Some Fallout 3 ideas

Rev. Layle said:
not so much a strict 50s theme... a 50's looking STYLE... with technology that just progressed in a different manner from how we currently see technology progressing

Wrong. We MUST STAY with a strict 50's Sci-fi for Fallout to to work. You can't have jumpjets looking very 50s.
 
I didn't say you should put jumpjets in there.... but by golly they had some pretty modern looking laser & plasma weapons, techy gadgets (like the motion sensor and stealthboy), combat armor, holodisks, and even clothing that didn't have much of a 50s style at all
 
Wrong. We MUST STAY with a strict 50's Sci-fi for Fallout to to work. You can't have jumpjets looking very 50s.

Sure you can. Jumpjets would fit a 50's Sci-Fi setting perfectly, but that's not really the issue. I'm more concerned about why they should be included at all. Firstly, there's the fuel issue. We all know the background in Fallout, so any petroleum based system is very much out of the question. Secondly, what function would they serve in the game? Sure, they would be a cool gadget and all but apart from that I can't find any reason to include them.

But let's talk enemies instead. If you look at some of the older posts in this forum, you'll see some neat ideas for a post Fallout 2 storyline. Someone suggested that the Deathclaws could be used as the main enemy in Fallout 3, and I agree. This would end the whole charade that was the Enclave (although some ideas connected with the Enclave were good), and at the same time open up for the possibility of different factions (humans, muties, ghouls etc) to work together (or not) against the new threat. The game could then focus more on the social aspects of a post-nuclear world, than the previous two.
 
Sina's opening scenario sounds more like the Borg than power armour, with all those red beams cutting from the dust.

Jumpjets? What you want is a rocket pack though to be honest I can't see the need for a working one unless it's used as a device to get you to a previously unreachable area like with the tanker.

What would be nice is to walk into the junkyard and have a rusty old Rocketman style helmet and pack in amongst the junked cars. They thought we'd all be flying around on rocket packs by now, so it would be nice to see some remains of old tech other than just cars.

*

I'd like for FO3 to move away from pre-war tech, set it a further 80 years on and have the old technologies winding down and wearing out. Not just high tech like laser pistols, but the other pre-war stuff like combat armour, AK-112s etc. Other than new versions that might of been manufactured by the Brotherhood or maybe the Vaults most of these guns are going to be several hundred years old, they've been through a lot and are bound to become unusable in the end.

There should be very few if any books around, most of them should of fallen to bits by FO3, those that are left should be horded not left scattered around. The amount of people with knowledge of old tech should be few and far between. The brotherhood should be a scattered bunch of old men without a functioning suit of PA between them.

There should only be one suit of power armour available to the player, the T51-b. It should be treated like a vehicle, no addons other than perhaps a headlamp/nightvision mode. And when the player finds it, it should be in a junked condition and you'll need to find spares, someone to repair it (or to teach you to repair it) and a power source. I say no addons because being a walking tank ought to be enough of an advantage over the other armours without any fancy retractable blades or chameleon circuits.

As for the face of the Wasteland, I'd like to see more fortified towns, the NCR should be gone, New Reno an abandoned ruin. All the vaults that are going to open have done so and the rest are tombs.

Instead of the tribal, raider, slaver etc definitions people should be divided between settlers and nomads.

Nomads would include herders, merchants and ferals.

The herders would be the closest to FO2's tribals, they have little time for education they spend their time driving their herds from one pasture to the next, living off the land or trading animals for grain and other goods.

Merchants, just like in Fallout but rather than having an office in the hub and little car trunk carts they have great big cavarans (converted trucks or rail cars?) pulled by teams of brahmin. Which are as much home to them as well as cargo space.

Ferals, small groups, wild, lawless. Either orphaned and banded together for survival or kicked out of a settlement or nomadic group for crimes committed.

The settlers as the name suggests live in settlements across the wastes, most are farming communities, with a few ranches (though they are always in conflict with the herders) and some specialist communities producing a single item (like booze).

The largest and richest are descended from the Vaults and like New Arroyo were constructed with a GECK. They found a suitable valley with a water supply, walled off the entrances and exits, to the valley leaving just one or two gates to allow passage. Using the instructions with the GECK they built a water purifier and irrigation system. They test their children for learning aptitude, those who pass go to school, those without any aptitude go to work, menial at best. Their fields produce the largest, healthiest crops but they need a lot of workers. Most other communities are built amongst the rubble of the old world, but they all keep a trained militia for protection and have some form of law.

There's no real clear division between citizen and raider, usually the settlers and nomads live on barter and trade, but if they sense weakness and opportunity they'll raid each other. The nomads don't have a need for slaves, but amongst the settlements especially the larger ones the need for workers has caused the resurgance of slavery.

I think that should be one of the main themes, of FO3, the fight against (or for) slavery. Not the Masteresque plot, but your starting point. Start the game after a slavers raid, perhaps having the player start as a slave.

You could build up to a war between those communities against slavery and the slavers, with the player getting to chose sides.

As for the remains of the Enclave, any troopers that might of survived would probably return to Navarro to regroup, it's doubtful that any were in on the full plans of the Enclave. Most would of been brought up on the ideas of the US. It would be interesting to see them form a Brotherhood like organisation, but dedicated to re-instating the laws of the old US. Perhaps joining up with the remains of the NCR Rangers and calling themselves Marshals? Fighting against slavery and for truth, justice and the American way of life (or however that goes).

Eitherway they should lose most of the tech, any still working APA should be almost worshipped, kept on display as a symbol of what the old world could achieve but never used except in the direst emergencies.

Ghouls and Super Mutants should be few and far between, between Fallout and Fallout 2 bad endings for Ghouls there can't be that many left. While there should be still some around it would be nice to see some more general mutations amongst 'normals'.

Deathclaws were much better in Fallout as a shadowy monster that everyone's afraid of but few have actually met. Good for a mystery, but not a main plot.

Just my tupence worth.

Cheers
 
requiem_for_a_starfury said:
It would be interesting to see them form a Brotherhood like organisation, but dedicated to re-instating the laws of the old US.

"Ride, Postman, ride!"

I agree that futuristic technology should start to break down (although finding new shelters and depots should compensate to a certain extent - we need some kind of Glow-like area in the game). It might be good for the game, but it still seems overly pessimistic to say that overall civilization and communications would start to degrade again rather than steadily improve. The equivalent of 19th century tech (telegraphs, steam trains, printed books and papers) should be everywhere.
 
Per said:
"Ride, Postman, ride!"
Never actually read it nor seen the film, but I think it's a logical step for survivors of the Enclave and Rangers. They wouldn't have to be a clear cut goody two shoes group and certainly not a clone of the Brotherhood. I'd like to get Fallout back to the shades of grey, and less B&W of the sequel.

Per said:
I agree that futuristic technology should start to break down (although finding new shelters and depots should compensate to a certain extent - we need some kind of Glow-like area in the game).
Agreed, I don't want to see the high tech stuff totally gone, but my one itch about all the Fallout games is there's just too much darn stuff. Having a PA game that has a too many items bug seems farcical to me, it would be good to have pre-war conventional weapons rare, and high tech items extremely rare. I like the pulp sci-fi elements, but am more interested in the PA setting, I want that scavenging for survival feeling.

Per said:
It might be good for the game, but it still seems overly pessimistic to say that overall civilization and communications would start to degrade again rather than steadily improve. The equivalent of 19th century tech (telegraphs, steam trains, printed books and papers) should be everywhere.
Pessimistic makes for a better game, there's more chance for drama. That's not to say that there can't be communication between the settlements, especially amongst the richer communities. 19th Century tech would be better than having all the pre-war stuff still around and working. But all it takes is one good fire, or an epidemic outbreak and you can lose a lot of information, or knowledgable people to set civilisation back.

I was really refering to surving original books like Deans electronics, not newly printed material. Though new printed books would be biased to the views of the communities that produce them, and should be limited to certain logical locations, not under every rock. Having some post war published material, full of inaccuracies could be interesting.
 
Very nice post Requiem.

Those would be just weak laser lights, and whoever put them on Borg did not have enough imagination. I mean....Borg needs a laser beam to...what?
Funny...

I just think that Power Armor should have more functionality if its in the game, and it kinda looks to me it will be.
There is just so much oportunity with it...to make it something more than just a metal cover for the body.
Besides things i already mentioned it seems to me it would be cool if you had more to do with it.
Like find parts for it,( like you said) - put it together realy, fix it all the time, find a fuel for it....and with high science and repair skill unlock certian traits that would be unaccesible to other type of players, ....
greater moving speed,
ability to jump
ability to punch through walls if there is a need
ability to cook lunch on it
use it as a can opener...
have a wrist blade or two in it...so when bad guys start to say: -ooh we have run out of amo did we...sniger...sniger...sn-
and some of the ideas max put together
only tuned to fallout setting
and have parts of it fall off in most peculiar moments...

and....

I have to go see a girl.
 
well the T-51 nor Enclave power armors didn't have any type of jumping capabilities, I don't see that changing unless they add a new type of power armor (and explain where it came from.... damn, too much power armor perhaps, good for a sci-fi-in-space game maybe).

cook lunch and can opner? lol

punching through walls. oddly enough... hehe, in fallout 2, you could destroy doors. Wear power armor? Then you have a higher ST and do more damage, couple that with a power fist, or any melee weapon - bam! many doors (not all) could be busted through.

as for punching through walls, i think this could be a good idea in general, power armor or not.

as for the wrist blades? you been playing too much shadowrun and/or watching too much x-men. ;) get a super sledge + power armor = TEH WIN.

keeping PA repaired (or anything repaired or in good shape) is a nice idea, as long as it does not get 1) too complicated and 2) becomes an issue so frequently you are micromanaging equipment repairs instead of playing the game
 
Sina you really are fixated with jumping, remember power armour is a personal tank, you've got to balance the extra strength it gives the wearer against it's weight. You don't tend to see many stunt performers trying to jump a dozen buses, driving a tank now do you. Why jump something when you can plow right through it. Same with extra speed, you're more likely to move slower in PA.

And why do you need wrist blades when hitting someone with exoskeleton boosted strength is likely to crush their skull?

Think of PA as a one man personal armoured vehicle, when everyone else is running around in leather or dressed up like Ned Kelly what more do you need?
 
requiem_for_a_starfury said:
Sina you really are fixated with jumping, remember power armour is a personal tank, you've got to balance the extra strength it gives the wearer against it's weight. You don't tend to see many stunt performers trying to jump a dozen buses, driving a tank now do you. Why jump something when you can plow right through it. Same with extra speed, you're more likely to move slower in PA.

And why do you need wrist blades when hitting someone with exoskeleton boosted strength is likely to crush their skull?

Think of PA as a one man personal armoured vehicle, when everyone else is running around in leather or dressed up like Ned Kelly what more do you need?

I beg to differ. Since Power Armor is by definition equipped with movement enhancers, it's entirely conceivable that the "wearer" will have severely augmented movement speed (say like 60 kph) and be able to jump over 10 meters in distance. All of this (including the jetpack) might prove to be quite useful if Bethesda decides to make FO3 a first person real-time game (which wouldn't suprise me at all).
 
It would be more than likely that any movement enhancers, basically the exoskeleton would primarly be there to allow the wearer just to stand up and move under the weight of the armour. Power Armour in Fallout is big and clunky, I doubt the movement speed would be that greater than without it, just like the strength enhancement wasn't really all that much.
 
Max Demian said:
requiem_for_a_starfury said:
Sina you really are fixated with jumping, remember power armour is a personal tank, you've got to balance the extra strength it gives the wearer against it's weight. You don't tend to see many stunt performers trying to jump a dozen buses, driving a tank now do you. Why jump something when you can plow right through it. Same with extra speed, you're more likely to move slower in PA.

And why do you need wrist blades when hitting someone with exoskeleton boosted strength is likely to crush their skull?

Think of PA as a one man personal armoured vehicle, when everyone else is running around in leather or dressed up like Ned Kelly what more do you need?

I beg to differ. Since Power Armor is by definition equipped with movement enhancers, it's entirely conceivable that the "wearer" will have severely augmented movement speed (say like 60 kph) and be able to jump over 10 meters in distance. All of this (including the jetpack) might prove to be quite useful if Bethesda decides to make FO3 a first person real-time game (which wouldn't suprise me at all).

This is not repeat NOT Starship Troopers. And even if it WERE, the character you play as is not Mobile Infantry. How would he know how to use the capabilities of technology like that without hurting himself or the suit?
 
Max Demian said:
I beg to differ. Since Power Armor is by definition equipped with movement enhancers, it's entirely conceivable that the "wearer" will have severely augmented movement speed (say like 60 kph) and be able to jump over 10 meters in distance. All of this (including the jetpack) might prove to be quite useful if Bethesda decides to make FO3 a first person real-time game (which wouldn't suprise me at all).

this is all true.... IF YOU ARE PLAYING GAMMA WORLD :-P
 
There seem to be two distinct visions of what Power Armor is floating around here. One we have the "walking tank" theory that seems to be what think of it as; the other is more the "Miniature Battlemech w/jumpjets" idea with extreme battlefield mobility, fast speed, jumping, and outrageous capabilities.

I don't see why there shouldn't be different power armors. I remember one of the Fallout 2 intro screens had someone wearing an old beat-up T-51b suit. I'd like to see something like that, perhaps old and worn out, only giving two points strength bonus, and since the eye lenses are all broken, it would provide no environmental protection.

ITEM DESCRIPTION COPY:
You see: Old Power Armor: An old suit of T-51b powered armor. This suit's previous owner was clearly not kind to it. The environmental protections long ago failed, and the suit is no longer gas-tight. The actuators seem to be slowly failing, yet there is still tremendous power in them, more than enough to allow the user to move comfortably. The suit seems to have been wire-brushed at some point, and a thick coat of weather-resistant paint, seemingly only two of the base colors for desert camo, has been applied. Some point after the paint job a pair of metal blades, seemingly cut and attached solely with an arc welder, were fixed to the left forearm. The edges are hand-sharpened and quite viscous.

END ITEM COPY

Provides the same physical protections as T-51b, but fire and radiation protection are lower because the suit is open to the air. Only a +2 ST bonus (not a lot considering what it will weigh; I don't' know if FO3 will go with the FO2 weight or the original weight which was quite a bit more). The blades add a melee attack of moderate significance, but it will always be available, like the ability to club someone with a rifle but or make a bayonet attack presumably will. Since the blades are attached, the AP cost should be low.
 
Lord 342 said:
The blades add a melee attack of moderate significance,
I would of thought just thumping someone while wearing PA would be a significant melee attack in itself. It ought to be at least the equivilent of hitting someone while wearing a power fist. Which brings up another point, if you're wearing a complete set of PA you shouldn't be able to equip powerfists or knuckle dusters etc, the armour's gauntlets would be in the way (and perhaps the equivilent anyway).

Maybe I'm just too old, but what's with the fixation with wrist blades?
 
Why would you want blades when the punch of a power armor wielder must be enough to crack ribs?

And second, why would someone bother with installing a melee weapon on something designed to engage enemies with long range weapons?

Third, if you were going to install a weapon into the gauntlet, why wouldn't it be something more inherently useful like a flame thrower or small laser?

The argument of "too much maintenance" doesn't apply, because power armor was built before the fall.
 
I think i remembered where those blades came from.....

Frank had them.... well...something similar (his were turbo-plasma-something blades if i remember correctly)

As for the logic of it...it seems to me that whoever designed Power Armor for battle should count on some close range combat too, not just ranged. In war or battles you will find yourself up close and personal with the enemy often.

Punching through walls was inspired by my often attempts to brake down dors that i could not unlock in Fallout2, which ordinarily would end up in braking the game itself.

Ofcourse we should have more than one kind of Power Armor....from Armor that we put together piece by piece to more advanced ones.
Only advanced-complete ones should be rare.

As for jumping, thats something i would really like to see in all of RPG-s....because i cant jump -why?
It would add to the reality of any RPG, not just Fallout3.
I use to go bonkers in KOTOR when i would have to run around some shallow obstacle instead just jumping across.
And that jump that fighter class could do really just annoyed me more because i could not do it regularly.

And not being able to jump really limits you to two dimensions, and in 3d game all of space should be ours.
Especially if in Fallout 3 we had some big ruins of cities.


As the Power Armor is like an engine with internal combustion, whatever it uses, and i suppose with heavy use of hydraulics also
it seems logical to me it should have properties of exoskeleton.
So if you would be able to jump without it, with it you should be able to jump higher or further.

And im also for running even in combat cos it only seems natural.
And if done properly it would make it more fluid.

And i really really would not like , and i don't think Bethesda will make first person kind of the game.

lazarus....

1. Just for the "fun" of it. And for reasons explained above.

2. I explained it above..i think.

3. Flamethrower...mmm...interesting.... :P
 
when was the last time a major conflict with any sort of technology had any major personal/melee combat?

and the PA uses Fusion Cells.... combustion engines are for things that run off of gas

(EDIT: Sorry, you don't have to charge Power Armor with Fusion Cells at all... so, honestly I can't remember how it is powered.... wasn't there a small power plant that was supposed to run for years in it, or something??)
 
Rev. Layle said:
when was the last time a major conflict with any sort of technology had any major personal/melee combat?

and the PA uses Fusion Cells.... combustion engines are for things that run off of gas


err.... all the time?

Fusion cells.... yes, i was not sure but its also a kind of internal energy kind of combustion thingy.... point is - it would have enough energy for some of those tricks.
 
Really? most modern war conflicts involve a lot of artillery, shooting from afar, bombings, anything to keep the soldier out of the possible harm of close combat.

ADMITEDDLY, however, PA in the Fallout world was used for crowd/riot control, policing, etc...

While having all these features are probably a cool thing for Power Armor, the truth comes in this fact:

Jumping, builtin-weaponry, etc... were not developed for most millitary issued PA units. The Enclave did improve the PA's ST bonus aspect as well as protection rating. The Frank Horrigan armor, was definately a special case, and no one else got that. If the bombs hadn't of fell, maybe PA advancements COULD have went that way.

So unless some new group of people with tehcnological savvy, YEARS and YEARS after the bomb, mind you, and created a more advanced power armor... great. Until then, we are left with the pre-war and enclave tech, which is, *for the most part*, dictated in previous Fallout games.

The only reason the Enclave made any advancements because they were the descendents of the USA governement/millitary/civilians taht were holed-up on an oil rig (and eventually other outposts) to continue the tradition of the USA. They probably had much technological knowledge that was carried on for many future generations (as they had direct access to the technology as well as the the origin of the technology).... the rest of the people in the wastes were not that fortunate. :)
 
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