Can DLCs save this one?

Hassknecht

Hassknecht

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That is the question. In the old days add-ons could really improve and complete games by adding more content, more features and fixing issues on a larger scale than patches could do. Sometimes, the add-ons were so big and so much better than the base game that people remember them more than the base game itself (like Starcraft: Brood War, or Supreme Commander: Forged Alliance).
In the age of DLCs and high bandwidth Internet this kinda stopped happening, as the add-ons often got smaller and more numeous, while patches could become increasingly larger.
Still, DLCs can still add a lot to a game. New Vegas' DLCs added several large additional maps, many new items, characters, and a very interesting subplot that ties in with the main game. NV was good on its own, but the DLCs certainly added a lot to it. Deus Ex: Human Revolution's The Missing Link added quite literally a missing link in the story and fixed some issues people had with the game, like the boss fights.
Back to the question: Can DLCs save Fallout 4 from being a total borefest? NV and DX:HR are good games and can stand up on their own, but is there enough substance in Fallout 4 that DLCs can improve upon? DLCs are not full TC mods, so can they really do enough? Fallout 3 sucked, but The Pitt at least tried with a more engaging story and some really nice environments. But Fallout 4 is even more shallow than Fallout 3 in many aspects, so I'm not sure if there could be a The Pitt for it.
But Bethesda already announced that they'll overhaul Survival Mode. So maybe they really are willing to add large changes to the gameplay in their DLCs, similar to what large add-ons used to do? Maybe they'll bring back some of the cut content, like the Combat Zone and the Roboderby?
But can it really be enough? To me, Fallout 4 plays well enough if you take it as an Action RPG/Shooter. What kills it is the terrible story, the terrible characters, and the incredibly repetitive gameplay.
Can DLCs fix that to some degree?

Although I guess the question should be, can Bethesda fix that?
 
Well, trying to be optimistic - yes, I think DLC could save the game. But it would need to be several DLC with a lot of content, that is very well written and full of interesting dialogue, choices and consequences, as well as new weapons and armor options and rebalanced gameplay. Some new large areas to explore with interesting locations, as well as new additions to the main area. New enemy types, both in new areas and in the main game. New quests in the main game that let you roleplay (for example a gang of raiders you can join, either for raiding stuff or for infiltrating them) - quests with choices. And so on. If Bethesda really stepped up their game, it could be done.

Is it realistic to hope for? Not really. Not even one great DLC and several mediocre would be likely to get me into the game again. The new content would have to outweigh the main content enough that I could suffer through it only to play the good stuff.
 
Not Bethesda DLC, no. Oh, you already made that joke.

The things that kill the game for me the most involve the bad writing and shitty quests. Shy of rewriting/rerecording huge chunks of text and dialog, there's no way I'm going to want to play through this mess again. I can't shut my brain down sufficiently to enjoy it without forgetting how to breathe.
 
I don't think that DLCs will safe FO4 because Bethesda's DLCs never touch the core game much (quests, NPCs, game mechanics, etc), there might be nice and interesting DLCs but they will be a much smaller scale and just usually a much smaller map, the core FO4 will not change except for a few new weapons, armors, chems (maybe), food (maybe), perk magazines (maybe) and perks (maybe).

FO3 Broken Steel DLC and FNV DLCs added a cool mechanic which was allowing the level cap to increase, but since FO4 has no level cap I don't see it affecting FO4 outside of the DLC map/areas.
 
Personally I think for the most part some of the best Bethesda content has been DLC, Shivering Isles, Dragonborn, The Pitt, and Point Lookout are all the best parts of the vanilla game. As for FO4, I don't think they are willing to do what needs to be done to band-aid the game, including but not limited to a total overhaul of the base game.
 
If the dialogue cross really is hardcoded into the engine, that fact alone will be a burden that will continue to hold back player choice like in the base game, and be a constant cripple reminding players of Bethesda's, for all practical purposes, worst decision to date no matter how great other parts of the DLC are. In this case, the DLC can't save FO4.
 
No.

This game is a "go home and try again" type situation.

Bethesda's art department is great in how they designed the world and aesthetic of everything, unfortunately the game itself is a shallow, half-assed, procedurally generated product with a dialogue wheel, robotic animations, immersion breaking voiced-protagonist, and so on.

At this point I'm just trying to rationalize away all the terrible aspects of Fallout 4 so I can someday play it and hopefully have the same sense of wonderment as I did with Fallout 3 and New Vegas.

In other words, the only option I have now to play Fallout 4 is to try to put myself in the mind of the so-called "Fanboy" in order to be happy with how it turned out instead of eternally disappointed.
 
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When it's still shown that the dialogue cross is locked in place, I'm going to be like, 'Truth is, game was fucked from the start.'
 
A DLC can't save any game. You can improve a game which is already good but has a few flaws here and there in my opinion but nothing beyond that. Example Diablo 2 Classic, it was a good game but before The Lord of Destruction Expansion unique items, with the exception of a few, where basically useless as well as Set items. Anyhow, the expansion boosted an already good game to greatness and introduced a lot of new things showing how modular the approach of developing it in the first place was. A clusterf*ck like F4 can't be fixed this way, it is like trying to say "okay so um... we have Comic Sans in our logo. Maybe giving it a different color scheme will make it look better" just...no
 
DLC only serves to add more content to an already good game. If you add side helpings to a pile of polished turd and the side helpings themselves are made from polished turds then it isn't going to get any better.

I say Bethesda should just cut their losses (as in with their fanbase, they certainly aren't suffering from any losses with their cash inflow) and save all the time and resources for making a standalone expansion with everything they fucked up fixed, and have that be free for all Season Pass buyers. Then a year and a half later we get the real sequel by Obsidian and everyone is happy again.
 
Practicat said:
If the dialogue cross really is hardcoded into the engine, that fact alone will be a burden that will continue to hold back player choice like in the base game, and be a constant cripple reminding players of Bethesda's, for all practical purposes, worst decision to date no matter how great other parts of the DLC are. In this case, the DLC can't save FO4.
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There's already a mod that turns the wheel into a list (and also one that removes the player VA). I can't imagine that the engine can't handle more than four choices, I mean, it's basically the Skyrim engine.
 
Nope, nothing can save Fallout 4. New Vegas DLC was so good because it improved an already great game. They knew what they were going to do for the DLC before the game came out, hence all the references to Dead Money and Lonesome Road in game. Well written characters, interesting environments, new perks, a whole lot of new guns and more. They didn't treat it like DLC, they gave it 100% and then some. The DLC's for New Vegas were perfectly written imo, although sometimes there could be some fetch quests and repetitive gameplay (HH, OWB) but the writing made up for it. I played Honest Hearts trying to find out what happened to Randall Clark, while also having amazing dialogue with Joshua Graham. I was able to connect to a character whose story is written through terminal entries better than any single character Bethesda has ever made in a Fallout game. I think that speaks for itself, I doubt Fallout 4's DLC will redeem anything, i'm guessing that it's just going to be wacky stupid off the wall bullshit akin to Mothership Zeta. That's what the kids want now a days, right?
 
Oh hey, did you hear? The update 1.3 part where it "fixes Preston giving repeating quests" actually got fixed. This delayed GECK release date is getting more and more suspicious by the second. Just admit that you forced your studio* to release the game early and broken as fuck, Bethesda Softworks.

*Bethesda Game Studios

Hassknecht said:
There's already a mod that turns the wheel into a list (and also one that removes the player VA). I can't imagine that the engine can't handle more than four choices, I mean, it's basically the Skyrim engine.
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The Skyrim engine could handle more than four choices. The reworked Creation Engine for Fallout 4 looks like it could before, but someone decided to gut that whole system and hardcode in an untested dialogue system because somewhere along the line of development, someone up top said the game needed a dialogue wheel. It's pretty clear, since it looks and feels like the kind of features the developer didn't originally want to put in the game.

The list mod only reskins the wheel into boxes, since you still have to use the keys and do not have a scrolling dialogue box, and the VA removal literally just removes the voice files, since the PC still does the mouth-moving animations.
 
DLC´s making a difference would require to have good quests, something the main game failed to do. Another thing for that to happen is the dlc´s being connected somehow with the main game, but since it´s besheda the only conection will probably be just some adicional voice lines for the NPC´s and a message box about receiving a radio transmission.
 
It's possible that some add-ons might improve the game if they're done well - good writing, good quest design, good locations, etc. But even if, and that's a big if, Bethesda can deliver on all that, there are still the problems that are pretty much built into the game, like the abysmal dialogue system and the half-assed roleplaying elements.
 
While I don't think DLC can save Fallout 4, nor can mods, I do think that a combination of really well-written DLC and a complete skills and dialogue overhaul mod could indeed save the game. But that would require some initiative on Bethesda Softworks' part, so that's a bit of a dream there, but still.

I'm probably being overly hopeful, but I really want both New Vegas in the Fallout 4 engine AND a new Fallout game by Obsidian.
 
I think they could save the game, but I'm almost certain they won't. They'd have to address some core issues with the game, such as a meaningless ending (and we had not nearly enough outcry, like in Mass Effect, for it to happen), the ridiculous RNG systems, just to name a few, and be well-written and full of interesting choices.

I doubt Bethesda wants to do the former, and I also doubt they could do the latter to save their lives...
 
Okay being realistic? Short answer: No, long answer: Noooooo.
You can't put cherries and whipped cream on a turd because at the end of the day it's still a turd. I'd like to think DLC is supposed to compliment the base game not fix everything wrong with it.
Fallout 4 is unsalvagable period, the only way to make a good DLC is if they let Obsidian make a standalone DLC game like howFar Cry Blood Dragon was done.
 
MercenarySnake said:
Okay being realistic? Short answer: No, long answer: Noooooo.
You can't put cherries and whipped cream on a turd because at the end of the day it's still a turd. I'd like to think DLC is supposed to compliment the base game not fix everything wrong with it.
Fallout 4 is unsalvagable period, the only way to make a good DLC is if they let Obsidian make a standalone DLC game like how Far Cry Blood Dragon was done.
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Now, I get what you're trying to say but that is a pretty horrible comparison. Far Cry 3 was already good! By standards for the genre, for the generation of graphics, for pretty much everything an FPS is supposed to have. Of course Blood Dragon would've done well regardless.

Then again, New Vegas was basically a very, very large standalone expansion to Fallout 3. I've been surprised before, it's possible I'll be again.
 
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