Planescape: Torment

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Dracon M'Alkir

Vault Senior Citizen
So, being that Planescape: Torment was the last Black Isle game, and noting how much all of you on the forums loved the game (now I can see the Modron avatar, where it was just a meaningless face before);

I'm glad to say that I just finished my first playthrough, that is - the first time I ever played Planescape: Torment, from start to finish, without the use of any walkthroughs or outside assistance.

I ended as a Level 22, Neutral Good Mage, belonging to the Godsmen, with the following stats:

Wisdom: 25, Intelligence: 25, Charisma: 24, Strength: 12, Constitution: 8, Dexterity: 8.

And here are my thoughts on the game:

You're wondering if the forum code messed up, or if my text got deleted, but no. Those are my thoughts on the game. It's beyond English words and definition. I am quite literally speechless as to describe it.

Thank you to all the people who recommended this game to me, especially Kharn and Mika.
 
Hehe, glad to see you enjoyed it aswell. ;) Let the impressions sack a bit and try to think about it in a few days, when you stomached the story etc.

Also, how the hell did you reach level 22? I always end up with something like 18 or 19, even with doing all the possible quests..
 
FFS can they not make more games like PS:T?

If I remember correctly, PS:T was the only game where I faced genuine moral dilemmas. Everywhere else, you know what to do (save the world), where to go (dungeons), who needs help (the chick) and who needs righteous killing (the goblins).
 
Funny, you had the exact same class, alignment, stats and level as me in my first playthrough :P

And I (as well as most people here, I imagine) strongly agree. Fallout is great and all, but PS:T takes the cake for best WRPG in the history of ever. It was not perfect, but I nearly just forgot the flaws to immersive myself in it's awesome story.
 
because thats what they did. THe last plane was meant to be a lot biger. But they have been runing out of time I think.
 
Yea, I had to boost my hp to 1000 to get through the gauntlet, I don't feel bad at all being that it was a plot driven game.

I think I didn't pay much attention to or ignored a lot of the relevant moral decisions initially so I'm going to have to replay it and pay more attention. I didn't really dive fully into the plot until the later parts of the game so I'm curious to see how differently it could go and am pretty regretful for doing that.

I found myself ending as chaotic evil and not really noticing it. Does the plot unfold a lot differently based on my actions?
 
Also, how the hell did you reach level 22? I always end up with something like 18 or 19, even with doing all the possible quests..
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are you kidding? the last area is the best one to gain levels. ;) i raised myself (warrior) a lot there.
 
The last area with the


[spoiler:585a976820]Shadows in the Fortress of Regret
[/spoiler:585a976820]

?

I don't really see a point in grinding/powerleveling in Torment anyway. ;) If enemies are too tough you can simply "respawn" and hurt the baddie again and again. Used this "tactic" 1-2 times when in other games I would've long before used the quickload button.

I still don't really get the point of people complaining that the "gameplay" in Torment is boring. What the hell? Reading is part of the gameplay. The fights are faster paced aswell (I am for example not a fan of Baldurs Gate/Icewind Dale etc combat). Plenty of skillchecks to encourage other classes are in aswell...
 
sea said:
Surf Solar said:
I still don't really get the point of people complaining that the "gameplay" in Torment is boring. What the hell? Reading is part of the gameplay. The fights are faster paced aswell (I am for example not a fan of Baldurs Gate/Icewind Dale etc combat). Plenty of skillchecks to encourage other classes are in aswell...
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It's nowhere near as tactical as Baldur's Gate. No real spell defenses to breach, protection spells to cast, etc. That doesn't make it worse but I can see why someone used to Baldur's Gate would find it a lot less demanding and potentially even boring. In Baldur's Gate II I've set things up so that the game pauses every round, ensuring I have total control of my party, but I didn't need such help to get through Planescape... just letting everyone perform their default scripts while spamming a few spells seems to be more than enough.
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I find this to be untrue, playing the Mage, I often used very many defensive spells, (Submerge the Will, Shield), buffing spells (Focus of Zerthimon - Almost 100% Crit Chance for 30 sec, Temperment of Zerthimon - full damage reflection); and your enemies - not to spoil who they are, often employed the use of the Level 7 "upgraded shield" which made them nearly invulnerable - Mirage Shield, was it?

I found combat in Planescape: Torment, highly enjoyable and unconventional.

Surf Solar said:
Hehe, glad to see you enjoyed it aswell. ;) Let the impressions sack a bit and try to think about it in a few days, when you stomached the story etc.

Also, how the hell did you reach level 22? I always end up with something like 18 or 19, even with doing all the possible quests..
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^ I actually hit Level ~32, I was a Level 10 fighter, before I switched to a Mage, mid-game. In a simplicity: Did you keep the golden orb from Pharod?

SkuLL said:
FFS can they not make more games like PS:T?

If I remember correctly, PS:T was the only game where I faced genuine moral dilemmas. Everywhere else, you know what to do (save the world), where to go (dungeons), who needs help (the chick) and who needs righteous killing (the goblins).
Click to expand...

^ [spoiler:632a2c1961]
Trias: But you gave me your word! You vowed!
"No, I did not. I simply stated that I wouldn't kill you. I did not vow. Now I've changed my mind."
Trias: Know that with my death, my creature is loosed, his contract broken, curse you beyond the planes, to the deepest pits of Baator, may -"
"Shut up and die." *CRACK*[/spoiler:632a2c1961]

Also, to reply to the entire thread above:

[spoiler:632a2c1961]*Lowered tone*: "What can change the nature of a man?"
Echo: "Regret, Ravel. Such regret, that an entire fortress may be built upon it."

As you scribble on your skin, pricking your finger again and again, you list your regret: "I regret, all the deaths that I have caused, here, and across the multi-verse. [/spoiler:632a2c1961]
 
In a simplicity: Did you keep the golden orb from Pharod?
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Bronze sphere*, you mean. No reason to not give it to him, you can pick it up later from his body after he dies.

I think the level differences come primarily from whether you bothered with the Modron Maze or not. Fighting in the game gets pretty tedious towards the end if you approach the game as a non-combat-centric one (which imo it is).
 
Dracon M'Alkir said:
I find this to be untrue, playing the Mage, I often used very many defensive spells, (Submerge the Will, Shield), buffing spells (Focus of Zerthimon - Almost 100% Crit Chance for 30 sec, Temperment of Zerthimon - full damage reflection); and your enemies - not to spoil who they are, often employed the use of the Level 7 "upgraded shield" which made them nearly invulnerable - Mirage Shield, was it?
Click to expand...
I've played a mage as well. And I cant say that it was as fun like in BG2.

I think the combat in PT was quite boring. But that mainly because of the map/level design. On the other side it always was a bit confusing. Particularly when you had to navigate trough the world. BUt that might be just me. I had to get a bit used to it.

The game isnt really bad. I just think they should have spend a bit more time on the gameplay as well.

It is quite clear that Planescape was simply not made as "grind" or "level up" game. It contains not enough combat for that. The real motivation to go trough the game is the story. And it shows. I think it is or was one of those games where you can not seperate story and gameplay. The best example is the wall/hall with traps and your story written over it. I mean how to get trough the traps if you cant defuse them ? Fuck it! Youre immortal.
 
I find this to be untrue, playing the Mage, I often used very many defensive spells, (Submerge the Will, Shield), buffing spells (Focus of Zerthimon - Almost 100% Crit Chance for 30 sec, Temperment of Zerthimon - full damage reflection); and your enemies - not to spoil who they are, often employed the use of the Level 7 "upgraded shield" which made them nearly invulnerable - Mirage Shield, was it?
Click to expand...

True, I used these quite often. The only thing which disappointed me is that the "cleric" in game is quite weak (spellwise), rest of the spells was really good and fresh to see.

^ I actually hit Level ~32, I was a Level 10 fighter, before I switched to a Mage, mid-game. In a simplicity: Did you keep the golden orb from Pharod?
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:shock:
Just checked my last savegame, I hit level 23 right before the last "encounter". And I even "grinded" (as in revisiting 2-3 times) Baator and did the Modron Maze. How did you manage to gain so many levels? And no, I gave Pharod the sphere, but you get it back later. ;) For some reason though, the sphere was bugged right at the end when I could actually use it

[spoiler:c834746343]after you merged with your past incarnations[/spoiler:c834746343]

so I didn't get the xp there and neither the story elements.

Ausdoerrt said:
Fighting in the game gets pretty tedious towards the end if you approach the game as a non-combat-centric one (which imo it is).
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Hm, I found the combats towards the end actually quite enjoyable for a change. Only thing I really hated where the enemies which approached you in the last "dungeons" main hall.

Crni Vuk said:
And I cant say that it was as fun like in BG2.
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Hm, I hated the BGIIs combat for its clumsiness.

Crni Vuk said:
I think the combat in PT was quite boring. But that mainly because of the map/level design.
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I found it exciting. What was so bad at the map/level design?

Crni Vuk said:
The game isnt really bad. I just think they should have spend a bit more time on the gameplay as well.
Click to expand...

Again, reading is part of the gameplay here.
 
Crni Vuk said:
It is quite clear that Planescape was simply not made as "grind" or "level up" game. It contains not enough combat for that. The real motivation to go trough the game is the story. And it shows.
Click to expand...

What's delightful in this game is that it's one of few where killing a monster give you like 200 XP but solving a quest where you had to do nothing but talk gives you 5000 XP.
 
Surf Solar said:
^ I actually hit Level ~32, I was a Level 10 fighter, before I switched to a Mage, mid-game. In a simplicity: Did you keep the golden orb from Pharod?
Click to expand...
:shock:
Just checked my last savegame, I hit level 23 right before the last "encounter". And I even "grinded" (as in revisiting 2-3 times) Baator and did the Modron Maze. How did you manage to gain so many levels? And no, I gave Pharod the sphere, but you get it back later. ;) For some reason though, the sphere was bugged right at the end when I could actually use it

so I didn't get the xp there and neither the story elements.
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Ah. You see, I was running the game, completely patched, with all of the cut in-dev content restored. You gain 2,000,000 XP from the Bronze Sphere.

When I said "keep the bronze sphere", some players may not have returned to Pharod's Keep after his death to collect the sphere. I almost got rid of the sphere myself mid-game, because I thought it was useless and taking up inventory space.

[spoiler:ef813b93da]The bronze sphere is actually a dead sensory stone, belonging to your first incarnation. In it, dwell all of your original memories, of your pre-life, before Sigil, your death, and your true name as well. It opens up a unique dialogue option with your soul, The Transcendent One, whereupon, you can threaten him with your true name.[/spoiler:ef813b93da]
 
Torment is one of the best games ever created. It was nice to play a game in which text and dialogue were so interesting and important.

I've spent a good amount of time in that game and I really don't regret at all. It even helped me a lot because I was learning English when I first played it. Playing Torment meant an intensive contact with this language so I learnt a lot, and fast.

Mage was my favorite class and I used spells of all kinds during battle, but mostly damage-oriented ones. I enjoyed combat in Torment, and that "click&pop-up" combat interface was confortable in my opinion.

I always powerlevelled on Black Abishai in the Hive, as they are not protected by the Lady of Pain. They are tough and strong, but you can troll them with Litany of Curses, then make Morte float in circles while the rest of the party attacks the monster (enchanted weapons only). You might need to insult the Abishai more than once before killing it. I usually did this until level 12 (second specialization) and I don't remember what was the higher level I ever reached.
 
Surf Solar said:
I found it exciting. What was so bad at the map/level design?
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how to explain it when you found it exiting ? I dont want to call you "biased" ... but you definetly seem very confindent about the quality of the game ;)

on the other side. It has been a quite long time I played the game so naturaly I forgot a lot. I just remember that while I had a lot of fun with the game from the story. The "fighting" was someting I didnt really liked THAT much. Maybe because the designers of PT tried to get away from the typical fantasy/RPG cliche. YOu have no armor in the game. No swords. Rats are some of the hardest enemies (while in every other RPG they are pretty much the weakest foes ... except for Drakensang!) and undead characters are often more friendly then living ones take Mary for Pharot as example.
 
Surf Solar said:
Thank you for this outstanding addition to the thread. :roll:
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Oh, stop whining.
PS:T is one of my favourite games if not my absolute favourite and even I can see that's funny.
Someone should make a "updated my journal" song.


Might be the hangover talking though.
 
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