Censorship? There is no censorship!

Akratus said:
Nobody wants to spread the word of the good gamergate is doing.
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That's because everyone in the media realizes that there's very little good being done, and that it's overwhelmed by all of the hateful shit that keeps coming out of GamerGate. The fact that you, in this very thread, in the last few pages, repeatedly defended and rationalized harassment is a pretty good example of that.
 
No, Akratus, I'm just telling you how people view GamerGate. This is what Jimmy Wales has been trying to tell you for days, and instead of trying to find some way to fix those issues, GamerGate threatens to doxx him and starts digging into his private life. GamerGate proved him right, as it just keeps proving everyone right who thinks it's a hateful ball of harassment.

That's what happens when you embrace RogueStar and Milo and fartchives and InternetAristocrat and I could keep on naming horrendous people associated with GamerGate but there's no point. That's why you're not getting a voice in the media.
 
It's a little better, but still no more than a D- in effort. Don't you have any more tricks up your sleeve? Call me a shitlord or something. No wait, tell me I condone rape! Doesn't seem like my feelings are very susceptible to your weak efforts though.

Anyway, yeah, Milo, IA, random trolls et al can be dicks. I don't really follow or necessarily condone what they sometimes do or say.

Oliver Campbell, Total Biscuit, Mark Ceb, Instig8iveJournalism, Freddrick Brennan (one's opinion on 8chan and it's boards notwithstanding), Shoe on Head, LeoPirate, TechRaptor, Ariel Connor, Paul Hubbans and some other indie devs, the tfyc guys, Platinum Paragon, Jennie Bharaj, Daniel Vavra, and Mrs Sommers are nice people though.
 
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It's not about your feelings, Akratus. I'm explaining how everyone who's not in GamerGate views that movement. I'm explaining why you're not getting any positive media attention.

Akratus said:
Anyway, yeah, Milo, IA, random trolls et al can be dicks. I don't really follow or necessarily condone what they sometimes do or say.
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And yet, they're parts of GamerGate -- and they get a lot of attention from GamerGate as a whole. And because of that, GamerGate is not getting any play, and will never get any play in the media. Until and unless you find ways to divorce yourself from "random trolls et al", you won't.

Hey, it's like people have been saying this for months.
 
But I support an evil satanist anonymous hacking rapist hate group. Don't you care about my feelings?


Anyway, if you know a way to start something new out of gamergate without carrying over the absolute lack of a positive image, I'm all ears. I'm sure I can pull some strings with my 15 twitter followers.
 
Start an organized movement where you can control the message and consciously exclude people.
 
See that's kind of an ideological stumbling block for most gamergate suporters. We look at NeoGaf and think to ourselves. . Yeah, no. It's basically exactly what a lot of GamerGaters are opposed to.

where you can control the message and consciously exclude people.
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Not to overreact, but this gives me orwellian vibes.
 
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And that's why you're part of a group that creates room for and is filled with people who everyone else finds abhorrent: because you refuse to distance yourself from those people by any effective means because of "Orwellian vibes". You've got something to say, right? Some kind of message you'd like to get out? Organizing yourselves so you can actually get that message out is not Orwellian. That's how you communicate. That's how the world works in every place that is not 8chan. Because 5,000 people randomly shouting at others is a dysfunctional form of communication, but 5,000 people uniting themselves in one organization behind one message is effective.
 
Sander said:
And that's why you're part of a group that creates room for and is filled with people who everyone else finds abhorrent: because you refuse to distance yourself from those people by any effective means because of "Orwellian vibes". You've got something to say, right? Some kind of message you'd like to get out? Organizing yourselves so you can actually get that message out is not Orwellian. That's how you communicate. That's how the world works in every place that is not 8chan. Because 5,000 people randomly shouting at others is a dysfunctional form of communication, but 5,000 people uniting themselves in one organization behind one message is effective.
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None of this is the problem. None of what you just said gives us orwellian vibes. It's saying 'We need to control the message, i.e you have to get in line, and we kick out anybody who says things we don't like' that gives us orwellian feelings. Because it's fucking authoritarian.

If people want to get together and support a message they don't need to put people under oath and have them swear they're not right wing, mra, don't make offensive jokes, aren't critical of leftern politics or don't criticize anyone who gets into this clique.

This is what awaits you if people go down your path:
4Yd4q7M.png
 
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If you don't want to kick out people doing abhorrent things, people will rightly judge your organization for creating room, associating with and (in GamerGate's case) promoting those people and their actions. If you don't want that, then you have to kick them out. And to do that, you need to have an organizational structure from which you can actually exclude people, and some central organ that can say "Yo we have nothing to do with those people".

But as long as you dumbasses continue to think that's horrible, you will be seen as a group that harbors and condones some pretty horrible stuff. Because that's exactly what you are.
 
Aaaaaaaand we're back to rationalizing harassment. Thanks for proving my point, dude.
 
You get upset over such tiny things man. I'm not even upset, at this point you're straight up making me laugh!

No mercy for any rationalizations of the gamergate-o-caust, of course! :lol:
 
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I ain't upset, Akratus. I'm just explaining how everyone not in GamerGate, sees GamerGate. And why.
 
Akratus said:
None of this is the problem. None of what you just said gives us orwellian vibes. It's saying 'We need to control the message, i.e you have to get in line, and we kick out anybody who says things we don't like' that gives us orwellian feelings. Because it's fucking authoritarian.
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No, it's fucking responsible. It's how the adult world works. It's how organized movements for change work. Accountability. Presence. An organized, coherent message. Sander has described to you, in detail, why GaGa doesn't work. Your only retort is the childish "CALL ME NAME CALL ME NAMES CALL ME POOPYHEAD" repeated ad nauseam and ridiculous claims that maturity equals totalitarianism.

By the way, consistently ignoring the harassment, rape and death threats, doxxing, and stalking perpetrated by GamerGate members is rationalizing harassment. As a Redditor pointed out, your wishing it away doesn't make it go away. GamerGhazi is pretty good at keeping track of the heinous things your movement perpetrates. You might want to read something outside the echo chamber.
 
None of this is the problem. None of what you just said gives us orwellian vibes. It's saying 'We need to control the message, i.e you have to get in line, and we kick out anybody who says things we don't like' that gives us orwellian feelings. Because it's fucking authoritarian.
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That is how you responsibly lead an organisation though. What you describe is pretty much how any self respected organisation/party out there works. Hell, even the Dalai Lama gives the direction for his followers and kicks out opositions.

Could you imagine NMA without rules where everyone is free to say whatever they want, throwing out any insult etc.? It would end up like GamerGate.
 
Sander said:
That's because everyone in the media realizes that there's very little good being done, and that it's overwhelmed by all of the hateful shit that keeps coming out of GamerGate. The fact that you, in this very thread, in the last few pages, repeatedly defended and rationalized harassment is a pretty good example of that.
Click to expand...

Sander said:
No, Akratus, I'm just telling you how people view GamerGate. This is what Jimmy Wales has been trying to tell you for days, and instead of trying to find some way to fix those issues, GamerGate threatens to doxx him and starts digging into his private life. GamerGate proved him right, as it just keeps proving everyone right who thinks it's a hateful ball of harassment.

That's what happens when you embrace RogueStar and Milo and fartchives and InternetAristocrat and I could keep on naming horrendous people associated with GamerGate but there's no point. That's why you're not getting a voice in the media.
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Sander said:
It's not about your feelings, Akratus. I'm explaining how everyone who's not in GamerGate views that movement. I'm explaining why you're not getting any positive media attention.

Akratus said:
Anyway, yeah, Milo, IA, random trolls et al can be dicks. I don't really follow or necessarily condone what they sometimes do or say.
Click to expand...
And yet, they're parts of GamerGate -- and they get a lot of attention from GamerGate as a whole. And because of that, GamerGate is not getting any play, and will never get any play in the media. Until and unless you find ways to divorce yourself from "random trolls et al", you won't.

Hey, it's like people have been saying this for months.
Click to expand...

Sander said:
And that's why you're part of a group that creates room for and is filled with people who everyone else finds abhorrent: because you refuse to distance yourself from those people by any effective means because of "Orwellian vibes". You've got something to say, right? Some kind of message you'd like to get out? Organizing yourselves so you can actually get that message out is not Orwellian. That's how you communicate. That's how the world works in every place that is not 8chan. Because 5,000 people randomly shouting at others is a dysfunctional form of communication, but 5,000 people uniting themselves in one organization behind one message is effective.
Click to expand...

Sander said:
If you don't want to kick out people doing abhorrent things, people will rightly judge your organization for creating room, associating with and (in GamerGate's case) promoting those people and their actions. If you don't want that, then you have to kick them out. And to do that, you need to have an organizational structure from which you can actually exclude people, and some central organ that can say "Yo we have nothing to do with those people".
Click to expand...

Tagaziel said:
By the way, consistently ignoring the harassment, rape and death threats, doxxing, and stalking perpetrated by GamerGate members is rationalizing harassment. As a Redditor pointed out, your wishing it away doesn't make it go away. GamerGhazi is pretty good at keeping track of the heinous things your movement perpetrates. You might want to read something outside the echo chamber.
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and the point is sander, you should be above it. plus, the vast majority has never actually been concretely tied to GamerGate.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_fallacy

quite a bit of the severe harassment and doxxing has been tied to GNAA, that brazilian journalist, and that russian hacker group. and it does appear that the USU threat being linked to the brazillian journalist was rumor, neither sarkeesian/school/FBI/police are saying what they were able to track it down to.

it even appears that the local feminist organization that was trying to get sarkeesian to speak at USU started an online petition to change the laws making it easier for them to prevent people with conceal-carry permits to carry those guns on school grounds. they have over 20k signatures! (under 300 from people actually in utah though)

saw a video where they talked to one of the organizers was saying they have their first amendment rights to "petition the government for redresses" which i always find funny, using the first amendment to restrict the use of the second. and it requires denial of all studies and anylysis that shows people with legal conceal-carry permits are "safer" to have around than the police.

TheWesDude said:
what i like is how any attacks at brianna wu or sarkeesian or quinn is instantly harassment and representative of the whole of gamergate, but when you bring up positions and statements of radical/3rd wave feminists, all of a sudden they are a minority not representative of the whole.
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http://witchwind.wordpress.com/2013/12/15/piv-is-always-rape-ok/

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/a/andreadwor382827.html

and of course the (in)famous woman that wants to reduce the male population by 90%

femnisim has no "central management" or central organization, there are hundreds if not thousands of them.

face it, saying gamergate is a hate movement or based on sexism or misogyny or anything else is pretty fucked up on your part. i have said many times why this is a false allegation without being refuted. what is plainly obvious is people who have been the recipients attributing the harassment/doxxing to gamergate without any evidence. pro-tip: accusing gamergate of harassment/doxxing without any attempts to back it up does not make it true no matter how many times or how loudly you shout it. especially when non-gamergate groups specifically claim credit.

the problem is you guys are trying to craft a narrative not based on facts or evidence. which is exactly part of the problem.
 
Sander said:
That's what happens when you embrace RogueStar and Milo and fartchives and InternetAristocrat and I could keep on naming horrendous people associated with GamerGate
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Likewise there can be named horrendous people from the opposite side like Randy Harper, Mcintosh and that Wu thing, but guess what, they are being deemed almost champions of la rezistance or that's what ''everyone in the press thinks'', right? How about everyone who brings on their arguments in civil manner would be simply met at face value?
Sander said:
It's not about your feelings
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This coming from you.:rofl:It's everything about feelings now. Everything. See, people aren't allowed to even post scientific papers that support the ebul side, without being harassed (yeah, i can use that card too), because muh feelings.
 
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