Fallout Online: Impossible to keep the wasteland feeling?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but in FO and FO2 pretty much everything outside the city was trying to kill you. So, if you make it easier to be a raider or slaver (easy access to better guns and such) we could all have the same experiences as in the originals - tons of well-armed bandits causing trouble and mercenary guys trying to fend them off or break their base. If you have a higher xp barrier, that would mean that to kill a 350 hp Deathclaw not restricted by turn-based combat it could easilly take around thirty-one 10 hp lvl 1 people. That would make travelling alone a chore and you couldn't just roam the wastes, trying to PK players. One deathclaw or caravan or whatever and you're dogmeat. :D
People who weren't The Chosen One rarely had that much HP in the first place.
 
How do you all think death should be handled? "Ganking" (alpha-strike killing players, or killing gimpy casual players way below your level) would be extremely annoying if it was permanent, but if death is without consequence it's equally bad. With the bloody mess that is death in fallout, it seems hard to go with some kind of "knocked out" solution? You're not going to wake up when your "spine is visible from the front".
 
dirtbag said:
No XP from killing.
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Well, that is an interesting thought. It seemed to work in Bloodlines and well, to that. No more mob grinding (unless quest would equal hunting 50 dogs or other unimaginative stuff).
 
dirtbag said:
There is a really easy way to keep those Wowtards away:

High XP-limits to gain new levels.
Not a lot of hostile creatures/people everywhere.
No XP from killing.
:clap:
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And congratulations no one would buy the game!

Hate yo burst your bubble but I am pretty sure they do want to make some bank if this goes through. That means appealing to the "WoWtards".
 
Dead Guy said:
How do you all think death should be handled? "Ganking" (alpha-strike killing players, or killing gimpy casual players way below your level) would be extremely annoying if it was permanent, but if death is without consequence it's equally bad. With the bloody mess that is death in fallout, it seems hard to go with some kind of "knocked out" solution? You're not going to wake up when your "spine is visible from the front".
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Clones, perhaps? Radiation, induced regrowth? All induced by perk?

Still, I must say that I like the idea of permanent death. Harsh but rewarding. Still, the vast majority of players probably wouldn't agree, so it's not really an option.
 
It would need limited XP (Most of NPCs in Fallout 1 was low level - they just had pumped up attributes) and perma-death to keep the wasteland feeling.
It's not normal if there are tons of heroic people and people who you kill return from the grave.
 
I don't know how you could have a succesful MMO with perma-death as a general rule. Too many people would get fed up and quit.
 
I think perma-death is a great concept. The more experienced players who haven't died would earn an advantage. Once dead, they restart back to level 1, but level 1 isn't so bad. Instead of being a helpless and pitiful state, the game would be geared to a massive amount of low level players. High level players would have an obvious advantage, but their small numbers keeps that rewarding and repayable. This game would be based more on actual survival than merely questing. "Safe zones" could be incorporated in towns for penalty-free death, allowing friends to battle eachother without fear.

There could be a 6 hour death timer with no level reset. This would stop players from reappearing in the same battles. Death would actually strike fear in people's hearts without forcing them to reset from scratch.
 
On Fallout 2238 there isn't perma death but you lose your equipment and are forced to respawn. People kill you for lulz based on that as well as suicide bomb others in "safe" towns.

While some of you may think a perma death is appealing we would have assholes griefing left and right.

(On the subject of 2238.. 1 minute respawn time, and losing all your stuff, and being spawned in several preset locations at random hampers that populations patience plenty already.)

I probably wouldn't play the game if it had any massive deleveling mechanic or major gear loss.
 
actually you guys should really look at the screen caps and the beta on interplay's website i have signed but no recall yet

I also can tell from what they talk about in their forums that the game is going to be much more in-depth as in transport specific things also from what i can tell the game is kinda of big
 
i seen many hopes in regard to the awaited title, with most i agree at heart but its my belief that most of them will end up shatter and brake upon hard cold reality.


i seen 2 main problems, first is the basic concept of FO, FO the lone wanderer vs highly social and structured environments
of MMORPG but this will just require some smart design approaches( for starters they will probably try to make the areas look larger and emptier)

the second and the greater problem is what i consider unrealistic expectations.
in my opinion, any hopes of FOOL ever being turn base, having pause button during combat, dont have no go zones just all open PVP zones or basically any of major deviationfrom the proven MMORPG formula, is just unrealistic and when i say proven i mean built on the "corpses" and failures of hundreds of predecessors in the last five years after the initial boom.

which brings me back to point one, enjoyment from a MMORPG is rated by (from top to bottom):
1. Achievement, wealth, rare items and tangible power.
2. Social, the ability to chat, make friends and affiliate with larger groups like guilds etc..
3. Plot and RP, immersing in to the world and becoming part of it and its story.
4. competing, PVP and the many more advances in this area.
5. griefing, annoying and manipulating other players.

so if we look for example at FOonline 2238 its good game, i love it exactly the way it is (just restated i am only lvl 7, yet) but its game for core gamers and has no expansion potential (which what happened in SWG back then) and why its will never be considered.


anyway after this "introduction", the point was that i wanna hear about your ideas(realistic ones) for the game, from mechanics to combat system etc...

for example how do you see the combat system will be very challenging, consider that this not the usual fantasy RPG with magic, so many of the usual professions and reduce the verity of gameplay...

or for example this faction gameplay, i seen in konan:
http://www.gametrailers.com/video/hyborian-insider-age-of-conan/33818
showing a combination of few concepts, we already have in FOonline crafting, gangs and eventually gang warfare...
 
I think Fallout Online will be good if they follow my guidelines:

1. Joinable Factions (NCR, BoS, Slavers, Khans, Bishops and so on)
2. Ability to socialise, talk to friends and make your own factions.
3. Big level to level xp barriers.

But to give it the wsteland feeling:

1. Towns should be few and far between, to make travelling to another town a painful but rewarding experience.
2. Sparse excellent equipment (like huge quests just to get gauss rifles or Advanced Power Armour Mk2.
3. Make map huge so it's hard to bump into others, and if you do, you could stick together if your going the same way and/or trade.

But I hope if you die, you should be able to keep 5 of your most valuable items, and the rest of your items go to a pawn shop where you can buy them back for increased price. (No one else can buy your items).
 
i think that first we nee to know if the game will be 2D/3D, first/third person - i think its will be similar to warhammer 40000

then we need to know if special/skills/perks will stay. (my guess its will be "dumbed down" and streamlined, so to not confuse the kids.

then we need to guesss what changes will be done to the classes, because the way it works everyone must be able to contribute to a group during a fight, for example repair will be changed to mechanic.


p.s. yes, unfortunately much like in FO3 case there will be less of the original FO left.
 
Mr Krepe said:
I think Fallout Online will be good if they follow my guidelines:

1. Joinable Factions (NCR, BoS, Slavers, Khans, Bishops and so on)
2. Ability to socialise, talk to friends and make your own factions.
3. Big level to level xp barriers.

But to give it the wsteland feeling:

1. Towns should be few and far between, to make travelling to another town a painful but rewarding experience.
2. Sparse excellent equipment (like huge quests just to get gauss rifles or Advanced Power Armour Mk2.
3. Make map huge so it's hard to bump into others, and if you do, you could stick together if your going the same way and/or trade.

But I hope if you die, you should be able to keep 5 of your most valuable items, and the rest of your items go to a pawn shop where you can buy them back for increased price. (No one else can buy your items).
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actually thats something they asked on the forums and so far the average has been 50 in game miles is the farthest they want to go but in close behind infinit was the max waiting time so im guessing the map will rival wow's map also on im pretty sure the time in getting to a certain town ect will definitly be rewarding but also take a while since every fallout game including fallout 3 had a map where it took you a while to get to a certain place.
 
its something that their designers will have to work on.

personally i am more interested on how will they implement random encounters?
how will skills/social (if they will be implemented) will influence the map?

how will they implement fast travel ?

will the map have high grounds/cover/buildings?
 
mor said:
its something that their designers will have to work on.

personally i am more interested on how will they implement random encounters?
how will skills/social (if they will be implemented) will influence the map?

how will they implement fast travel ?

will the map have high grounds/cover/buildings?
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they will have it in 3d 2nd person
and as for fast travel there won't be any what so ever they said in their forums that they will likely have transportation because of the long distances between cities
 
Unfitg0d0fwar said:
they will have it in 3d 2nd person
and as for fast travel there won't be any what so ever they said in their forums that they will likely have transportation because of the long distances between cities
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yep i found the Earthrise video, a game that uses the same engine FOOL will use, which gives a pretty good idea how will it look like:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F185pPMRk20

as for the fast travel, obviously its will not be an instant beam me up travel, the question is how will they implement it...
for example in WOW there is the ships and flying creatures you just hop on and they get you SAFELY to your destination, which sometimes can take up to 10mins...

so a. how will they implement it? not cars i guess unless they build a spur highway, i also assume that no random encounters, which will be represented by random spawn on the map.
so what caravans? how are they protected? unless they are planing to force the player to sit do nothing and watch at the screen for 10+ minutes! (even more, the games suppose to be larger than WOW!)



also for all those who are still dreaming about pause/turn base just look at the engine video and you'll see a mechanical reason as well, for why not.
its open world, not FO1/2 independent local areas you can pause... meaning if you get into a fight everything around will keep going and ppl will be able to join and help but you wont be able stop few thousand ppl and thing about it :roll:

which also supports my previous guess, that they will stretch the fights lower damage and rasing HP for example, because no one (for feature reference when i generalize i refer to the majority of the players) runing around for 20 min to get to a fight and die in 5 secs. so yes a shotgun to the face will be just as fatal as its in FO3.

---

so as you all see its not about what we want, its about what we can get as part of the engine limitation...
 
mor said:
Unfitg0d0fwar said:
they will have it in 3d 2nd person
and as for fast travel there won't be any what so ever they said in their forums that they will likely have transportation because of the long distances between cities
Click to expand...

yep i found the Earthrise video, a game that uses the same engine FOOL will use, which gives a pretty good idea how will it look like:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F185pPMRk20

as for the fast travel, obviously its will not be an instant beam me up travel, the question is how will they implement it...
for example in WOW there is the ships and flying creatures you just hop on and they get you SAFELY to your destination, which sometimes can take up to 10mins...

so a. how will they implement it? not cars i guess unless they build a spur highway, i also assume that no random encounters, which will be represented by random spawn on the map.
so what caravans? how are they protected? unless they are planing to force the player to sit do nothing and watch at the screen for 10+ minutes! (even more, the games suppose to be larger than WOW!)



also for all those who are still dreaming about pause/turn base just look at the engine video and you'll see a mechanical reason as well, for why not.
its open world, not FO1/2 independent local areas you can pause... meaning if you get into a fight everything around will keep going and {It's "people". You can write legibly. Don't bother crying about it.} will be able to join and help but you wont be able stop few thousand {It's "people". You can write legibly. Don't bother crying about it.} and thing about it :roll:

which also supports my previous guess, that they will stretch the fights lower damage and rasing HP for example, because no one (for feature reference when i generalize i refer to the majority of the players) runing around for 20 min to get to a fight and die in 5 secs. so yes a shotgun to the face will be just as fatal as its in FO3.

---

so as you all see its not about what we want, its about what we can get as part of the engine limitation...
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im guessing random encounters will be dealt with like in fo3 where certain animals are in certain areas stuff like that in general
also fast travel like I said will be dealt with by different transportation my guess there is cars vehicles bycyles and walking thats all i can think of but by some of the concept art some vehicles will be easier to fuel as in cars that use energy cells as fuel like fo2 but not just e cells either im guessing bigger/better the vehicle more fuel and differnt kinds of fuel the car will need
 
its probably my fault mixing the definitions, i just call everything mechanic for getting from point a to point b without my intervention 'fast travel'.

here is an example from wow, so in this sense, running and cycling is just waste of 10min of your time pressing 'W'.
its might be cars as you suggest although i hope its not, if designed right i can still attain the FO wasteland feelling but moving cars everywhere i go :shock: the only thing that can "top" that if they will also blow up in a nuclear mushrooms :roll:

personally i hope to see the good old guarded barhamin caravans.
 
mor said:
its probably my fault mixing the definitions, i just call everything mechanic for getting from point a to point b without my intervention 'fast travel'.

here is an example from wow, so in this sense, running and cycling is just waste of 10min of your time pressing 'W'.
its might be cars as you suggest although i hope its not, if designed right i can still attain the FO wasteland feelling but moving cars everywhere i go :shock: the only thing that can "top" that if they will also blow up in a nuclear mushrooms :roll:

personally i hope to see the good old guarded barhamin caravans.
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caravans horses it another im thinking of also i mean cars as in public transportation and in order to get a car it will be rare , the central theme they are thinking of is rebirth and regrowth. train and other type of transportation would be my guess also power ect won't be hard to find either because of alternative energies.
as for the feeling desertedness should be kinda of easy with many instances of the same area so for example a max of 20 people or so on 1 instance of a desert area so it feels like there is less people then there are and cities will be crowded which most of the cities were.
 
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