Tomorrow's the day...

Jebus

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... when life as we know it will change.


Well, not really, but it's still a big event yo!


tonight, at midnight, the EU will gain 10 new members; thereby becoming a union of states with a population of roughly twice the population of the USA, and the greatest and most important trade bloc in the world.


Not everybody's too happy about it tho'. Here's what some of them say:

* It all happened too fast. Instead of deepening out the existing EU (as in: making the bonds between the nations stronger and the entire thing more stable); they chose to expand first. One of the dangers of this is that it might threaten the stability in the EU, and might even lead to its downfall. After all, we are talking here about TEN nations, who each have their own desires and needs, and each have their own view of where the EU should go. And of course, each nation will most likely look after itself first, just like most of the EU nations are doing right now, which might lead to added chaos.

* The EU is importing problems. Just think of the tensions between Russia and the Baltic nations (where the Russian minority is being 'oppressed': take Latvia (I think) for example; where about 40% of the population is Russian, yet Russian isn't accepted as a national language...); the tension between Greeks and Turkish on Cyprus (which might cause problems in the long run, mainly with Turkey. As you might remember, Turkey is a candidate to join the EU. This means that Cyprus might (and most likely will) use its veto when the decision of wether or not to allow Turkey should be allowed will be taken...).

* It might spell out disaster for the industry of the existing EU-states. Lost of companies have moved their factories to the former East-Bloc nations already, where wages are much lower. When free passage of capital and goods between the western states and the new members becomes possible, this phenomena might very well become bigger.

* It will drain a lot of resources from the richer, western states. Take Poland for example, a country with lots of farmland. The Polish government is demanding the same amount of subsidies for farmers there as in the rest of the EU.
The problem is, that there really are a LOT of farmers in Poland, which could cost billions upon billions for the EU. Add to that that wages and prices in Poland are lower than in the rest of the EU, and that they consequently don't need as much money to run a farm, and you've got yourself an argument.

* And so on, and so on.






I personally think that, although the expansion might indeed have negative effects in the short term, it will cause us all benefit in the long run...


Thoughts?
 
Jebus said:
Thoughts?

I dread the whole thing, actually, but that's probably no surprise, right? :wink:

Anyway: I predict a huge economic crisis in the next five years or so. I predict that there will be more crime over here and less over there in the long run. I think the quality of our food will drop enormously. I think there will be more and more and more and more unemployment over here for a long, long, long, long time. I predict taxes will rise, wages will lower.

AND: I predict that this whole EU thing that is the obsession of a few no good politicians with their heads stuck up their sphincters will eventually turn into a disaster. It'll collapse again after a period of time because it's the most artificial thing I've ever heard of. I sincerely hope the British will remain independant. I hate to see them swallowed up by the continental disease called EU.

My two cents... :roll:
 
PH34R T3H P0L1$H PH4RM3R5 INVAD3RS 0F d()()M


And seriously: No worries, she'll be right.

Ireland was predicted to be a total failure, but they invested their EU money on education and high-tec, research, etc... Nowadays they're one of the fastest growing EU members.

You people underestimate the dynamic, growing market of these new members, allowing economy to expand in already saturated sectors of western European countries.

And on the farmer question, either there's going to be an agrary reform powered by EU funds, either they'll seize power with their national-socialist party.

If that happens, I personally will overthrow the government. Oi!
 
I think the EU will survive and be pretty strong, if all the members learn to cooperate. And despite the fact that the population is bigger, the US economy is still much larger. The EU definitely needs to stabalize more, and if there is to truely be a "European Union," though, the EU needs to focus a lot more on things beside the economy, which it has done, but just definitely not enough of.
 
The EU is expanding too fast. I mentioned this in the lessons from WW 2 thread. The EU will lose the last scraps of democracy as it expands now, and become a union under the unilateral leadership of Germany, as France is weakening and England is uninterested. It's the only way for the EU to remain stable and together, and it blows. I hate it.
 
Kharn said:
The EU is expanding too fast. I mentioned this in the lessons from WW 2 thread. The EU will lose the last scraps of democracy as it expands now, and become a union under the unilateral leadership of Germany, as France is weakening and England is uninterested. It's the only way for the EU to remain stable and together, and it blows. I hate it.

:clap: :clap:

Spoken like a true... well, like a true El-ahrairah, I suppose... whatever that means.

Have you undergone some sort of change or something, or have I been misinterpreting you all along? You do know you are showing a decent amount of doubt in the system in these lines, right? :wink:
 
You know the strangest thing, many people in Norway are now afraid that Norway might not get a "good" deal with EU..
This is all sparked because of the increase in the EU expansion

The whole EU debate is really kicking in here in Norway, my guess is that we'll probably have another election about it...

Would be hilarious if we said no a third time...
 
Blade Runner said:
Have you undergone some sort of change or something, or have I been misinterpreting you all along? You do know you are showing a decent amount of doubt in the system in these lines, right? :wink:

Not *the* system, this particular case of the system. I'm not against the EU, I'm against this rate of expansion.

Odin said:
You know the strangest thing, many people in Norway are now afraid that Norway might not get a "good" deal with EU..

You people should stay out, it's given you a good position.
 
Kharn said:
You people should stay out, it's given you a good position.

Yeah I know, well some of the downsides are of course that import/export has gotten more expensive. But other than that all those predictions they claimed would happen to Norway unless they joined the EU, well..they never happened...strange eh, hehe..

I was actually for the EU last time, this time...I against it and I believe that Norway will most likely say no a third time.. Which would make us the only country that have done that...

The EU idea is a good one, but I really don't see it happening in the near future for Norway..
 
The EU is expanding too fast. I mentioned this in the lessons from WW 2 thread. The EU will lose the last scraps of democracy as it expands now, and become a union under the unilateral leadership of Germany, as France is weakening and England is uninterested. It's the only way for the EU to remain stable and together, and it blows. I hate it.
eu_expansionmap.gif

1942euro.gif


Motherfucking hilarious.
 
Odin said:
You know the strangest thing, many people in Norway are now afraid that Norway might not get a "good" deal with EU..
This is all sparked because of the increase in the EU expansion

The whole EU debate is really kicking in here in Norway, my guess is that we'll probably have another election about it...

Would be hilarious if we said no a third time...

I don't think you'd be the only one. Last time I was in Switzerland I heard plenty of arguments on why the Swiss didn't want to be part of the EU. Apparently they felt their quality of life would only suffer.

As for NATO- I think it's shelf life is quickly dieing, especially as folks like Jebus start strutting about the importance of Europe to have it's own army to invade foreign sovereign nations with rich oil supplies to secure their strategic resources... like..... the US. Still without NATO there would be no EU.
 
welsh said:
I don't think you'd be the only one. Last time I was in Switzerland I heard plenty of arguments on why the Swiss didn't want to be part of the EU. Apparently they felt their quality of life would only suffer.
Yeah, another thing is the lack of vote one gets in the EU counsel. That's one thing that's scared alot of Norwegians, the lack of vote can go against our quality of life..
 
Wooz69 said:
Are you Andrzej Lepper by any chance?

I don't even know who that guy is.

I just find it kind of funny that this looks more and more like some kind of former emporer's club. Look, the two main members (France, Germany) both at diffirent times came close to ruling the world, so did many of the others (Spanish, British)........I honestly think the EU is just a bunch of old farts who jerk off to the days of the great Mission Civilizare and European dominance of the world.

Hell, just ask anybody on the "European Street" what's wrong with America, and they'll tell you that America does not share power with the rest of the world. They've been in control sense the seige of Vienna, and now they can't handel the fact that the center of Civilization has again moved west-this time over an ocean.

Frankly, I think that some of the worst EU Federalist rhetoric has way to much in common with the typical definition of fundementalism, with thier kneejerk belief that the world needs another superpower to counterbalance the US.
 
:rofl:

Right, nothing should oppose the US dominance of the world.
 
You are oc course aware that if this centre of civilization continues to move west, it's next stop is in Bejing? :]
 
Well, give us a few hundred years of dominating the world, and I'm sure we will fade opening the door to another power. My bet is on China, if they continue to improve they could easily over-shadow the United States.

Europe is far to fragmented to be an effective organization. My prediction is on the EU to shudder and eventually collapse (though I bet it will hang on for a substantial number of years).
 
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