Eurogamer previews Fallout 3 yet again

Brother None

This ghoul has seen it all
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Another hands-on preview from Eurogamer, and they're sticking by their earlier assertions.<blockquote>As Oli's preview mentioned, Fallout 3 is not the most technically impressive game you'll see this year - the load screens that interrupt proceedings when you move between locations can kick in at jarring moments, the story's post-apocalyptic wilderness is often flat and low-res, and in third-person view, your character moves with an unlikely bounce in his step, which, at times, suggests he's trying to keep his spirits up while navigating this ruined wasteland by indulging in a spot of power-walking.

Things get significantly better at night, however, as the starry sky adds a monochrome sense of menace to the location, and even during the day, there are still plenty of nice touches to the design, such as a broken-backed flyover rising into the distant sky, or the discovery of a picket-fence-and-clapboard community, presumably once picture postcard idyllic, and long since shredded by a nuclear blast. Fallout 3 doesn't look terrible by any means, it simply seems disconcertingly inconsistent: the game offers up vast draw distances but has little to fill them with, and presents brilliantly menacing mutated enemies that often clip through the ground when you've killed them.</blockquote>Other than that, this Eurogamer article takes the rather curious viewpoint that Fallout 3 is too retro.<blockquote>Bad news first: when it comes to dialogue, Fallout 3 remains something of a stubborn throwback, unwilling to step away from traditional one-on-one interrogation mechanics and explore the new possibilities of a post-Mass Effect world. With no hint of radial selection or keyword attitude choices which seemed likely to become the RPG's version on Halo's rechargeable shield - a genre standard by virtue of near-unanimous theft - instead, a quick introductory conversation with the mayor of Megaton reveals that Fallout 3 is sticking with a system largely unchanged from the days of Monkey Island.
(...)
Dialogue is not the only sign that Fallout 3 is slightly old-fashioned. A trip to the local saloon in search of side quests reveals that the game's world can be slow to react to your presence, or often even acknowledge it. The saloon door is locked, meaning we have to tease it open with picks (instigating a simple but entertaining mini-game). This is all a little strange, as, once inside, we find that the place is actually open for business after all, and the saloon owner, who boasts a lovely silver mullet and a voice like Terry Wogan, doesn't seem to mind - or notice - that we've just forced our way in. More worrying is that, moments later, when we accidentally fire a round into the wall when trying to talk to the barman, nobody in the room so much as flinches.
(...)
But a single side quest or a half hour of chatting and shooting is no indicator of overall quality with a game like Fallout 3 that needs days, rather than hours, to get a true sense of. Our ninety minutes of exploration certainly raised a few concerns, with gunplay that we were often happier to run away from than engage with, and characters who would repeat the same handful of lines and were quick to forget the fact that we'd been shooting at them two minutes previously, but it also suggested a rich and engaging wealth of storytelling waiting to be explored. Whether the quality of the content allows it to rise above the sometimes glitchy delivery remains to be seen.

It's this clash of unpolished presentation and strong storytelling that may ultimately define what you make of Fallout 3. From what we've seen, however, it's tempting to suggest that Bethesda has unwittingly taken the game's theme of retro-futurism too much to heart. Confusing as it seems, Fallout 3 may represent the future of yesterday's RPGs, going back to when they were cruel, stubborn, and yet filled with memorable stories, rather than an evolution of the flashy, friendly, and often anaemic titles of today.</blockquote>That's certainly a new attitude. I like how he openly suggests all RPGs need to adapt to Mass Effect's model, tho'. Because nothing helps gaming as much as a total lack of diversity, right?
 
Brother None said:
The saloon door is locked, meaning we have to tease it open with picks (instigating a simple but entertaining mini-game). This is all a little strange, as, once inside, we find that the place is actually open for business after all, and the saloon owner, who boasts a lovely silver mullet and a voice like Terry Wogan, doesn't seem to mind - or notice - that we've just forced our way in. More worrying is that, moments later, when we accidentally fire a round into the wall when trying to talk to the barman, nobody in the room so much as flinches.
Is it weird that this has bugged me more than any other news about Fallout 3? :/
 
bonustime said:
Is it weird that this has bugged me more than any other news about Fallout 3? :/

Not if you're a big fan of immersion depending on a convincing, reactive game world.
 
Wow that is really, really weird.Hopefully they will flesh this out.

And am I the only one who prefers the good old Fallout-like dialogue trees to Mass Effects emotional cinematic responses? I don't like being voiced and having to look at my character that much.

"With no hint of radial selection or keyword attitude choices which seemed likely to become the RPG's version on Halo's rechargeable shield - a genre standard by virtue of near-unanimous theft..."

Damn, what a sentence.

"Confusing as it seems, Fallout 3 may represent the future of yesterday's RPGs, going back to when they were cruel, stubborn, and yet filled with memorable stories, rather than an evolution of the flashy, friendly, and often anaemic titles of today."

If this is true, FO3 will be awesome : ).
 
What sucks is that all of the flaws are going to be overlooked, because of the "journalists" being afraid of losing their advertising dollars.

We live in dark times, indeed.
 
And the wider presentation method doesn't help: the mayor may be an engaging character, ragged yet proud, and quickly revealed as a canny pragmatist, but the disconcerting head-on view taken directly from Oblivion, along with the limited animation, means these things have to be conveyed mainly by the written word.

Written word, my old nemesis.

But if the game retains much of Oblivion's aging traditions and limitations, the good news is that it also seems to have kept its richness in terms of content.

Wat

Confusing as it seems, Fallout 3 may represent the future of yesterday's RPGs, going back to when they were cruel, stubborn, and yet filled with memorable stories, rather than an evolution of the flashy, friendly, and often anaemic titles of today.

Is it opposite day or what? Where have they been hiding this old-school game?
 
The bit about how the dialogue is old-fashioned is annoying to me, and I've seen it thrown around in other places since Mass Effect was released. What can I say? I for one certainly hope that MEs (or upcoming Alpha Protocol) type of dialogue won't become the norm in RPGs. I was glad that Bioware chose to do it "the old way" so to speak with Dragon Age as well.
I just can't see how anyone can feel the ME dialogue is evolving RPG dialogues. It might be fun in itself in some games, but it is only evolving if the main goal of RPGs is to be more like cinema (which is also something which many games seem to strive for).

ANYWAYS, one thing that I think will really destroy Fallout 3 in many ways is the leftovers from Oblivion. Here you have a world which tries to be so "immersive", drawing the player, making the player feel like he is in the game and whatnot. And when that illusion breaks (which it does constantly in Oblivion), it really really hurts the games credibility overall.

You see stuff like that all the time in Oblivion, a NPC talking friendly to you in dialogue, only to tell you angrily that you should piss off when you leave. Strange quirks like that really hurt the game, and I unfortunately suspect that we'll see that all over the place in Fallout 3.
 
So basically, if I understand it right, everything good in Fallout 3 is thanks to Bethesdas genius, and everything bad is because of the ancient dark age games Fallout 1&2?

Wow... Just... Wow... Give the man a prize. He makes it sound as if Bethesdas greatest fault is respecting the previous games to much and, in his opinion, should have wiped their ass with the IP even more to produce an even "better" game.
 
He doesn't really discuss the old games at all. I don't think he's played 'em. It's more about comparing Fallout 3 to Oblivion and Mass Effect.
 
"Bad news first: when it comes to dialogue, Fallout 3 remains something of a stubborn throwback, unwilling to step away from traditional one-on-one interrogation mechanics and explore the new possibilities of a post-Mass Effect world. With no hint of radial selection or keyword attitude choices which seemed likely to become the RPG's version on Halo's rechargeable shield - a genre standard by virtue of near-unanimous theft - instead, a quick introductory conversation with the mayor of Megaton reveals that Fallout 3 is sticking with a system largely unchanged from the days of Monkey Island."

I don't know about you, but this is the second best piece of news I heard about Fallout 3 since the fact that you can actually complete it without much combat.
 
I usually like em, but Eurogamer seems so petty about Fallout 3 it's dropping my opinion of them. Ohh my god a load screen! How terrible! *gets in a Mass Effect elevator that masks the loading and lasts twice as long*
 
I'm really enjoying Mass Effect. It's the first time I may actually finish a Bioware game.

Having said that I already used the dialog system of ME on Blade Runner, in 1998, so it's not that innovative. It just added the radial menu, that helps with the XBox controller, that's it.
Proper dialog trees and multiple REAL choices with talking heads isn't retro, it's what should appear on any RPG that tries to go a bit beyond the rogue/diablo template.

Not enough "Next Gen" I suppose. Kids these days...

And yeah, this paragraph is the worst thing I've heard about Fallout 3 so far:
Dialogue is not the only sign that Fallout 3 is slightly old-fashioned. A trip to the local saloon in search of side quests reveals that the game's world can be slow to react to your presence, or often even acknowledge it. The saloon door is locked, meaning we have to tease it open with picks (instigating a simple but entertaining mini-game). This is all a little strange, as, once inside, we find that the place is actually open for business after all, and the saloon owner, who boasts a lovely silver mullet and a voice like Terry Wogan, doesn't seem to mind - or notice - that we've just forced our way in. More worrying is that, moments later, when we accidentally fire a round into the wall when trying to talk to the barman, nobody in the room so much as flinches.

Oh boy.
 
Brother None said:
Bad news first: when it comes to dialogue, Fallout 3 remains something of a stubborn throwback, unwilling to step away from traditional one-on-one interrogation mechanics and explore the new possibilities of a post-Mass Effect world. With no hint of radial selection or keyword attitude choices which seemed likely to become the RPG's version on Halo's rechargeable shield - a genre standard by virtue of near-unanimous theft - instead, a quick introductory conversation with the mayor of Megaton reveals that Fallout 3 is sticking with a system largely unchanged from the days of Monkey Island.
Monkey Island style? Sweet Jesus thats awesome, they did something right, and they consider this bad news? Anyone else think this is a bit backwards? I mean a dialogue system from the Monkey Island day's is like the holy grail of dialogue systems in my opinion.
 
Brother None said:
Another With no hint of radial selection or keyword attitude choices which seemed likely to become the RPG's version on Halo's rechargeable shield - a genre standard by virtue of near-unanimous theft - instead, a quick introductory conversation with the mayor of Megaton reveals that Fallout 3 is sticking with a system largely unchanged from the days of Monkey Island.

Dickhead, rechargeable shields are for pussies who can't stand Quake or Doom on Nightmare.
 
This talk of recharging shields reminds me of Doom 3 (Nightmare), where you don't have a recharging shield, but rather.. your life constantly goes down. At least they start you out with the soul weapon thingy.

And yeah, whoever wrote this review needs to stick with racing, tournament fighter, and other types of pointless games.
 
Whatever, I'm not so pessimistic this time but seriously, what the fuck? This article is all over the place. Too retro? I liked Mass effect, but really, the last thing I want is a Mass effect style dialogue system for fallout. You got to love the description of "improved' radiant a.i

I've been hating this game for far too long, I think I might actually have premature grey hair due to the idoicy of the gaming media and Todd Howard.

Like, I really want this game to be good. I really do

It would be amazing if we were all wrong, if all along todd howard was Tim cain in disguise, the curtain was lifted and ta-da, one big prank, black isle never died and hearve caen was just a creation by the PR of interplay to test the willpower of Fallout fans.
 
Mass Effect was fun, but I didn't enjoy the dialogue system. Often the choice on the "dial" sounded like the right direction, but the full sentence my character said was NOT what I was going for. I prefer full text choices.
 
Unillenium said:
bonustime said:
Brother None said:
The saloon door is locked, meaning we have to tease it open with picks (instigating a simple but entertaining mini-game). This is all a little strange, as, once inside, we find that the place is actually open for business after all, and the saloon owner, who boasts a lovely silver mullet and a voice like Terry Wogan, doesn't seem to mind - or notice - that we've just forced our way in. More worrying is that, moments later, when we accidentally fire a round into the wall when trying to talk to the barman, nobody in the room so much as flinches.
Is it weird that this has bugged me more than any other news about Fallout 3? :/

I don't even know how to respond to this. It makes me laugh to be honest, just how absurdly erroneous such a scenario is.

"WEeeelcome partner to the pick lock saloon! No weapon checking required just make sure you miss if you accidentally discharge!, don't worry about any reprocussions our patrons are blind and deaf!"

haha rofl! n1 man.

Maybe it's only open to members with key cards. but that wouldn't explain the other part. The ppl at the bar will, probably, only react to the sound of nuclear weapon, should have tried the catapult.
 
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