal..u kno? my best friend is from ther close
her relatives are dyin
so imagine?
is jus sad that's all and very dumb as well

I tried to tell her that "claiming [lies] about the US is just wrong because it hurts the opposition instead of helping it"

lol...hmmm..u tell me? why no country want to help bush? very good reasons for it... my bf is palestinian...he doesnt like bush or his way of americans...cuz they are supportin isreal..givin tanks...guns...to kill his country...tryin to damge his country...jus not long ago...his fav cousins, aunt uncle..their hourse was bombed cuz jew ppl threw it...and his lil cousin only 3...jew's tank (the one american gav em) drove over her
palestinian do not hav tanks or guns..doesnt want to fight

When I pointed out that it's just denying reality that there's nobody who wants to support the war, this is what happens.

i dun kno ne country

[ozrat]England
For one[/ozrat]

england? hhmmm...england is with canada last i heard
i mean our money symbols are british
the queen
and evrythin
of course...so dont u think make sense if canadian also was with usa cuz england?
lol but they arent
last i heard no 1 is supportin usa

[ozrat]No, why should Canada follow another country's lead?[/ozrat]

well...they hav a thing...if britian goes in2 war so does canada
is almost like the EU in europe now
the new system in europe comin up
calls european union
all i kno...it is easy..for sum ppl to say things like this..say "o but u cant say this..bla bla" but if u were in iraq's shoes or palestinian's shoes...u would understand totally...their innocent ppl are dyin..did they want to fight? nope..did they want usa botherin em? nope...is all cuz usa decided to do it...so i feel extremely bad for em my bf's family dyin got shot..i cant imagine..if my cousins dyin or nethin
i would kill myself
honestly my grandparents...man

So let's take a look at misinformed views and stereotypes...

all i can say...there are few reasons...one that american ppl are bein brain washed and closed minded...not to insult u...but im not all of em are...but most of em are...they'll listen to the media...and stories what usa telln em...but if u actually went over ther...and lived ther...totally different story in middle east,,,my best friends family told me about it...
one reason for iraq..usa tryin to get the oil...
nother..tryin to control their governin

[ozrat]Right, but we're not the only brainwashed close-minded people
You're only taking the stereotype[/ozrat]

same with palestine..cuz jew peep..want that the land..cuz their religion..abraham promised em a land
so dumb honestly
sigh
they evn said it on the news..i heard abot
not the only reason
but one of

[edit]The following is probably the stupidest thing she's said in her argument[/edit]
[ozrat]You need to avoid stereotyping here. That's just wrong[/ozrat]

for me is enough..when jews ppl said on the news and in isreal...in poland my granny told me she met jew ppl..telln her samethin,..jus cuz of the land abraham promised ? ...
iraq? all i hav2 say i AM AGAINST the war..no matter what...it is morally wrong sooo irritatin to hav even a reason..to go kill innocent ppl
nothin else

[ozrat]So you think that stereotyping is the right and easy way out? That's not going to solve anything here[/ozrat]

doesnt matter..jews said it..it their own contry so why would they make up? to look bad?
they said it

[ozrat]Who said what?[/ozrat]

jews...said the reasons..why they want to fight palestine ppl...and for a very dumb reasons...i think they need to stick their asses and leave the palestinian ppl alone...*sigh*...iraq? another small country...not lots of ppl livin ther..very small country..look at america? lol huge...30 millions are in army...tanks...guns...to kill innocents? nope nope no matter what..ther wasnt ne reason for the
them* to go ther..period..sooo morally wrong...

[ozrat]So you think we're actually only there to kill innocents? That it's our only objective?[/ozrat]

is a huge thing!!!
easy for u to say this

[ozrat]But you're stereotyping, like I said before
That's just insulting and wrong[ozrat]

stereoptypn? cuz they are killn em?

[ozrat]You're getting the wrong idea by doing this and it's not good to have in an argument[/ozrat]

[edit]Ready for the best part? Here goes...[/edit]
em...i hav a right to say this...cuz it is a huge thing

[ozrat]You have a right to say lies?[/ozrat]

u can easily say nethin..b/c u dun hav family ther..or nethin
try puttin ure own shoes

[ozrat]I'm not defending the war, but you need to argue against the war better
And you don't have family there either[/ozrat]

for what better? tell me
so ? jus b/c i dun hav a family..now i hav2 understand it is okay wha usa doin?

Okay, so there must be a least a couple of you wondering why the hell she brought up something like going to war with Mexico instead of Iraq. So was I, and here's the conversation that ensued...

so what? why not mexico?
why didnt they go ther?
its very bad ther
way worser then iray
iraq*
hhmm?
why not ther?

[ozrat]I haven't heard anything about mexico before[/ozrat]

see? lol
u havent heard alots

[ozrat]AndI've been HERE for two years
I read both sides of the media and I've never heard ANYTHING about mexico
I'm actually liberal, believe it or not
I used to think the same things you do, but I realized that denying the facts is just plain stupid[/ozrat]

[edit]Yet another really stupid response to "support" her argument... [edit]
ok, believe me...i dun listen to the media at all...lol im not that dumb to believe in em...

[ozrat]It's only being a fanatic
There's more than one media you know[/ozrat]

i've learned from them...on my own..from ppl who were actually ther...and from the navy i've talked to them..and from family who's family is over ther
try doin that

Okay, so now we'ved moved onto the media and facts... Enjoy!

[ozrat]So you're basing your views on people's opinions rather than facts?[/ozrat]
facts? media?
um media lies alots

[ozrat]facts does not equal media[/ozrat]

facts? for me enough...if i learned facts from ppl who are experiencin the facts

[ozrat]All medias are biased, which is why you need to look at ALL of them[/ozrat]

who ARE experiencin...the FACTS

[ozrat]It's not like I'm worshipping CNN or anything[/ozrat]

cnn can kiss my ass
i dun believe ne american news or nethin on tv...very bogus..i've listened enough
they always twistin around
non stops

[ozrat]I already said that all medias are biased

But you're only looking at one very opiniated side of the story without any facts
You don't see this as being misinformed?
And you're also assuming that I'm talking about only one side of the media[/ozrat]
they are tryin to make palestinian lookin bad and iraq
why?
i hate the republican....i hate when they lies about iraq or palestinian

She's Polish, which might explain her ignorance. But she's also a quarter Jewish, so her argument doesn't make a lot of sense...
Unfortunately, she has a weird view about how the world looks at Poland.
Read on to find out what they are.

[edit]About the "lies" surronding Iraq and Palestine[/edit]
they did about poland before
they said only jews died...6 millions
but that was totally a lie
more then half of it...polish ppl died
not jews
they never mentioned the polish ppl
only jews...who werent polish
jews were in poland
but werent polish culture...only jew culture
really irritatin....my fam died and fought
they nevr metion..only celebratin the jews...what about the polish? who fought? the most in the world and died the most?

[edit]What? You're saying that Polish people did most of the fighting in World War II? Wow...[/edit]

they nevr said nethin..in usa channel nothin

[ozrat]You're only looking at one channel
It's not THE USA channel[/ozrat]

lol...hmmm...most canadian channels are usa
only 2 are canadians here
most are american shows and channels no canadians..jus 2

[edit]*sigh* What the hell is she watching?[/edit]

jus one example...my polish friends we were talkn about it...not long ago...olympic sports...ceremony...each country flags com on..they nevr shown polish flag ...jus commerical came on...they nevr mention...about the polish best jumper skier in the world only other countries..or polish best fast walker...who won gold each time..nevr...only i heard in polish channels..in poland...my granny bought polish sitelite..i love it..the polish channel shows evrythin...about the world..unlike here

[edit]You think Poland is the WORLD?[/edit]
[ozrat]Um
America has nothing against Poland
I dont' know where you're getting this from[/ozrat]

jus me and my polish ppl we all said samethin
they nevr mentioned here at all
[ozrat]Because the channels don't have enough time and money to cover every single sporting event and the winners?[/ozrat]
um, ure wrong..so they hav the time to mention russia each time? or china each time? what about one time polish? they hav the money for the other one's?
sounds very silly

[ozrat]I think it might have to do with the fact that Russia and China have more influential spots in the world's politics and economy
Perhaps Russia and China have bigger teams?
Last time I checked, Russia and China also have larger populations, so more of them would be watching than Polish[/ozrat]

im not talkin about economy or politics..i am talkin about sports in general
nooo..but what about world's best jumper skier? is polish...and gold each time for best walkin fast...is polish...
um in america in chicago over 3 million polish ppl lives ther

[ozrat]And in China there's over 1 billion people[/ozrat]

so..but they also mention france lots of times? or ukraine?
lol...
which ukraine sucks at sports

[ozrat]Hehe
Last time I checked, there's no conspiracy to suppress Poland and Polish people
And I'm very connected to the CIA [/ozrat]
[edit]I've given up on trying to talk rationally here, so I'm fucking with her by saying that about the CIA[/edit]

ther really good polish athletics....best jumper skier in the world and world's record
and world's record for walk fast..is also polish
i jus heard only in polish news on polish sitelite
if i havent watched that...i wouldnt hav heard about it at all in here tv

[ozrat]BECAUSE THIS IS A DIFFERENT CONTINENT[/ozrat]

sooo what!...but they can mention crappy athelitics ukraine?? here in a different continent?
eh?

[ozrat]I don't see why not
yay Ukraine![/ozrat]

they mention here alots about other countries...but not polish at all
that's the prob
i watch sports neough
enough*

[ozrat]Why are you basing your world politcal views on who gets mentioned in world sports?[/ozrat]

hhmm..well b/c its got alots to do it...very much...jus the ppl dun notices at all...im polish...i hav family who are in poland...i know it...jus like iraq ppl they know it...jus like palestinian...u c? for u may be a different situation...u may not experience it in this way...but in a different way...i dun blame u...it is u..and wher u brought up...jus the way u think will awlys be different from ppl who were born in a different country or know things like this
i understands
newys...

Whoa... Apparently there's a massive American conspiracy to suppress the Polish athetic achievements? Strange... I must curl up into a fetal position now... And what does she have against Mexico and Ukraine?

So now we're back to American stereotypes and Iraq... Oh, and those damned Chinese...

[ozrat]So you're assuming that I'm one of the brainwashed Americans? Your stereotype?[/ozrat]
im not sayin this..im sayin..ure thinkins will be different ..that's all..cuz u wouldnt really understand how ppl like other's one feels...like me? i totally understands the situations really well...

[edit]uh-huh [/edit]
[ozrat]Not if you're only looking at one side
You're totally refusing to even acknowledge the other
And that's a big mistake[/ozrat]

i hav best friends...close friends....
why should i agree on the other side? tell me?
any good reason at all?
tell me?

[ozrat]You don't need to agree with them, but you need to think critically and you can't do that if you're only accepting the views that you already like
You can't think critically if you're only accepting the stuff you already like[/ozrat]

so tell me "any good reason"?
oki u can say whatevr u want...but if ure tryin to make a point here....well tell me what is the good reason?

[ozrat]I just did
You're not thinking critically[/ozrat]

no u dun get it what i said..what is the good reason they are doin this way?
u c? i dun see any at all

[ozrat]Are you saying that Sadamn was Iraq's best leader ever?[/ozrat]

doesnt matter! lol..u jus dun go rammin in their country and decide "oki let kill him..and govern ppl around" u cant do that! is totally..wrong! i kno iraq ppl who were raised ther and kno it..they cant believe usa would do it...go try go to iraq one time...u'll c? lol...is not bad at all...why didnt usa go to china? eh? chinese government is terrible the worstest one...
they kill their own ppl...and eat their own ppl ..cannibals over ther...

[edit]WTF? Chinese are cannibals? I didn't notice her saying this the first time around...[/edit]

[ozrat]Once again, you're assuming that I'm for the war just because I listen to both sides
Doesn't mean that I accept both sides
But I'm not ignoring the facts[/ozrat]

why didnt they go to china?
it is worser..10 times
their government the worst one
?
here is a hint why they didnt go? lol
BECUZ...china is the strongest country...so USA is scared to go ther...in china..ther are over 400 million ppl in army..in usa only 30 million..so typically usa would go iraq..very small country tryin to do things..they think they are doin good..iraq small..very small number...they kno iraq qont outbeat em...lol..so they are scard of china..china can easily outbomb whole usa
wont*
sorry....13 milllion are in army in usa
my mistake
in china over 400
ther u go

Are you still reading this? I must commend you on the size of your balls. Please, grab a bucket to vomit in at any time.
Here I'm attempting to ask her a few basic questions looking for a straight up answer. I should've known better...

[ozrat]*sigh*
Let me ask you some questions
And I don't want ancedotes
Do you think I'm for the war?[/ozrat]

no i didnt say that...

[ozrat]Do you think that the only reason why we're over there is for oil?[/ozrat]

one of the reason

[ozrat]But not the ONLY reason?[/ozrat]

not the only..but ther are few...ruling nother one, ver powerin, governin...so on..cuz they are small country...not like china..so on

[ozrat]I just want simple answers
Do you think that is wrong for the SMALL group of Americans who are closeminded and ignorant to be that way?[/ozrat]

small wher? when? closed minded? lol...actually most of em are not all..but majority

[ozrat]You can't say that because it's wrong
Anways, you didn't answer the question[/ozrat]

interestin...so why didnt they prove on news? newspaper? internet news? that usa is doin wrong? i saw only 2 of em..but majoritay against iraq...they want it

[edit]What? She's saying that she's only seen two pieces of American news that said the war is wrong? Damn...[/edit]
[ozrat]You still didn't answer my question[/ozrat]

i said ther is no small but large

[ozrat]Not my question. I said do you think it's wrong for people to be like that?[/ozrat]

wrong for them to be closed minded? DUh
yeah
lol

[ozrat]Then why are you doing the same thing?[/ozrat]

closed minded about what? that it is a good thin usa goin ther?

[ozrat]You're being close minded about Americans
For one[/ozrat]

well lemme ask u somethin... TELL ME a good reason why usa is ther?
if u can tell me a good reason...

So much for trying to convince her that being close-minded is bad in ALL situations...
We're back with Iraq now.

[ozrat]Because they got rid of one of the worst leaders ever? Don't deny that.
I'm not saying they did it in the best way, but they still did
And I'm not saying that he's the only bad leader out there
And I'm not saying that the country is any better now[/ozrat]

haha..why dun they go china? or mexico? or russia? or ukraine? it was totally wrong...u nevr lived in iraq...so ure bein a closed minded
i believed majority american are closed mined..to think to go and get rid of leader? when they dun live ther and dun kno the truths

[ozrat]And you never lived in America, so you're being closed minded
Good argument
You don't even look at the media or the truths, so you can't claim that you're any better[/ozrat]

no actually i am makin a point here... i rather hear about the ppl who are iraw and raised...told me..that their country isnt bad as u think they are...but the american are over extaggeratin...closed minded..wil take it different way
whose more closed minded?

[ozrat]I didn't say that it was a horrible country
I know that they had some of the highest health care and income levels in the middle east
I'm not ignorant
I know that they had a good lifestyle and country before
But look at what Sadamn did to his own countrymen
You're going to ignore that?[/ozrat]

iraq didnt asked american to com and fight...usa makin lotta lies about them...makin sadam look bad..nearly half of it is bull shit about sadam
most of it...bullshit.....if u didnt kno..that why im callin american closed minded,....cuz they believes that from media and other things...which arent true..why dun they go iraq and try to live ther? or vacation?
they believe sadam one of the worst..they are makin him look bad
which half of it BS
u dun think? technology? on tv? created him? made video's of him?
lol

[ozrat]I didn't say that he was one of the worst, I just said that he wasn't one of the best either
AND I SAID THAT ALL NEWS IS BIASED ANYWAYS
Liberal AND conservative[/ozrat]

doesnt matter....our leader in ontario wasnt the best either so now usa will com kill him? and includin us?

[edit]Once again, astounding logic![/edit]
[ozrat]Now you're just talking crazy[/ozrat]

all sadam shits u heard are bullshit...half of it..its all lies...
[edit]I am the Iraqi Information Minster! All your base are belong to us! Half of it is ours![/edit]
they created him on video's and made him look bad
they did alots
he isnt bad as u think it is...not the worst..not the best...jus a government...like u think bush is the best president? com on...lol...same thin

[ozrat]Once again
I'm not for the War, but I'm also not for being totally ignorant of what's going on
You're taking a very extreme viewpoint here
And you keep justifying your stereotypes, which is something you claim that the US has too much of[/ozrat]

well u kinda made it clear here...like he is the worst thin? like the one of us..like wha he done to his ppl?...lol..which is closed minded ...cuz he isnt bad at all..but not the best...why usa doin? cuz its a small country,,,easy target on them ...lol..very simple
they made lies on him so ppl can say "oh yeah he's bad...yeah usa goin ther cuz he's bad"
so on
do u actually believe he is bad? one of it?
like one of the worst?

[ozrat]Some aspects of him were exagerated
So torturing people shouldn't be a crime?[/ozrat]

[edit]Ready for it? Here comes Mrs. Prof![/edit]
haha..very typical thin u jus gav ...another lie...*ahem* very common one
u dun think in america ppl arent gettin tortured?

I now interrupt your reading to warn you that she's somehow trying to take my torture example into a KKK argument. Yeah, I know...

u dun think in america ppl arent gettin tortured?

[ozrat]Not on a common scale
And not officially[/ozrat]

the bombin ? shootin...columbine school
kkk klan [edit]kkk klan? Then it would be kkkk. Duh...[/edit]
so on

[ozrat]And they weren't in power now, were they?
Slavery is long over[/ozrat]

they still exist....kkklan still exist

[ozrat]I know
But they're not in charge of the country
And there's no slavery[/ozrat]

but they are killin their own ppl?
right?
not a different country but their own country
so why isnt usa focusin on this?

[ozrat]Yeah, that's why it's a crime
We are
But it's a social disease[/ozrat]

but its a big one..u wont hear in canada..about bombin..or neithn

[ozrat]Actually, you have a kkk in Canada as well
Don't deny that[/ozrat]

they com from america ...i read in the news...[edit]Which one is it? You read the news for facts? Or you don't read the news because all they do is lie?[/edit]

[ozrat]Nope
They're 100% Canadian
We already covered this in one of my courses
And in some areas, they got 15% of the vote
Try explaining that[/ozrat]

well at least our government wont go to another country and try to kill their own president and try to rule out
15% of what?

[ozrat]They ran for office and they got 15% of the vote[/ozrat]

in here? in ontario?

[ozrat]The Heritage Front
I forget which providence exactly[/ozrat]

well i havent heard of it ...all i kno crimes in canada isnt half bad as usa..not nearly at all... i can easily go outside..walk...feel safe...no shootin...u'll only hear 1 time 3 months.....barely...newys that not my point..my point is...at least our govern dun go to attack another country..JUS becuz THEY THINK...they HAV the RIGHT to do it...go try to rule out and kill the govern....*sigh*
is easy for me to explain to ppl like my close friends, best friends, my family, ppl here..then u...but its okay

[edit]Awww, thanks for your sympathy... Not.[/edit]

Here's the final bit of the conversation that took place before I had to leave.

[ozrat]I never said that the us has the right either
I agree with you about the war being a big mistake
But I'm just trying to point out that you can't be ignorant about stuff here
Like it or not[/ozrat]

i jus dun hav any i mean ANY good reason to agree with usa
that's all
ther is no reason.,not evn 1

[ozrat]I know, but you shouldn't be ignorant
You're just spreading lies about the US like some Americans spread lies about Iraq
And that's just wrong
Look, I gotta go
Talk later?[/ozrat]

sure np...take care...
bye

Conclusion
And there you have it! Kiddies, it's perfectly fine to be liberal here in AmeriKKKa and KKKanada because we were given those rights by our forefathers.
However, claiming that:

1.)Chinese eat their own people
2.)Poland is cool
3.)Mexico and Ukraine are worse than Iraq
4.)Not listening to the news and facts is the best way to be informed
5.)Stereotyping is the only way to fight the supposed stereotyping that is destroying the world

is the worst way that you can try to hold a debate. You CAN be liberal, but you can't be an ignorant idiot who automatically accepts every conspiracy theory they've ever come aross. This only makes you look bad and really puts a bad face to your entire argument and it's supporters. Not that anybody would support what you're saying here anyways.

Know what you're talking about. Don't be a rebel without a cause. You can't change the world by being this way.

EDIT: Hrm. Man, this thing probably uses every misspelling script changer that Roshambo made for us! I didn't think that was possible to do in one post.

 

[Montez]

I gave it the old college try (pun intended), but that is some of the worst writing I've ever encountered. Between the horrible leetspeak, word filters, and her inability to create a coherent paragraph or idea I couldn't understand anything she was saying.

 

[Ozrat]

That's why I said you should just skip down to the conclusion/summary that I wrote at the bottom. I think that it put out all of the really funny "points" that she was trying to pass onto me.

If anybody actually survives a reading of this, please post down what you think.

Now you know how I felt when I was reading this shit during real-time chat.

 

[Wooz]

Ozrat wrote:

She's Polish, which might explain her ignorance. But she's also a quarter Jewish, so her argument doesn't make a lot of sense...
Unfortunately, she has a weird view about how the world looks at Poland

AKHEM. Excuse me. I am polish, too. I'm sorry, but I don't like people calling me a dumb fuck because of my nationality. Now, I understand it was a reference to the common "polish joke", but please keep in mind that there are some polish members here at NMA.

Regarding her ill-formulated thoughts, what she meant on WWII is that nearly 3 Million of the 6 Million Jewish victims were polish. It may seem a drastic number, but it's due to the 16-th century policy that Poland applied on Jews, it was very much a "safe haven" from the Catholic inquisition, omnipresent in the rest of Europe.
I'm far from saying Poles and Jews get along very well since around 1920, just mentioning that the Jewish community was huge before WWII. Nowadays, there are practically no Jews in Poland, much due to the cretin nationalist approach of the "average" Pole.

Which I deeply despise, just as any kind of nationalism and zealous patriotism. And no, blind Anti-Americanism is just as stupid as racism. My avatar applies only to the part of America that supports the Fuhrer W. Bush administration.

That's what I think.

 

[KurganFr]

I had the great pleasure of discussing polotics on MSN Messanger with a gal from my school

Please, tell me she's not studying to become an engineer, or is she? That was the most meaningless piece of garbage I've ever read (and attempted to understand)! The spelling and grammar made me recoil in horror from my screen. You're a patient rat, Ozrat, I would have logged off about five lines into the conversation. *shudder*
Anyway, is there really some residual bad feeling between Canadians and Americans for historical reasons? (as there is between France and England)

 

[Ozrat]

Okay, thanks for the clarification on what she was trying to say there. But you have to admit that it made absolutely no sense unless either you know a lot about Polish history or you have ESP.

What do you think about her cospiracy stating that Americans are trying to supress the athetic accomplishments of Poland? Is there any truth to this? Or is she just rambling here?

I grew up with Polish jokes, so I apologize for saying something like that. It's something that I'll have to grow out of apparently.

Okay
So there's a blond driving through some farmland one day and she see's another blonde sitting in a rowboat in of the fields. The blonde in the field has two oars and is vainly trying to row somewhere. The blonde in the car gets all pissed and stop the car. She gets out and yells "it's stupid blondes like you who give all blondes a bad name!" The rowing blonde just ignores here and keeps rowing. So the blonde on the road gets even more pissed and yells out "man, if I could swim, I'd go out there and kick your ass!"

Moral: It's just funny when people try to break a stereotype and actually facilitate it even further. Wooz69, you actually had something smart and intelligent to say here, but you have to admit that if I replaced "blonde" with "Polish" here, the girl I chatted with did just that.

 

[welsh]

Ozrat, are you even sure she's a college student? From her spelling it would look like she's still in grade school.

I am honestly reluctant to comment, even to your summary, because I can't see what she's trying to say. Would it be possible for you to edit this so it makes sense. I tried reading it and got half way through. Sorry, it just hurts my head too much.

 

[Ozrat]

Please, tell me she's not studying to become an engineer, or is she?

Hehe She's an artsie that's studying humanities or some crap like that. All of the faculties besides engineering here at McMaster are required to take Critical Thinking courses because of reasons like this, but either she's not learing anything from it or she hasn't taken it yet. We engineers are far too inteligent to fall for crap like that... 8)

You're a patient rat, Ozrat, I would have logged off about five lines into the conversation. *shudder*
Anyway, is there really some residual bad feeling between Canadians and Americans for historical reasons? (as there is between France and England)

Not really. America and Canada has the largest friendly border in the world. We are the biggest trading parteners to each other last time I heard. But for some odd reason, the people seem to be against each other.

Americans jive the Canadians simply because they're another country. I got more than my fair share of "he's got SARS!!!" when I went back to Wisconsin this summer.

Canadians, however, hate feeling inferior to their bigger cousin to the south. They're always being compared to them and thus feel like they are always being put down or something along those lines. Unfortunately, with the onset of 9/11 and the rising levels of blind Anti-Americansim in the world, a lot of Canadians have followed suit. Canada is more multi-cultural then America and a large number of the population are first-or-second generation Canadians, so whatever Anti-Americanism that existed in their ethnic countries might have remained with them when they moved to Canada. This is only my speculation, not an attempt to prove this with racism. And it doesn't help that there's been a couple of political figures that have been dissing Americans within the last two years. As one of the Prime Minister's closest advisors said, "Damn Americans! I hate those bastards!" And it didn't help that the Prime Minster refused her resignation...

What was once just a friendly rivalry is spinning out of control here in North America. I saw America should annex those Frenchie snobs and start WWIII just like in Fallout!

EDIT: Yes Welsh, she's going to school here at McMaster. I've visited her dorm room a couple of times, but I had no idea that she thought like this before. Yeah, taking an English course after that critical thinking wouldn't hurt either.

I'll see what I can do about doing a cliffnotes version of this tripe.

 

[Wooz]

What do you think about her cospiracy stating that Americans are trying to supress the athetic accomplishments of Poland? Is there any truth to this? Or is she just rambling here?

I grew up with Polish jokes, so I apologize for saying something like that. It's something that I'll have to grow out of apparently

No offence taken Every culture has these kind of jokes, to my amazement the jokes are all the same in the content, only the "victims" change nationality: in France there are Belgian jokes, in Mexico there are "Gallego" jokes or Argentinian jokes, in Poland you have Romanian jokes...


*Sigh*
About the conspiracy theories... It's all due to the fact that this place has been (sorry for the language) utterly fucked by other nations for the last 150 years. Before that, from the 16th to the end of the 18th century, this country was, and I'll mark it again, was one of the most powerful nations in eastern Europe. (ie Polish troops stopped the Turkish/ottoman invasion and fended off the turkish army in Vienna)

Another fact that matters is that Poland recovered full independance quite recently, in 1989. ( I'm sorry Ratty, don't want to go against your ideals, but Poland was occupied by the USSR form 1944 to 1989)
All this sums up to the classic "hey! I'm as good as you or even better" approach this chick displays, which is, sadly, quite common here in Poland.
It's something like the "fallen superpower" complex France suffers. (and damnit again, don't ask me how, but I happen to be French, Polish and Mexican) (the perfect hate target for an american republican lol)

And actually, the more polish history you know, the less those Polish suprematist theories make sense. Unless you're a right wing polish extremist who thinks that all history has been made up by "Masons and Jews to dominate the Master race".

Well. I hope it answered to your question.

 

[Bradylama]

The only thing Americans hate about Canada are the French Canadians... or at least I do. >_>

It hurt, too much. All that shorthand. I couldn't get halfway through it.

Unfortunately Ozrat, it seems that people like her are in the Liberal majority. The blatant ignorance being spouted by war protesters is causing more Centrist Americans to resent the Left. War protests that disrupted traffic in major cities like L.A. didn't help either.

The only Liberals I've seen that actually know what they're talking about are Europeans. Not that I agree with them, =P but at least most of them have my respect for being relatively informed.

Every Liberal I've ever met could never give me an good reason (if at all) for why leaving Saddam in power would help peace in the Middle East.

 

[Ozrat]

Okay, thanks for giving me a rational Polish view on what she was talking about yet again. Perhaps that's only from your French and Mexican sides though...

Bradylama, the problem is that a lot of Americans still think that Canada is filled with nothing but the stereotypical Quebecors and Natives. This is wrong as well, but, well, you get my point, right? I don't want to have to again... But then again, even Canadians hate the Quebecors...

Also, as I stated in the chat, I am against the war as well. But I'm also against ignorance. Being an ignorant radical leftist is just as bad as blindly following whatever the president says. Having war protests is good and healthy as long as it's done intelligently.

True, leaving Saddam in peace may not directly and immediately help to maintain peace in the Middle East, but neither would removing him the way we did. There is no simple answer, so you shouldn't simply write off other views as conspiracies only.

And if you guys think that reading something like:

hhmm..well b/c its got alots to do it...very much...jus the {It's "people". You can write legibly. Don't bother crying about it.} dun notices at all...im polish...i hav family who are in poland...i know it...jus like iraq {It's "people". You can write legibly. Don't bother crying about it.} they know it...jus like palestinian...u c? for u may be a different situation...u may not experience it in this way...but in a different way...i dun blame u...it is u..and wher u brought up...jus the way u think will awlys be different from {It's "people". You can write legibly. Don't bother crying about it.} who were born in a different country or know things like this
i understands
newys...

is bad, then you should've read it like this:

hhmm..well b/c its got alots to do it...very much...jus the {It's "people". You can write legibly. Don't bother crying about it.} dun notices at all...im polish...i hav family who are in poland...i know it...jus like iraq {It's "people". You can write legibly. Don't bother crying about it.} they know it...jus like palestinian...u c? for u may be a different situation...u may not experience it in this way...but in a different way...i dun blame u...it is u..and wher u brought up...jus the way u think will awlys be different from {It's "people". You can write legibly. Don't bother crying about it.} who were born in a different country or know things like this
i understands
newys...

That's how I was reading it in MSN!

 

[Bradylama]

Why the Hell did you even bother?

Any rational human being would give up unless he had a hard-on for her...

 

[Sander]

Argh! The EVILNESS of that writing. It's just....gah!

*hates ignorant Polish chick for ruining his fun*

 

[John Uskglass]

I would say that Poland was powerful because Lithuania was weak, because the Germans force-converted them. That is what you get from living in a city where Polaski day is a holiday.

True, leaving Saddam in peace may not directly and immediately help to maintain peace in the Middle East, but neither would removing him the way we did. There is no simple answer, so you shouldn't simply write off other views as conspiracies only.

That was..................rational. Good God, you are the first leftist I have herd of to use ration in.......a half a century.

 

[Sander]

That was..................rational. Good God, you are the first leftist I have herd of to use ration in.......a half a century.

...

I take offense to that.

 

[welsh]

Actually I can sympathize for the Canadians. They really live in the shadow of the US. Ask most Americans who the head of state in Canada is and they might say "ahhh... Tony Blair?"

We just don't know much about Canada. Almost no Canadian history. We do realize they have trees, polar bears and eskimos. Some of us have gone to Montreal and Quebec.

Personally I don't hate the French Canadians. I know a few and get along very well with them. I do think that if Quebec were to go independent, then chances are the rest of Canada would be in trouble (and potentially annexed in a George Bush dream of America- more room for hunting and lets cut down them trees!)

For their part, the Canadians are almost bombarded with information from the US. THey know too much about the US for their own liking, while AMericans are ignorant of them. This and they probably feel that NAFTA is a form of US imperialism- even if Canadians have benefitted more than Americans.

But the problem with the discussion of the war is that it's protest, and its easy to protest or get emotional about these things. Note that most of this is being done by college and high school students who have a lot of time on their hands to think about these things.

I will disagree Bradylama, but that's because I am liberal and american (even I did not support keeping Saddam in power). There are lots of liberals who do know what they are talking about and have plenty of reason to be worried about the government that is currently in office.

I also think centralist america is beginning to see that, thus the dip in GB's approval rating. It is hard for centralist america to turn away when there are the wives and children of military people abroad asking the question "What the hell are our fathers and husbands doing in that corner of the world and when are they coming home?"

The problem with the debate is that its becoming polemical and emotional. People disagree and hate each other for disagreeing. Worse there are moral reasons for both sides.

If you support the war, you support imperialism, conquest, american expansionism and the deaths of thousands of innocent lives.

If you are anti the war, you support the maintenance of cruel dictators who use torture and mass murder as a means to stay in power, are unwilling to try to help the world despite having the power, and will show a blind eye and are therefore partially responsible for the deaths of thousands of innocent lives.

Thus each side has a moral argument for feeling the other side is morally bankrupt. Each side can believe they are right. This makes the argument bitter, and leaves a lot of folks feeling like they don't want to get involved- if only to stay out of what promises to be a bitter argument.

It gets worse because the media has made the debate polemical. There are enough talking heads on TV to move the discussion about to satisfy agendas. People listen and follow. Because they feel one side lies, they feel it fit to pass other lies.

It's not about logic, but emotion.

As stated before, I am glad that Saddam is out of power and I think that the establishment and encouragement of democratic governance is a good thing. However, I don't think that the Bush administration has been conducting itself well at all, and I don't believe that the ends justify the means.

 

[Wooz]

CC wrote:

I would say that Poland was powerful because Lithuania was weak, because the Germans force-converted them.

Hmmm. As far as I know, Poland united with Lithuania in order to form the Polish-Lithuanian Republic. queen Jadwiga (polish) married prince Jagiello from Lithuania, which became king of both "countries" afterwards, merging them into a parlamentary monarchy.

And sorry, didn't get the "That is what you get from living in a city where Polaski day is a holiday" thing.

 

[Ozrat]

Argh! The EVILNESS of that writing. It's just....gah!

*hates ignorant Polish chick for ruining his fun*

Awww, just because she pulled a "Sander" better than you?

That was..................rational. Good God, you are the first leftist I have herd of to use ration in.......a half a century.

...

I take offense to that.

Just because I can actually do a "welsh" when I try?

Hehe. I'm just joshing you here Sander.

Thanks ConstinpatedCrapRunner. You actually had the reasoning skills to look at what I was trying to say rather than blindly pushing it aside. The problem with today's world issues is that we tend to polarize our views way too much. We tend to be extremely critical of anything that the other viewpoint says while accepting anything that others say that leans towards our views without doing any kind of reality check to it.

Before I started going to school here in Canada, I held similar views that the Bush Administration was pure evil with nothing but dastardly agendas. When I moved here to Canada, however, I saw the same thing going on in other students and I took a step back to analyze what was going on here. That's when I learned the difference between opposing something with reason and opposing something with blind hate.

Blind Anti-Americanism is a relatively common problem in America these days, but in other countries it is probably even more epidemic just because of the common feeling over there. I know that it's at least true in Canada.

Welsh, that was an excellent commentary that you did on anti-americanism in Canadians and in general.

If only people could be born with a reality-checker...

Bradylama, yes she's a looker. But that's not the reason why I continued to try and reason with her. Just the hope that I could get at least one point across to her was enough. Too bad that it failed.

Oh, and CCR? Since when have you been around for over half a century?

 

[John Uskglass]

I live in Chicago, we have a bigger Polish population than anywhere outside of Warsaw.

Poland was relitivley powerful in the 15th century before they annexed Lithuania. Lithuania started crumbuling because 95% of it's population was Orthodox and they where Catholic. When they annexed Lithuania they became uber-powerful. I doubt they could have stood up against the Ottomans without it.

 

[Bradylama]

Please note, Welsh, that I said the majority of Liberals are ignorant of their own arguments. And by majority, I mean more specifically, the vocal majority.

I support the war, but I didn't like how the administration handled itself leading up to it. The administration's lack of charisma and the lack of substance being presented by Democrats are the primary reasons I'll be voting Libertarian.