Recreating Fallout 3

[Lexx]

A helpful hint: Think really about what you want to do. As example, a "human baby" is really not needed. In a Fallout 1 / 2 styled Fallout 3, the intro can either be done via a normal cutscene / video or ingame text, with the later one being the better way to go, if you can't create any kind of videos. Well, except maybe creating a video that only shows text and tells it (with ambient sounds mixed into it).

Also you do not need flying Vertibirds. In a Fallout 1 / 2 styled Fallout 3, it would be enough to encounter the enclave soldiers in special encounters, where the Vertibird is landed and the enclave soldiers are spawned around it.

These two points already spare you a lot of additional and - in my opinion - unnecessary work.

 

[Mr. 1010101]

Good points. See, the flying vertibird idea would of been part a boss fight I was thinking of. For example, if I were to keep the so-called "boss fight" of Col. Autumn, it would make more of a challenge if he was piloting some advance vertibird or something.

 

[Lexx]

This I can tell you, is hardly possible with the Fallout 2 engine.

You have to think much more simple. See Fallout 1 and 2, everything that you see in these games is what you can do as well, with a tad variation on top of that. But stuff like real driving vehicles, flying vertibirds or even flying vertibirds that can shoot at you, etc. is far out of realism.

 

[lisac2k]

While Lexx has been very practical about your ideas, I would go even further and nitpick them till they melt down.

However, I'll try to make it simpler by generalising the issue - you want to add content. Now, there's nothing wrong in that per se, it's just a matter of doing quite a hard work you're not experienced with and you'll step out of it sooner than you think. Adding content, especially new critters and graphics (excluding items, that are relatively easy to add) is a hard nut to crack even for the most experienced modders. Personally, I would never (and I hope most of the Fallout 2 modders will support me here) start a Fallout mod adding a new critter. It is very complicated and chances for burn-out are more than high. What I would do is this:

First, write something down for a while. What would you like to accomplish with your mod? What is the general idea about the mod? Write a page or two in a text document, as guidelines. Throw out everything that isn't necessary in the beginning (Kids in vault suits? Just stick with the normal kids as placeholder. New weapon? Edit a copy of an old one, you will make graphics for that later. Flying vertibird? Too complicated, adjust the encounter/scene in a certain way that the vertibird is already there - like Lexx said, etc.)
Example:
You want to make Vault 101 with its residents. You want them to work similar they have been working in Fallout 3: Overseer is the head poncho, you are the young rebel, his daughter has wet dreams about you and her father (okay, I may make a joke once in a while, right?) and so on...

Second, think about the tools you may need to reach your goal. Get them and play with them for a while, try to get familiar with the stuff.
Example:
You will need official Mapper to make a map (or a few of them) of the Vault 101. You will need FSE (Fallout Scripting Editor) from Jargo or Timeslip's Script Editor (comes with Sfall Modder's Pack) to write and compile the scripts. You may need an image editing software to edit the main menu and some other graphics, so that your mod gets the personality needed (GIMP, Photoshop, FRMAnim for conversion to FRM format etc.) You may need a utility like FUCK to edit critter protos, or you can edit them in the Mapper. Some stuff can be edited in Notepad.

Third, start working on something and see how far does it go.
Example:
You made a new cool map and put critters (residents) on it? Excellent, go further.
All V101 residents have descriptions and a few floaters (floating texts above head)? Cool, your Vault looks alive!
Go to scripts and make a script for Overseer (or modify some existing script, like Klint from Arroyo Temple). It works!
etc.

This way, you'll move steadily towards your goal - Fallout 3 Vault 101 in Fallout 2 engine. Later, when the stuff is almost finished and needs polishing, you will have enough experience to dive into creation of new critters (for which there are several ways to go, all of them quite a challenge for all of us). You may add missing items, their descriptions, test the stuff intensively or ask people around here to do it for you...

Once you've got your first "location mod" finished and released, you may as well keep working in the same fashion and release something bigger. This community was always keen to help creative people, there should always be someone to help you along the way (at least with an advice).

 

[Mr. 1010101]

With the except of creating vault 101 residents' critters (with I could probably do by taking the vault 13 critters and changes their appearances, which should be relatively easy), I don't think I would have to create anything new for the time being. Maybe I'm not thinking enough out of the box here. *sigh* Okay, lets think...

...

Alright, how about this:
The character creation process stays identical to that of FO1 & 2. Once your done, you start off the game by waking up to a normal day in the vault and start going by your business. What that business is may depend on what skills you tagged or what traits you choose. For example, if you tagged first aid or doctor, your character would have a job working at the medical bay with your dad (obviously). So you do your daily shift, hang out with your friends, have a little "talk" with the overseer's daughter if your character is male - or if your character is female. Bisexuality isn't exactly a new subject in Fallout. Basically, just another day in the vault. You go back to bed, get some sleep, ... and then you wake up the next day to the sound of alarms going off through the hallways. Turns out that your dad has left the vault aaand I'm sure you can figure out the rest. And this would only take about, um, twenty minute, maybe thirty at the most.

Actually, that would take alot of time to make. I'm going to have to think about this more.

 

[lisac2k]

Sounds like a good start to me. I like the idea to keep just one small quest for a start (help your father in the medical bay), you can add more quests/jobs later. It's not hard to check which skill was tagged by player (in scripts), so the whole idea seems reasonable.

Hero male (not sure about female) vaultsuit sprites with no numbers on their back can already be found in FOnline, or maybe you could find them in the new animations thread.

You may need a few weeks to make such a small "location mod" right now, but in a few weeks you will probably need several days to do the same. And in a year, if you've been hard-working, you'll make all of that in two days. Of course, you will need a quantum of talent and a lot of stubbornness to reach that point... But it's not impossible.

 

[Mr. 1010101]

I'll start making the logic charts for it right now. This is definitely going to take a while. I'm going to have to decide what jobs would correspond to what skills and what jobs would take priority. For example: if I tagged Repair, First Aid, and Barter, what job would my character have? Engineer? Doctor? Store keeper?

What I could do is this: During the morning, I am asked to do something that takes advantage of my attributes; then at around noon, I go do whatever job the game logic gave me based on my tagged skills; and then during the afternoon, - I don't know - the vault has a baseball game and you participate in a way that is determined by your traits. Say if you chosen Fast Shot or One Hander, then you would play as one of the pitchers, or if you chosen Good Natured, you would be the referee. (If you chosen Sex Appeal, you would be a cheerleader. )

 

[.Pixote.]

With the except of creating vault 101 residents' critters (with I could probably do by taking the vault 13 critters and changes their appearances, which should be relatively easy)...

Goodluck there...it's like saying I'm going to climb Mt Everest in my underpants, it can be done, but your balls will take a battering.

Slow down - learn the software, understand the games mechanics, what can be done and what can't be done. Try to build one single working map with 3 elevations - and if that works out, then move forward.

Scripting will be most your important knowledge - master that, then you can go crazy with your Fallout modding, within the limits of the games very old and clunky engine. But this thread sees lots of people come and go with their great ideas about building this and that, and 99% of the time nothing eventuates. It's easy to get excited...but harder to actually spend hundreds of hours working away with little reward. Don't let that put you off, if you really want to do this you can, but it wont be easy. Follow lisac2k's words of wisdom.

 

[Ardent]

What I could do is this: During the morning, I am asked to do something that takes advantage of my attributes; then at around noon, I go do whatever job the game logic gave me based on my tagged skills; and then during the afternoon, - I don't know - the vault has a baseball game and you participate in a way that is determined by your traits. Say if you chosen Fast Shot or One Hander, then you would play as one of the pitchers, or if you chosen Good Natured, you would be the referee. (If you chosen Sex Appeal, you would be a cheerleader. )

This is a very complicated sequence to write script-wise. Start simple. Like Pixote said, first build a map. Test it for blockers, exit grids, etc. (if you don't know what I'm talking about, read the Mapper instructions thoroughly). Making the map alone, when you're not experienced, will probably take you at least a week. Oh, and don't bother with the elevators for now.

If you still like Fallout modding, go about designing your area. Believe it or not, but it's essential, if you want to create something coherent and not be forced to redo it twice before it's any good. Download Van Buren (cancelled Black Isle Fallout 3) Design Documents available at the Vault (the Fallout Wiki) and read at least through 01 - Tibbets Prison design document. Chris Avellone explains everything about writing a design document there and provides awesome examples.

Write the design for your Vault 101. You don't have to be as specific as Van Buren documents. You already know the story, it's established etc., so you can basically skip the overview part. But you should absolutely outline your NPCs. Check out this example:

Dad
Role: Doctor for V101, Player's dad
Location: V101, Level 1, medical bay
File: v101c1
Appearance: white smock critter
Description: Your dad is a good natured man whose main concern is his baby - the player. Blablablablabla.
Specific reactions: If the player is armed, will ask to put down weapon.
Technical information: In the evening, he walks to the canteen.
Gives quests: Help dad at work.
Involved in quests: n/a

Normally, you would write more in the description area. It is here that you outline the character - their desires, their traits of character, etc. It will help you write the dialogue. The information like location or the appearance of the critter are not so important if you're doing a small mod, but it's good to have the right habits when you move on to larger projects.

After you have your cast of characters, it's time to design the quest. Here is an example:

1.
Help dad at work

Description: Another day at the Vault has just started. The player appears at the Vault's medical bay with their father. Dad needs help at work.
The player should initiate dialogue with dad and ask what needs to be done. Dad informs the player there are several tasks for them.
The first task involves browsing the medical history of a patient for mentions of liver problems at young age.
The second task is about bandaging the knee of one kid who slipped on wet floor.
The third task is fetching a First Aid Kit from the supply room. Each new task will be given after the previous one is complete.
When the player (dude) has finished all tasks, they are given their reward and are free to hang out in the canteen.
Initiator: Dad
Scope: Small
Importance: Minor
Rewards: 100 XP for each sub-task, $50
Global_variables:
GVAR_HELP_DAD
= 0 // Quest inactive
= 1 // Quest accepted, first task given
= 2 // First task completed
= 3 // Second task given
= 4 // Second task completed
= 5 // Third task given
= 6 // Quest completed and rewarded
Warrior: A combat-oriented player has no specific ways of performing the tasks. Task 1: Use the computer in the medical bay and follow the dialogue to find the appropriate medical file. When the player opens the right dialogue node, the variable is set to 2, The player should now talk to Dad again and give him the necessary information.
Task 2: Use First Aid skill on the kid who stands in the med bay. If the test is successful, the variable is set to 4, the kid floats a grateful message and runs along. Dude should return to dad for the next task.
Task 3: The player should navigate the corridors of the Vault to find the supply officer, Jenkins (or whatever). Jenkins will give the player the First Aid kit and ask to say hello to your Dad for him. The player should now return to Dad to complete the quest.
Thief: A stealthy player could just steal the First Aid kit without getting involved in the lengthy and somewhat tedious conversation with Jenkins.
Diplomat: A diplomatic dude may ask why Dad didn't know the facts from the medical history of the patient in Task 1. The reason is obviously, because your dad wasn't yet in the Vault at that time. But he will try to cover it up saying there are many people in the Vault and it's impossible to know their medical histories by heart. Or some such.

Well, basically all is there. The outline describes what follows what, what actions are needed to perform the quest, all the reactions and some technical information as well. Modify this as you please.

As for the global variable thingy, check out the scripting tutorials to get familiar with this notion.

***

When you have outlined the NPCs and the quest and have the map ready, you may proceed to dialogue writing. Check out dialogue writing tutorials at the modding Wiki. (Vault-tec Labs modding wiki)

Write the dialogue for all the characters that are involved with the quest. It will take you a while.

***

Finally, you may proceed to scripting. Generally, read the tutorials for guidelines and then browse the original Fallout 2 scripts (provided with the Mapper) to see how things are done. This is the hardest part. It will be the most frustrating of all Fallout modding, you will feel lost and furious at the stupidity of the limitations. But if you get your head around it, you'll progressively get better and will be able to do more complex stuff.

For the start, don't exceed the simplicity of what I've written in the quest design - it will prove complicated enough.

***

After you have scripted something, test it. Testing is very important and will eat on your nerves a lot. When you think you have finished testing, pass the mod to two or three people to test it too. I can assure you they will find several more bugs you wouldn't even think about. When you have squashed all the bugs (or at least you think you did), release the mod to the public, with fanfares and everything. Be prepared that the community will find another 50 bugs in what you believed was finished work.

Don't get discouraged. Work hard and there will be fruit.

 

[Mr. 1010101]

I didn't think I would get this much attention on this forum. I mean, yeah, I know redoing an entire game is not something to take lightly, but whenever I mentioned an idea in the past, either it just gets ignored or it's torn up and thrown out a window.

I realize what I have mentioned so far is, to say the least, very ambitious. That is just how I learn this kind of stuff.

 

[Mr. 1010101]

So I was reading the What we learned from Fallout 3 forum under Fallout 3 discussions to get some ideas on what I would change and I noticed a really disturbing topic that came up. There was a great deal of argument as to whether a giant water purifier would be necessary since most of the radiation would be gone within 200 years. If that is the case, I might actually have to scrap this project since now the very main plot has been destroyed to the point that there is nothing salvageable anymore. I guess I could change it to where, instead of a water purifier, your dad was working on - say - some sort-of G.E.C.K. amplifier that takes a standard G.E.C.K. and multiplies its power allowing the user to alter an entire region, or several regions, to their liking. Atleast that would make more sense than stripping a G.E.C.K. down to just a really nice water chip.

 

[lisac2k]

I never finished FO3, TBH. Gave it a chance a few months ago, but it was an exceptionally tiring experience. That said, I never got to the end, so I can't confirm the plausibility of the whole story. I may, however, notice that the story and dialogs weren't the strongest point of the game (BTW, there were next to none of strong points, if you ask me). The whole "daddy" plot was very annoying for me, not to mention holes in it, everywhere. And I love my biological father, before anyone jumps to any funny conclusions.

I see you care about the plot and how to write your stuff, which is commendable, and this is why I'm going to tell you this:
Whatever you do, try to make it sound plausible. The best guidelines about the world and setting should be the Fallout 1 game along with the original Fallout Bible compiled by Chris Avellone. These two give pretty much a good overview of the Fallout world, how it looked like before the Great War and how it may look like in the future.

And forget not:

My idea is to explore more of the world and more of the ethics of a post-nuclear world, not to make a better plasma rifle.

 

[Mr. 1010101]

So maybe there is more to the plot than you looking for daddy. Maybe before he left, he took something from the vault that he needed, that something would put the vault at risk if they didn't have it - no no no no no. That wouldn't work. He would bring you to the vault to begin with if he was going to sabotage it. And what could he take from a vault that would prove to be useful anyways? Can't be a G.E.C.K., that would be too easy. *sigh*

 

[Sobboth]

The idea behind fallout 3 main plot is quite good IMO.
But his development was horrible.

 

[Mr. 1010101]

Actually, now that I have been tossing around the idea for a while, maybe your dad does take something from the vault just before leaving. Nothing that would destroy the vault if left without it, but important enough that the overseer would send someone out to go retrieve it back. So the overseer assembles a small team consisting of you and about three or four other people to go out and look for your dad.

I know that starting out the game with three or four companions with you right off the bat would make the game too easy, but I would think that the idea of the overseer sending out one person, alone, for an important mission just didn't seem reasonable. Plus you can guess that maybe something happens early on in the mission where you or the entire team gets separated, or your team is ambushed by raiders and only you escape, or something.

-Now what would this thing that your dad took would be?
Maybe it's something that he needed for the project he was working on before he came to the vault. Maybe he was trying to "encourage" the overseer and the citizens of the vault to help him and he promised to give back whatever he took in return. Ideas anyone?

I know the plot in FO3 was pretty bad, especially when you examine it in detail, but I would like to keep the general plot as unchanged as possible. This is suppose to be a remake, a re-imagining, Bethesda's Fallout 3: the proper version. If we were to change too many things we might as well just start a new game from scratch.

-Now for a little first rough draft on the general situation going on in the region:
(This rough draft is something that I just cooked up in the last 24 hours.)

The lands along the east coast were hit heavily, but life there has been able to recover alot quicker than what we have seen on the west coast. In this version of the game, the world map will mainly consist of most of Virginia and Maryland, as well as Pennsylvania, North Carolina, and Delaware. (actually, that is a question I've been meaning to ask. How big were those maps in FO1 & 2 in terms of kilometers or miles? 300 Km? 400 Km?) Here, there are three major political regions.

The first would be the Commonwealth (mentioned in FO3, but never actually go there). I don't have any plans yet on changing what the official wiki description says on the Commonwealth, but that will probably change. Lets just say that their influence covers a much larger region than what was let to believe in the actual game.

The second region encompasses most of former Pennsylvania, which is controlled by a more legalistic society; maybe a little communist. The Pitt would actually be one of their major industrial areas. While this group would have its obvious negative qualities, (based on what your karma meter would be telling you) they would also have certain other characteristics that one might find positive. I don't want this faction just end up looking like a bunch of jerks in the end.

The last region covers areas around the Chesapeake Bay, and consists of loosely bound city-states, like Megaton and Rivet City. (If you need a comparison, just think of the ancient Greek states.)

I know that this is starting to sound like the plot from FNV, but I'm really trying not to. Yes, your actions would end up determining who/whom is left standing, but that would only be a secondary plot, like in FO2.

And sure, there are other factions as well. Other ideas consist of:
-A town of slavers who give slaves to faction #2 I mentioned earlier in exchange for their independence.
-A small Enclave outpost - although they're just a minor thing now. Navarro has left them scattered; this group being one of the larger ones. But like the great Wanamingos of Redding, their time is up.
-Various religious communities.
-Aliens . . . maybe . . . what is everyone's opinion here on Mothership Zeta? If I were to remake that part of the game, I would definitely make it shorter.

Anyways, that's all I got right now.

 

[lisac2k]

You've already gotten enough attention and advices from the most experienced modders around here, should be proud of yourself.

I would personally opt against aliens (not wanamingos), but other than that, the story doesn't sound that bad at all. The point where your teammates are killed/missing/unable to help you is a bit cliche (not too much, but still), however there's a lot of room for improvement, improvisation and new ideas.

About the map size, search for the Fallout 1/2 worldmap images, then compare it to the google maps or something. The worldmap can be smaller as well, it all turns down to cities/locations in the end.

 

[Mr. 1010101]

You've already gotten enough attention and advices from the most experienced modders around here, should be proud of yourself.

Well I guess I shouldn't be surprised. If anyone said they were going to remake a game, they would easily get a lot of attention too. But thank you.

I would personally opt against aliens...

Alright, no biggy. Might keep the alien blaster in though.

The point where your teammates are killed/missing/unable to help you is a bit cliche (not too much, but still)...

Hmm, you might be right. Actually, there is more to that idea for the plot than what I mentioned earlier, but I don't want to tell people about it if I were to use it, so I'm going to put up a spoiler filter up real quickly, just in case I do:

[spoiler:7a3f5f5f70]The overseer is so determined to get back whatever your dad took that he has ordered his men to take whatever means necessary to get the job done. (Basically, they will kill him on sight.) When your character hears that the overseer is planning to send people out to find your dad, he/she quickly volunteers to join them. Mind you, you don't know the true nature of this mission yet. The overseer is reluctant at first, but decides that you wouldn't be much of a threat if you got in the way.[/spoiler:7a3f5f5f70]

That raises another question (just one more to the thousands that I have ): Are all overseers naturally just a bunch of a**holes? There were 122 vaults. Surely, one of them had atleast one descent guy as their leader.

Anyways, I'm almost done with my V101 maps. Just need to change/create some FRM files so the doors actually say "101," and I need to create some new scripts for the doors and computers. Nothing to much right now, just:

-Get the elevators working. (I actually know how to do that part. I just need to find a good program for opening FRM's.)
-Appropriate locks on the appropriate doors and containers.
-Doors that only meant to open/close through using a computer. ('meant to' as in you can force open the door the old fashion way, but the residence might look down on you for it)
-Walls that only meant to open/close to reveal hidden passages through using a computer. (I'm keeping the idea of secret passageways though the vault, like the tunnel between the overseer's office and the vault door in FO3)
-Roofs. (there are 'stone' roofs over those secret passages, but for some reason, they either don't disappear when I enter those halls or they don't appear at all)
-And maybe a few other small programs as well, like a computer that controls the light or something.

 

[Mr. 1010101]

Question:
What would be the proper way of writing this?:

variable Small_Guns_Check;

Small_Guns_Check:=do_check(dude_obj,STAT_small_guns,TAGGED);

If (Small_Guns_Check == true) then begin

. . .

I'm pretty sure that is not how you should write it, so any help will do. I'm basically trying to recreate the script that determined what items you would start with in FO1.

Also, I could also use a trait check script.

 

[Lexx]

if (is_skill_tagged(SKILL_SMALL_GUNS)) then begin...

About traits, example:

if (has_trait(TRAIT_TRAIT,self_obj,TRAIT_small_frame)) then...

There are many useful macros defined already in the source files. Read the command.h and define.h files and see what's there already. Additionally you will have to read lots of the original script files to see how things are done in there, etc.

In the very beginning, I've thought about situations in the original games, where stuff was used that I need and then I've been searching this in the script files to find out how it works.

 

[lisac2k]

You've already gotten enough attention and advices from the most experienced modders around here, should be proud of yourself.

Well I guess I shouldn't be surprised. If anyone said they were going to remake a game, they would easily get a lot of attention too.

I think you'll agree with me that we are talking not just about any attention here. I haven't seen so many good modders in so short timeframe in a single thread trying to help a beginner since... ever.

Are all overseers naturally just a bunch of a**holes?

Depicting human nature in Fallout is what I like most. But don't forget the shades of gray when it comes to morality and judgement: why is someone an arsehole in the first line, what are his/her motives? Maybe him/her being arsehole will bring many good to those that s/he care for? Is his/her care more justified than your (players') care? And does s/he care at all?

The concept in the spoiler sounds quite good to me.

Take a look here for editing Fallout 1/2 graphics. I personally prefer Fame Animator.

For scripting, I can only repeat what Lexx said. Dig through the original scripts to find what you need, if you have no solution for your problem, try posting it here.