Mars Exploration

So now that we have managed to fuck- up Earth pretty badly we'll just jump to Mars so we can fuck that up too? That would be so human! And yes, we have much greater concerns right here, in our own yard, enough to keep us from concentrating on how to get our hands on the neighboring yard too!
 
Well, the grass is always greener.....or in this case redder.

The thing about Mars is right now, are we sure we can land a "homonid" (thanks 4too) or ape-like creature in our lifetimes? Is it even for us to decide the fate of a planet? Look at this planet. It's fucked up in many ways, but decent in others.

We have to account for more than just environmental damage inflicted by us. Human suffering and misery form part of the equation as well.

Problems at home > Future problems about an esoteric argument that may not come to fruition in our lifetimes.

This inequality is true every single day until it is 100% feasible to land a person on Mars. As for robots, maybe we will have technology able to "terraform" it without the presence of the human grip of death. Maybe humans will be the better technology to settle the planet. As of now, most of it is speculation.

Speculation, speculation, speculation. As are the arguments concerning such. Rawr.

-Mars or Bust.

bad motto.

-Let's figure our shit out before going into the abyss.

While not quite eloquent or original, this motto beats the "manifest destiny/imperialistic/running from our problems" motto of claiming a second planet as another undeserved possession of humanity.

Props to you if you've read this far, or you've cheated by skipping to the bottom.
 
I agree with daemon spawn, that seems so imperialist and arrogant!

And yes, there are many other things to be busy about right here on earth. We should clean our backyeard before even think of setting up collonies and such in Mars.

On the other hand... Ever heard of "Terraformation"? Its a serious thesis and it would take a real long while to be accomplished so the earlier we start, the better. And meanwhile, as that goes, we can clean up the mess here on earth making this here planet a better place to live, too.
 
Zoe said:
I agree with daemon spawn, that seems so imperialist and arrogant!
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Think of the Martian children! Won't somebody please think of the Martian children!

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Article 2 of UN General Assembly Resolution 2222 states the following:

"Outer space, including the Moon and other celestial bodies, is not subject to national appropriation by claim of sovereignty, by means of use or occupation, or by any other means."

The treaty was ratified by the US back in 1967. So, the idea of anyone owning land on Mars is just a novelty.
 
Executioner said:
Article 2 of UN General Assembly Resolution 2222 states the following:

"Outer space, including the Moon and other celestial bodies, is not subject to national appropriation by claim of sovereignty, by means of use or occupation, or by any other means."

The treaty was ratified by the US back in 1967. So, the idea of anyone owning land on Mars is just a novelty.
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Good one Executioner. I will have to check on this now.

But generally speaking General Assembly Resolutions are not international law. If they were, than the Israelis would be in some pretty deep shit by now. GA assembly resolutions are more like declarations of policy. But I will look into this issue a bit more.
 
UN Charters usually aren't worth much more than a used condom.

Considering the cost of even making use of an "owned Mars" in any respect is beyond the cost of any nation on earth, the question is ridiculous. The bottom line is don't listen to anyone who uses Ayn Rand as references for an article.

Next topic?
 
Jebus said:
My god, that writer is the biggest piece of egoistical capitalistic shit I've ever seen...


Somebody like that would probably be lynched in Europe. How the fuck could sending a man to Mars EVER be more imporant then giving people a house and medical care?
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Umm... because humanity is a plague? I'm doing a paper on this topic in school right now. Actually, it IS more important, because when we destroy this planet, and it is going to happen no matter what we do since the most basic aspect of human nature is destruction, we need someplace else to go... it pretty much comes to this... death of a couple thousand people or... the extinction of a couple thousand species... also, the US could afford it to have Mars missions and take care of welfare if it would stop wasting money on useless program in other countries which just make problems worse... like the so called AIDS vaccines in Africa... spend a lot of money to supdue the affects of AIDS in people who will not be educated to the fact the they will not be cured by the vaccine and will just spread the desease more...

and capitalism is the best form of economy we can have until we develope better matter replication technology.
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CeleSTiaLFuRY said:
the US could afford it to have Mars missions and take care of welfare if it would stop wasting money on useless program in other countries.
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US spendings on mars missions are a *bit* higher compared to the spendings on 'help-programs'.
How about stop bombing places, using ridiculous amounts of money on wars and such in stead.
 
Gustav_Drangeid said:
CeleSTiaLFuRY said:
the US could afford it to have Mars missions and take care of welfare if it would stop wasting money on useless program in other countries.
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US spendings on mars missions are a *bit* higher compared to the spendings on 'help-programs'.
How about stop bombing places, using ridiculous amounts of money on wars and such in stead.
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Bombing people at least accomplishes something... these so called "help programs" only mess up these other counties more and waste up money... and we spend about the same amount of mony on them as the wars and mars missions combined...
 
CeleSTiaLFuRY said:
Actually, it IS more important, because when we destroy this planet, and it is going to happen no matter what we do since the most basic aspect of human nature is destruction, we need someplace else to go...
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Well here's a concept for you to ponder about: what if we DON'T kill eachother? What if just DON'T destroy this planet? I know, it's a mindboggling idea, but hey... I was kinda doped up when I thought this one up, I guess.

it pretty much comes to this... death of a couple thousand people or... the extinction of a couple thousand species...
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Hey, if the most basic aspect of human nature is destruction, then that just wouldn't matter, would it?

also, the US could afford it to have Mars missions and take care of welfare if it would stop wasting money on useless program in other countries which just make problems worse... like the so called AIDS vaccines in Africa... spend a lot of money to supdue the affects of AIDS in people who will not be educated to the fact the they will not be cured by the vaccine and will just spread the desease more...
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Oh my god. I take my words back: YOU have to be the most stupid piece of capitalistic shit I've ever seen.

1. AIDS vaccines? Since when FFS?
2. The money spent on the AIDS programme in Africa IS spent on educating people on how to stop spreading the disease. Fool.

and capitalism is the best form of economy we can have until we develope better matter replication technology.
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It is. But there are diffent ways of capitalism. You've got the every-man-for-himself capitalism you have in the USA, and you've got the solidarity-capitalism like you have in Europe. And, according to moi, the European version is the best form of economy we can have.

Umm... because humanity is a plague?
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Not as bad a plague as people who don't know what the fuck they are talking about.

I'm doing a paper on this topic in school right now.
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You're going to fail.
 
Bombing people at least accomplishes something...
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WHAT? FOR FUCK'S SAKE, WHAT?

these so called "help programs" only mess up these other counties more and waste up money...
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Please, good sir, elaborate.

and we spend about the same amount of mony on them as the wars and mars missions combined...
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No shit you do. Now I don't know the figures by heart, and frankly I'm too fucking lazy to go and search them for somebody like you, but I've got that gut feeling America doesn't spend trillions of dollars on welfare.
 
Oh my good we got a live one right here! Gustav_Drangeid, Jebus it is target practice time! We should call Rosh and Welsh, they are going to love this guy!
And Celeriac fury, or whatever you call yourself, if you are going to make statements like the ones you just made you'd better have some solid arguments to support them or a VERY efficient set of prayers, because no quarter will be given or asked for. In other words, YOU WILL FRY!
Elissar! PLEASE Get your crowbar and take care of this fool!
 
Hey, if the most basic aspect of human nature is destruction, then that just wouldn't matter, would it?
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We would exist longer... and I know there is no cure for AIDS... What I was talking about was Bush passed some ordinance to send a shit load of medicine, which is always refered to in the news as "AIDS vaccines" to Africa, yet all it does is subside the symtoms of AIDS...
 
c0ldst33ltrs4u said:
rant
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Hey, how about you post some constructive criticism instead of talking shit and asking others to do the intelligent flaming for you?

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Damn n00bs...
 
CeleSTiaLFuRY said:
We would exist longer...
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Yeah well, we would also exist longer if we wouldn't bomb eachother or try to stop deadly epidemics.

Oh no wait! I'm such a fool! Let's all go to Mars instead, and let this miserable excuse for a planet rot away!


and I know there is no cure for AIDS... What I was talking about was Bush passed some ordinance to send a shit load of medicine, which is always refered to in the news as "AIDS vaccines" to Africa, yet all it does is subside the symtoms of AIDS...
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1. If the news really refers to them as 'AIDS' vaccines, then you must be watching the 'Hillbilly news network'.

2. The most logical conclusion I could distill from your post, is that he sent medecine to Africa that prolong the state of HIV-positiveness, and thus prolong the time a HIV-patient can live without getting AIDS. I'm actually amazed Bush did that in the first place, and if he did, it would be the first damn humane thing he would've done in his entire legislation, and frankly it cracks me up you're bashing it. Goes to show, some people are even more selfish, stuck up and stupid than Bush himself... Go figure...


Here kid, I have a little something for you:

cluepon.jpg


Be sure to trade it in as soon as possible.
 
CeleSTiaLFuRY said:
And we spend about the same amount of mony on them as the wars and mars missions combined...
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I doubt that. And even if you did, preventing AIDS and famine are far more important than killing people and sending stuff to Mars.
As for the 'ineffective' help-programs, not all of them are ineffective. Some of them are, but if US were to assume all help-programs ineffective, they naturally wouldn't spend money on it. Meaning that most help programs actually helps.
 
CeleSTiaLFuRY said:
Hey, if the most basic aspect of human nature is destruction, then that just wouldn't matter, would it?
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We would exist longer... and I know there is no cure for AIDS... What I was talking about was Bush passed some ordinance to send a shit load of medicine, which is always refered to in the news as "AIDS vaccines" to Africa, yet all it does is subside the symtoms of AIDS...
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They are never referred to as vaccines. They are always referred to as medicines or cocktails, which is what they are. You may be remembering things written about how AIDS vaccines have been tried and failed. Or the ill-advised vaccine trial in Africa that did more harm than good.

And for the record, CF, I have no problem with your opinions. This does not mean I agree with you, far from it, but you are entitled to it. All I ask is that you take a more open-minded position during debates than some people here. Til next time.
 
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