[Fallout 1] What traits/perks/etc are useless or unbalanced?

Sduibek

Creator of Fallout Fixt
Moderator
Modder
Thread title length is limited so of course append "in your opinion" to the question. :P

Anyway I'll do my best to "fix" any applicable ones via upcoming versions of my mod. Keep in mind some of them will require code edits to the exe, something I'm not able to do yet until I learn Assembly and brush up on my C++. But mostly the learning Assembly part.

^ However, some of them I believe I can work around that via some Global Variable and script-editing trickery, so post away!

Cheers 8-)
 
Per said:
Traits
Fast Metabolism: Both effects are utterly marginal, so it's simply an utterly marginal trait.
Bruiser: Two more stat points, but you need the AP. That's like losing four points of Agility, which is ridiculous for an HtH character.
Kamikaze: Trade away protection for Sequence which matters only during the first combat round? No thanks.
Bloody Mess: Could be fun to begin with, but doesn't do anything in game terms, and gets tiresome. You'll see those animations anyway and it will feel more like a reward (!) without this trait.
Night Person: This is very bad considering how many people will only talk to you during daytime. Could be used in a stupid game, but I wouldn't bother.
Skilled: With a decent IN you'll be swimming in skill points. A horrible trait, avoid like the plague (unless you have IN 1 or something, though it beats me why you would).
Chem Reliant: The average time you spend being addicted won't change, so what's the big deal? Chem use is marginal anyway and most players will probably just reload if they get addicted.
Chem Resistant: A convenience if you're playing a chem user, but even so it's little more than that (you don't have to reload as often).

a green star Skilled is bugged in the way that you don't get the extra 5 skill points per level you're supposed to get. If you want to simulate this effect you could give yourself 2-3 levels of the Educated perk using a character editor.

a red star Although Bloody Mess does have one beneficial function at the end of the game for good characters, that effect can be achieved by other means.

Perks I rather doubt the usefulness of:

Bonus HtH Damage (3): Should have been a lot more damage. Now you'll have to get all three levels to notice any difference. Note that this perk only adds to the maximum damage - that's only one point on average for each perk slot!
Bonus Ranged Damage (2): Not nearly enough of a bonus unless you're using a Minigun.
Explorer: Improves your chances of finding special encounters, which is good at low LK but seems a bit vague. Could have been OK at level 6.
Lifegiver (2): Once you reach level 12 your maximum number of Hit Points won't be so important any more, and there aren't too many levels to go anyway.
Pickpocket: Neat for thief characters, I suppose. But if you fail at stealing, won't you just quickload?
Silent Death: Guess which one of this and Slayer you should choose at level 18. Then after eventually reaching level 21, you'd want to put skill points in Sneak to make one of your attacks do double damage? I laugh hard!
Silent Running: If you must play a sneaking character I suppose this takes a lot of frustration out of playing, but doesn't it spoil the atmosphere? A convenience perk.
Smooth Talker (3): The closest thing to Gain Intelligence in this game, but I'd start with a good IN instead.
Strong Back (3): Carrying more stuff can't be wrong, but spending perks to do it is. Especially if you have an NPC.

a green star The Lifegiver perk gives you 4 extra HP for each new level in addition to the 4 HP you get just for taking the perk (the manual forgets to say this, but it's in the patch notes).

a green star It's possible to score more than one double-damage hit with Silent Death in the first round of combat, assuming you can position yourself behind two or more enemies without leaving Sneak mode (which is difficult if you have to pass directly in front of them).

Useless perks which should only be chosen if you have no other options (or really want to):

Animal Friend: Well, how useful is this.
Cult of Personality, Presence (3): The potential benefits of these perks are frighteningly small.
Earlier Sequence (3): Not worth it.
Educated (3), Master Thief, Medic, Mr. Fixit, Speaker: All these perks give you nothing but skill points. You don't need more skill points. You need perks. As for Educated, if you get it at level 6 and then level up ten times, you've gained 20 skill points. Over time. Some guide writers recommend it.
Empathy: It seems like a great idea in theory, but this game simply isn't about choosing the dialogue options that keep other people happy.
Faster Healing (3), Healer (3): Healing rate is never an issue.
Flower Child: Convenient for a chem character. But using chems sucks.
Fortune Finder, Master Trader: Money is not an issue. Fortune Finder is simply awful; Master Trader isn't actively bad, just strictly unnecessary.
Friendly Foe: Noooo. This is free in Fallout 2, as of course it should be.
Ghost: Like a skill point perk only you don't get the skill points!
Heave Ho!: Strictly for grenade chums, and exceptionally marginal even so.
Mental Block: There's no need for this at all.
Mutate!: Don't waste a perk changing traits in mid-game instead of choosing right to begin with. (Well, it would be OK to change Finesse into Fast Shot at level 21 after getting Sniper and having a high LK, but if you get to that point you're not playing a regular game anyway.)
Mysterious Stranger: Utterly useless.
Night Vision (3): Situational, and doesn't do much. Increase your weapon skill instead, or even pick Sharpshooter.
Pathfinder (2): Time is not an issue... er, well, maybe it is, but not this important!
Rad Resistance (3), Snakeater: Poison and radiation aren't common enough, or difficult enough to handle, to necessitate these small bonuses.
Ranger (3): Random encounters aren't that bothersome.
Scout: Pointless.
Scrounger: You don't need this.
Sharpshooter (2): Effectively just a minimal skill increase for ranged attacks. Raise your preferred weapon skill instead and use the perk for something special.
Survivalist (3): Look! If you take all three levels of this perk it will make it virtually impossible for you to get caught in a rock slide when travelling and get hit for 2 points of damage! It is a must!
Swift Learner (3): This helps you gain levels. What's the primary purpose of gaining levels? To get perks. So why use perks to gain more levels?

a green star The effective size of the discount granted by Master Trader varies between shops, roughly in a 15-30% range. This is probably because barter modifiers are applied cumulatively and not sequentially.

a green star If you have only one trait when you get the Mutate! perk, you must exchange that for the new one, i.e. you can't just fill the other slot and keep the old trait.

a red star In v1.0 you could reportedly use Mutate! to change Gifted into something else but still keep the stat points.

a green star The effect of Night Vision varies depending on the lighting conditions and your number of perk levels. Each modifier threshold you cross gives you +15% to hit with a ranged weapon, for a maximum of +30% in complete darkness with three levels of Night Vision. At other times, any specific level might not do anything at all. Frank Shannon notes that Night Vision adds some clarity for people with dark monitors.

a green star Sharpshooter is bugged and doesn't really do what the manual says; it's supposed to raise PE by 2 for sniping purposes, yet often improves your chance to hit less, and never more, than increasing PE by 1. Michal Burger figured out that this is because the perk thinks range modifiers are calculated based on PE when it's in fact PE*2, and so increases your chance to hit only half as much as it should. At least it gives you a bonus even if your PE is at 10 already.

a green star Swift Learner is even worse here than in Fallout 2, since you can't go beyond level 21. It may seem like a good investment when you first look at it, but since the xp requirement for each new level rises linearly, even if you get all three slots of Swift Learner you only ever stay at most one level ahead of someone who doesn't ruin their early game wasting invaluable perks, and for that you'll have to wait until level 17! So, that adds up eventually to a few HP and skill points, for three perks... Do not choose this perk ever, ever, ever, ever!

http://user.tninet.se/~jyg699a/fallout.html#char
 
Oh, the guides! I should have thought of those, being that they're in my sig :P

Thanks!
 
Those should not be accepted uncritically, though - I still get people mailing me about Awareness not being good because it doesn't have any mechanical benefit, or Skilled not being bad because A MILLION SKILL POINTS.
 
Per said:
Those should not be accepted uncritically, though - I still get people mailing me about Awareness not being good because it doesn't have any mechanical benefit, or Skilled not being bad because A MILLION SKILL POINTS.
Heh, yeah. People are fun like that.

Personally there was a number of years wherein ALL my characters created had the Skilled & Gifted combo. I totally didn't want to play without it. But these days I like variety or/and more Perks or/and other play styles so it's not the case any more.

I personally always pick Awareness, so I can see why someone would question your opinion on that. Because of the ambiguity of weapon looks (laster pistol for example) and variability in monster HP, I like to know what I'm up against. This usually applies most early game, and late game (Super Mutant roamers). EDIT: Ohhhh shit! I'm doing the same thing as the above paragraph! :shock: Looks like I'll be rolling my next few characters without Awareness...

But, eh. It's kind of hilarious that they take the time to send you an email when it's obvious it's an opinion versus not something stated as absolute mathematical superiority or whatever.

-------------------------------

Educated et al: Causing these Perks to also add [x] number of generic skill points would be ridiculously easy to script. Granted it breaks the RP feel a bit, but they would become more useful if for example educated gave its usual bonus and 30 SP right off the bat. and maybe something like 10 SP from each of the others in addition to the specific boost. Also I apologize if this is stated and I missed it, but does the game treat it as *actual* Skill Points, or does it add a straight percentage?

Empathy, Cult of Personality: these can be tweaked easily as well. The Copypasta into four hundred threads is a pain in the ass but doesn't really take that long, all things considered. As above it's just a math thing really -- adding X extra points in your favor with reaction/speech/whatever

Flower Child: Personally I'd drop the addiction length even further because using chems doesn't always suck ;) But these kind of things are debatable because people would probably bitch that it became broken or something. [Then again, that's what we have optional checkboxes in installers for :D]

Actually I think almost all of these can simply be boosted mathematically by either modifying existing script checks, or adding global variables, or adding new script checks.

I have a thread somewhere here about changing the Night Version perk and of course there was doubt/complaint that it was changed too much, but that can be changed as well.

This.. actually could be quite a bit of fun. I think I'll do the work on these at some point :)
 
Sduibek said:
But, eh. It's kind of hilarious that they take the time to send you an email when it's obvious it's an opinion versus not something stated as absolute mathematical superiority or whatever.

Well, probably many of them figure they have a point and would want me to add it to the guide, which I sometimes do.

Sduibek said:
I have a thread somewhere here about changing the Night Version perk and of course there was doubt/complaint that it was changed too much, but that can be changed as well.

So you know how Night Vision works technically? I have this list of things I would want to get sorted out in detail for the next Fo1 (and 2) guide update, and I haven't been able to keep track of all the engine exploration efforts.
 
From what I could tell, Night Vision will affect %ToHit for both the player and monsters.

The actual messing around with light values is described here http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=867063#867063

It was interesting that going from an extra 49 to an extra 50 made a big jump in brightness, so I think the internal code (exe) probably has specific numbers that when you cross it adds X to the actual visible light level. Because it was not linear, of a tiny bit more light for each point added. It kind of was a staircase effect if that makes sense.
 
Looks like the only things for dude I can modify via script are SPECIAL stats and Skills.

Sigh :(
 
wasnt there a dog in fo2 that made you have perk jinxed when this dog joined you from random encounter ? Maybe this dog script could somehow work for other perks ?
 
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