Character-less PCs

Brother None

Brother None

This ghoul has seen it all
Orderite
Gamernode offers an editorial in which the author takes issue with the lack of personality of the PC in Fallout 3. Spoiler follows.<blockquote>Say for example, I head out into the wasteland of Washington, and proceed to do a side-quest that involves either dismantling a bomb in the middle of a fledgling township, or detonate it for a large pay-check. In my play-through, I dismantled the bomb, and then told the sheriff about the nasty man who'd propositioned me with the horrific idea of detonating the same device that got me born in Vault 101 in the first place. So I told the sheriff, and he runs into the bar to confront the deviously minded miscreant. Said miscreant then proceeds to kill the sheriff, and the game auto-saves, permanently killing off the one character I'd taken to in the game so far.

I was horrified. Not only was it my fault he was shot, I then had to go to his house and explain this to his ten year-old son. I felt like a despicable character who had cost a good man and father his life simply to grass up the local troublemaker. The kid took it hard, and I visited him every day since. Does my character reflect on it? No, but I do, and that saddens me even further. To just have my character stop outside that boy's empty house, and weep a little, even utter a few profanities in shock of what's taken place, would have sufficed.

It's not that we're trying to create our own lives as we would live them in these worlds, it's simply that there's no motivation to clear ten side-quests when they have no lasting impact on your avatar, but the main storyline does. Once I found my father, my dialogue changed, and the world began to change, albeit slightly. But I went back and killed those ants, and do you know what happened? Nothing. My character wasn't even upset at the loss of ammo.</blockquote>
 
I don't get it... he wants the game to role-play for him? Throw emotional cues at him that hopefully match the way he wants to represent his character?
 
I don't think he understands the principle of roleplaying. How does the game know that the character is emotionally distraught at this and doesn't think 'Hah serves those retards right'?

Also, the bit about autosaving is kind of funny since it only autosaves if you walk outside, and he should know that after playing 5 minutes of the game.
 
Er, I think you misunderstand his point, that the outcome of your actions isn't reflected in the characters' dialogues.
 
Ranne said:
Er, I think you misunderstand his point, that the outcome of your actions isn't reflected in the characters' dialogues.
Click to expand...
Here's what he said:
"To just have my character stop outside that boy's empty house, and weep a little, even utter a few profanities in shock of what's taken place, would have sufficed. "

That's not talking about your actions being reflected in dialogue, it's talking about wanting the game to choose an emotional response for you and show it to you.
 
Hey I got no problem with that editorial. Any editorial which focuses on things like dialog, story & quests when talking about what is supposed to be an RPG game I'm not going to tear apart even if I don't think exactly the same way as the reviewer. The guy isn't talking about VATS & MTFBOOM SPLODY TIME, on that relief alone cut him a break I say.
 
Sander said:
That's not talking about your actions being reflected in dialogue, it's talking about wanting the game to choose an emotional response for you and show it to you.
Click to expand...
Well, make it "the outcome of your actions isn't reflected in the characters' dialogues and their emotional responses." I mean, take a close look at GTA's Nico Bellic. "Predefined" or not, I'll play him over Fallout 3's emotionlessly generic what-his-name any time of day. What does an insipid, expressionless robot have to do with the principles of roleplaying? If you want me to assume the role of your imaginary character, you better come up with something a little bit more exciting than that.
 
LARP Like A Man

LARP Like A Man



Page 2: http://gamernode.com/columns/72-plot-wholes/7617-lazy-heroes/page2.html

Christos Reid said:
... What's the point in choosing good over evil if my character's never even going to reflect that in his speech? ...
Click to expand...

So he's asking that his scene mastications have
a broader spread of dialogue trees,
a layered array of scripted matrixes;
to facilitate, acknowledge, and reward his suspended disbelief,
to 'LARP and chew gum' at the same time.





4too
 
Damn! I misread and rushed in thinking somebody was finally talking about how FO3's NPCs are 2-dimensional and lacking in development, specially the major ones like your companions and even daddy (who, I think I already said somewheres before, is voiced in a monotonous manner, totally lacking in emotions) but no! This guy wants your "avatar" to cry... sigh...

I still don't get this people who can't understand silent characters (like Gordon Freeman) are a device to let you, the player, become more involved with the character (well it also serves to save in voice acting and recording lotsa .wavs)... and its only fitting that Role Playing games use them.

Also, might I add, some games (RPGs or not) do what this man wants, in way of the main character keeping a journal that is updated as the player advances the story. If the game is well written, you will know (and perhaps feel) what you "avatar" is feling -- of course that requires a more rigid story/character. More modern games may already have full voice acted main character and faces able to convey emotions.

All in all, as our beloved Per posted, this guy wants the game to roleplay for him... even the lamest blog-reviews know better...
 
^ Watch it, in the next Fallout they will implement a feature that will allow the avatar to shed shiny plum-sized tears during a close-up shot in slo-mo when he gets -karma (well, because they'll make him HAVE to repent the bad decision made...)
 
He's being ridiculous is all I have to say. Fable is exactly what he needs, methinks.
 
Ok, let's put it this way: you call it emotional cues, I call it realistic character behavior. First-person view may be a whole different kind of thing, but when you can always observe your character from a third-person perspective, the emotional state of this avatar becomes as much of an immersive factor as anything else around him/her, perhaps even more so.

When a character you play moves, talks and acts like a goddamn wooden marionette, what possible level of involvement are we talking about? In my view, it's downright immersion breaking. If your character is supposed to be a human being, some human emotions and reactions are not only appropriate but rather expected, wouldn't you agree?
 
^ Well, I'd like to hear about how you'd effectively implement that tho...

Not to mention that FO3 is barely playable in 3PP anyway.
 
Your charachter talks in FO3? I must've missed that. I never played third person, can't really see a reason to, it's just handicapping in a shooter.

Nico Bellics evident emotions is exactly why it's NOT roleplaying. You're not playing the role of Nico, it's playing out on the screen before you. A roleplaying game doesn't want you to assume the role of it's make believe character, it wants you to create your own (most of the time).
 
i remember a certain dialog with an evil NPC in fallout 2, where if you choose the line "i'm a bad ass mofo", and have bad carma, you get a quest, whereas if you have good carma, you get the response "you look like a wimp to me" or something like that. That is roleplaying.

Nico Belic's emotions are not roleplaying because they dont come as consequences of your choices; in that game the only real choices were "kill/dont kill X".

i dont know, dont dialog trees change with karma in fallout 3?

maybe the guy who wrote the editorial wanted to see the consequences of his actions reflected more in the dialogs and on his avatar? thats not an irrational demand.
 
On his avatar? So, when his karma would go to "evil", the character should be like evil-looking psycho?
 
Yeah! The Jedi powers in Fallout! That would be soo cool.

And it can be explained in so many ways!!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top