So what do people think of the characters?

[Bradylama]

We should at least see enough about the Brotherhood to know that somebody actually believes in - whatever they actually believe - in the first season. A story shouldn't leave practically every thread dangling except the two big twists that happened in the past and ruined the entire franchise.

Ultimately we know practically nothing about the players, whether they're side characters or factions, except that the Brotherhood is hoarding technology and Moldaver's faction (which we don't even get the name for) wants the core to build - something. I don't think the word "Enclave" comes up once either. They're the inciting incident for the whole season and they're gone when Wilzig flees the compound.

 

[Hardboiled Android]

We should at least see enough about the Brotherhood to know that somebody actually believes in - whatever they actually believe - in the first season. A story shouldn't leave practically every thread dangling except the two big twists that happened in the past and ruined the entire franchise.

I agree, as I said it's a huge problem in itself. It's a bad show.

Ultimately we know practically nothing about the players, whether they're side characters or factions, except that the Brotherhood is hoarding technology and Moldaver's faction (which we don't even get the name for) wants the core to build - something. I don't think the word "Enclave" comes up once either. They're the inciting incident for the whole season and they're gone when Wilzig flees the compound.

The Brotherhood when they're sending Titus out specifically mentioned that the target is escaped from the Enclave I think. The word was definitely mentioned.

 

[Bradylama]

I agree, as I said it's a huge problem in itself. It's a bad show.


The Brotherhood when they're sending Titus out specifically mentioned that the target is escaped from the Enclave I think. The word was definitely mentioned.

Oh right they did mention Wilzig was a fugitive from the Enclave. Which still begs the question of how they know that. Did the Enclave put their name and address for the bounty on all those wanted posters?

 

[CT Phipps]

You're making assumptions about characters' beliefs based on nothing. None of the people you've listed express any kind of religious belief except Quintus, and he has to in order to perform his duties as cleric. Thaddeus speaks to 'Titus' in the subservient language of a squire, but that's protocol in a nominally honor-based hierarchy. Maximus drops a line about "Eden, or whatever" and that's the most we get out of the Brotherhood's tenets from Maximus, and he obviously doesn't care about "whatever" that is. They are all frankly way too normal. Where are the zealots?

I mean Thaddeus is obviously a zealot and so is Quintus so I'm confused how many you needed there to be. Maximus also starts a true believer but is rapidly disillusioned. Titus is the one that is viewed as an utter disgrace.

Oh right they did mention Wilzig was a fugitive from the Enclave. Which still begs the question of how they know that. Did the Enclave put their name and address for the bounty on all those wanted posters?

I mean....yes. Given that the bounty hunters know the bounty is from the Enclave and they want him delivered back to them, dead or alive.

This Enclave is obviously operating in the open and presumably abandoned their pretensions of being pure humanity since they live in an abandoned shopping center.

 

[Bradylama]

I mean Thaddeus is obviously a zealot and so is Quintus so I'm confused how many you needed there to be. Maximus also starts a true believer but is rapidly disillusioned. Titus is the one that is viewed as an utter disgrace.

No, dude, Thaddeus isn't a true believer he's a toady. He says and does whatever it takes to kiss up and avoid being on the bottom rung like Maximus is. The show implies at the beginning that Maximus is a believer, but it's not true. Maximus doesn't believe in anything, or even really know about anything at all.

I mean....yes. Given that the bounty hunters know the bounty is from the Enclave and they want him delivered back to them, dead or alive.

This Enclave is obviously operating in the open and presumably abandoned their pretensions of being pure humanity since they live in an abandoned shopping center.

No, none of that is obvious at all. If the Enclave were openly operating then people would know about it and they would have been mentioned. An Enclave that had turned away from isolation to become a conquering state would have its agents and representatives everywhere. They wouldn't have needed to issue the bounties.

The "Enclave" is supposed to be isolated from the world because they can't tolerate contact with the wasteland holloi polloi. Thus the word "Enclave," a bastion of civilization in terra nullius. Cooper also mentions that the bounty came down from "all six agencies" which means the Enclave is concealing itself as the client. So why does the Brotherhood know about the Enclave and the core?

 

[CT Phipps]

No, dude, Thaddeus isn't a true believer he's a toady. He says and does whatever it takes to kiss up and avoid being on the bottom rung like Maximus is. The show implies at the beginning that Maximus is a believer, but it's not true. Maximus doesn't believe in anything, or even really know about anything at all.

Maximus is a believer in what he THINKS the Brotherhood stands for and knows enough to explain the Brotherhood's credo. Lucy says, "You use Pre-War technology to gather Pre-War technology to keep people from using Pre-War technology." Which is succinct enough to describe the Brotherhood's ideology. He doesn't know much about Tech so his science and repair scores are shit but he's not ignorant of the actual mission like some people suggest.

No, none of that is obvious at all. If the Enclave were openly operating then people would know about it and they would have been mentioned. An Enclave that had turned away from isolation to become a conquering state would have its agents and representatives everywhere. They wouldn't have needed to issue the bounties.

They are openly mentioned by Quintus when he says, "A Enclave scientist has run away" and then the Boutny Hunter telling Cooper about an Enclave scientist.

0:53

The "Enclave" is supposed to be isolated from the world because they can't tolerate contact with the wasteland holloi polloi. Thus the word "Enclave," a bastion of civilization in terra nullius. Cooper also mentions that the bounty came down from "all six agencies" which means the Enclave is concealing itself as the client. So why does the Brotherhood know about the Enclave and the core?

I point to the video clip.

 

[Bradylama]

Yes, Honcho knowing about the Enclave and also that Wilzig is going to California to meet Moldaver also means the Enclave didn't have to issue the bounties if they know that much about Wilzig's plans already. They could have simply tracked him down. Even the Brotherhood knows that Wilzig is heading to Filly. So the Enclave announced to the entire wasteland that this one guy has this valuable thing and they want it. Like that's not going to draw the attention of all the Enclave's enemies and rivals?

I was joking about the Enclave giving all their details in the bounty notices because it's so stupid, but I guess that's exactly what they did. They probably left a name and address, too. Why not the President's mailbox?

 

[Bradylama]

If the Enclave announced to the entire world about Wilzig and where he was headed, why didn't Moldaver show up in Filly with force to guarantee his safe transport? She's just leaving his ass blowing in the wind and he's the lynchpin of her entire plan.

 

[CT Phipps]

Yes, Honcho knowing about the Enclave and also that Wilzig is going to California to meet Moldaver also means the Enclave didn't have to issue the bounties if they know that much about Wilzig's plans already. They could have simply tracked him down. Even the Brotherhood knows that Wilzig is heading to Filly. So the Enclave announced to the entire wasteland that this one guy has this valuable thing and they want it. Like that's not going to draw the attention of all the Enclave's enemies and rivals?

I was joking about the Enclave giving all their details in the bounty notices because it's so stupid, but I guess that's exactly what they did. They probably left a name and address, too. Why not the President's mailbox?

The Enclave happily works with Wastelanders if it suits their purposes. They worked with one of the New Reno crime families, they hired Talon Company, and they also employed Reily's Raiders. They have had their asses kicked royally in the games so why wouldn't they have hired some contractors to find their missing scientist?

If the Enclave announced to the entire world about Wilzig and where he was headed, why didn't Moldaver show up in Filly with force to guarantee his safe transport? She's just leaving his ass blowing in the wind and he's the lynchpin of her entire plan.

I doubt there's much ability to coordinate when he's supposed to arrive there. The whole point was he'd work with a smuggler to get him to Los Angeles Central Park. Besides, she's bringing Hank back to Griffith for torture and interrogation.

 

[Bradylama]

The Enclave happily works with Wastelanders if it suits their purposes. They worked with one of the New Reno crime families, they hired Talon Company, and they also employed Reily's Raiders. They have had their asses kicked royally in the games so why wouldn't they have hired some contractors to find their missing scientist?

Because the Enclave has vertibirds, and loyal goons with advanced power armor. We see in the intro that Dogmeat was being raised for some kind of cyberdog program so they could have literally hounded him down too. It's completely unnecessary with all the resources at their disposal, to attract the attention of the entire world to Wilzig.

I doubt there's much ability to coordinate when he's supposed to arrive there. The whole point was he'd work with a smuggler to get him to Los Angeles Central Park. Besides, she's bringing Hank back to Griffith for torture and interrogation.

Yeah and the plan is botched if everyone in the world is heading to Filly. Moldaver was compromised before he got there. It's not adding up, it's just bad writing.

 

[CT Phipps]

Because the Enclave has vertibirds, and loyal goons with advanced power armor. We see in the intro that Dogmeat was being raised for some kind of cyberdog program so they could have literally hounded him down too. It's completely unnecessary with all the resources at their disposal, to attract the attention of the entire world to Wilzig.

They're conducting their experiments in a bombed out ruin with holes in the wall and no sign of Power Armor and a shitty malfunctioning turret.

You assume they're also raising cyberdogs versus....guard dogs.

The Enclave is broken and good riddance.

 

[Bradylama]

They're conducting their experiments in a bombed out ruin with holes in the wall and no sign of Power Armor and a shitty malfunctioning turret.

You assume they're also raising cyberdogs versus....guard dogs.

The Enclave is broken and good riddance.

Dude the point is that they have TRAINED HOUNDS that could track down Wilzig anywhere. We also see that the Enclave has guards with standardized uniforms, and fresh ones, which means that they have significant manufacturing capability. There was no reason whatsoever for the Enclave to announce to the entire world that this one guy is headed to Moldaver with the most important thing on the planet.

 

[CT Phipps]

Dude the point is that they have TRAINED HOUNDS that could track down Wilzig anywhere. We also see that the Enclave has guards with standardized uniforms, and fresh ones, which means that they have significant manufacturing capability. There was no reason whatsoever for the Enclave to announce to the entire world that this one guy is headed to Moldaver with the most important thing on the planet.

Except they clearly didn't find him with their ability to do so and couldn't. We also only know they have a decent laundry.

 

[Bradylama]

Ultimately the biggest problem with the cold fusion core is that for there to be any future for Fallout as a franchise it has to be destroyed. Otherwise cheap-as-free energy practically fixes anything, and robots performing automatic functions fueled endlessly by cold fusion would clean up the wasteland and make America a fertile and verdant paradise again. It's nonsense. We can see this coming from a mile away. They introduced the one thing that could save the world from the post-apocalypse in a franchise that depends on traipsing around in the post-apocalypse.

Except they clearly didn't find him with their ability to do so and couldn't. We also only know they have a decent laundry.

Oh so total randos in the wasteland are going to be better at tracking down Wilzig than the most technically advanced faction known in the world? Are you serious? You're doing headcanon again.

 

[CT Phipps]

Ultimately the biggest problem with the cold fusion core is that for there to be any future for Fallout as a franchise it has to be destroyed. Otherwise cheap-as-free energy practically fixes anything, and robots performing automatic functions fueled endlessly by cold fusion would clean up the wasteland and make America a fertile and verdant paradise again. It's nonsense. We can see this coming from a mile away. They introduced the one thing that could save the world from the post-apocalypse in a franchise that depends on traipsing around in the post-apocalypse.

I'd argue it's completely worthless because nuclear energy is already cheap to the point of being limitless. The nuclear reactors that are still functional in the Wasteland are the things that are keeping the lights on even two hundred years later. The issues is the infrastructure doesn't exist to spread that power around and make use of it.

But I imagine that in-universe, the BOS will just use it for their own NEFARIOUS purposes.

 

[Hardboiled Android]

they hired Talon Company, and they also employed Reily's Raiders.

Pretty sure these latter two are pure fanon, not even strongly implied.

 

[CT Phipps]

Pretty sure these latter two are pure fanon, not even strongly implied.

Who do you think Mr. Smith works for?

https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/"Mr._Smith"

Contract: Ruins Mapping
Status: Ongoing
Projected Income: Unknown
Acquired Income: 1765 caps

Description: Terrain and structure mapping for District of Columbia urban sections. Make notes of enemy resistance, weapons caches, strategic positions, retreat points, etc. Provide detailed files in holotape format to buyer. Buyer to remain anonymous and pay via caps left in predetermined spot known only to Reilly.

****

I've gotten the approval from "Mr. Smith" for the mapping project. It's going well so far... definitely easier than hunting down Muties. The caps have been good, so we'll stick with it unless something better pops up.

We had a little bit of a run-in with Talon Company today. Those pricks always have to start shit with us... and unfortunately for them, Brick was with us. Needless to say it wasn't long before I heard Eugene's familiar whine and she started dropping them like flies. We got out of there with no casualties, but I think for now we'll give the Capital building a wide berth.

 

[Hardboiled Android]

Who do you think Mr. Smith works for?

https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/"Mr._Smith"

Contract: Ruins Mapping
Status: Ongoing
Projected Income: Unknown
Acquired Income: 1765 caps

Description: Terrain and structure mapping for District of Columbia urban sections. Make notes of enemy resistance, weapons caches, strategic positions, retreat points, etc. Provide detailed files in holotape format to buyer. Buyer to remain anonymous and pay via caps left in predetermined spot known only to Reilly.

****

I've gotten the approval from "Mr. Smith" for the mapping project. It's going well so far... definitely easier than hunting down Muties. The caps have been good, so we'll stick with it unless something better pops up.

We had a little bit of a run-in with Talon Company today. Those pricks always have to start shit with us... and unfortunately for them, Brick was with us. Needless to say it wasn't long before I heard Eugene's familiar whine and she started dropping them like flies. We got out of there with no casualties, but I think for now we'll give the Capital building a wide berth.

No idea. And the fact is, I don't think Bethesda had any real idea either, they just threw this in to explain how the fuck Reilly's Rangers made money in the nonsensical economy they had built. They just passed the buck as it were of nonsensical economics to an unseen, unknown third party. The same goes for whoever is employing Talon Company, or the Regulators, or who Mr. Burke's true employers are.

It's reasonable and perhaps even interesting to speculate that the Enclave is behind this Mr. Smith character, but there's really almost nothing to suggest it. All you have is 1) He's mysterious (Like the Enclave!) and 2) This is possibly maybe potentially the sort of information that the Enclave would be interested in for their coming reconquista of the DC beltway. But that's it. Maybe it's the Brotherhood paying Reilly's Rangers, maybe it's the jar-brain Calvert with all off his punga-buxx, maybe it's the Zetans, maybe it's that sinister character Hank and his buddies at Vault-Tec, maybe it's the Institute. Who knows! Not me, not you, and probably not even the quest designer who wrote it.

I think the explanation I would favor the most would probably be the Enclave one, but I wouldn't cite it as a point in my favor in an argument, or if I did I would HEAVILY qualify it.

 

[CT Phipps]

No idea. And the fact is, I don't think Bethesda had any real idea either, they just threw this in to explain how the fuck Reilly's Rangers made money in the nonsensical economy they had built.

So the speculation is that whenever there's a mystery, it's just bad writing. Got it.

 

[Hardboiled Android]

So the speculation is that whenever there's a mystery, it's just bad writing. Got it.

Not what I said, Phipps. A mystery box can be a legitimate tool in a writer's kit, it would be silly to say that it's always bad writing. I do think in this specific case that probably it was deployed due to a paucity in the rest of the setting's worldbuilding, but that is an inferrence on my part.

But in any case, the fact remains that it is a mystery box, and the writer didn't actually provide us sufficient evidence to draw any strong conclusions whatsoever.