Weimar II: Electronic Bugallo

Blue? You mean purple, the far left party I'd imagine becasue it's support is almost exclusivley in the East, or the dark black-ish of the Conservatives?

Yeah, the Kaiser would be cool. Just not the last one.
 
Kotario said:
A benevolent artificial intelligence would be much more effective at running a country.
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Or just a bunch of technocrats with no political skill whatsoever- plato's philosopher-kings.
 
People talk about the Red-Blue divide here....this is a hell of a lot worse.
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^ that was the "blue" I was talking bout

Oh, and guess what people voted in the electoral district I live in.

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Exactly what I voted.
 
Bullshit. The only figure capable of leading Germany into better tomorrow is Erich Honecker... if he was still alive, that is.
 
Funny an all-left coalition is what is taking over as norwegian gouverment in about a months time. And it has the mayority of the parlament with them. Finally we have gotten rid if those blody rightwingers.
 
John Uskglass said:
You know as much about the American democratic system as I do about C++.

The Democrats and the Republicans are pretty diffirent in several ways, but the best thing about our system is that it tends to be inherintly moderate, such that we don't get Communists getting 8% of the Vote or Socail Democrats staying in Power just to spite the most powerful nation on Earth.
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It isn't inherently moderate. The system is currently right-wing, and that's largely because Americans like it that way. If you were to pull of this system in a European country, chances are it'll be a lot more to the left.
 
John Uskglass said:
The Democrats and the Republicans are pretty diffirent in several ways, but the best thing about our system is that it tends to be inherintly moderate, such that we don't get Communists getting 8% of the Vote or Socail Democrats staying in Power just to spite the most powerful nation on Earth.
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Inherently moderate?

That's a good thing?

So you're saying forcing people to vote "moderate", as defined by politics, is good democracy?

One of the weakest arguments for American democracy ever. Your system of elections has a raison d'etre. It's not an idyllic one, but it's fairly practical

john said:
You have to be joking.
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Not necessarily

I'm very unhappy about these election results

I'll explain them a bit because you didn't get our electoral models last time;

Basically, CDU/CSU lost, SPD lost, the fact that they're biggest doesn't matter, SPD lost its governing power with the Greens and CDU is incapable of ruling with the Libs, this means they both lost, both percentually and reality, the only winners are the Libs and the Left Party

Such an electoral result inherently means many fucked up years ahead. Even Red-Red-Green would be better than Red-Black or, say, Red-Yellow-Green, as these options mean Germany will be ruled by crippled politicians for the coming few years. Anything is better than that, really.

CDU/CSU-SPD does look likely. Imagine that. Imagine the pure ineffectiveness of such a government in a time when Germany needs strength.

Horrible.
 
Schroeder ruled out a CDP/CSU-SPD alliance publicly unless he is at the healm of it, and that ain't going to happen. I could see the Jamaica Solution (Green, Black, Yellow) coming to pass, but hope not. I actually hope that Schroeder is so pathetically addicted to his favorite drug, power, that he tries to force through a minority government inspire of opposition from the Left, CDP and FDP, and ultimatley a lot of changes are made in the German political process are made.

And sorry, but it looks like Red-Red-Green is unlikely, the Left hates the SPD.
 
A minority government is unlikely when one of the major parties hates another major party that much. This can be reconciled, but not when one is in the opposition.

Don't think CDU/SPD is impossible just because Schroeder is being a blowhard. Schroeder, and maybe Merkel too, are likely to be fired for incompetence, since they both cost their parties dearly. Unusual? Yes, but not impossible, at all.

Think about the fact that politically CDU and SPD are closer together than the Jamaica model's CDU and Greens or Liberals and Greens and the Traffic Light's model's SPD and Liberals or Liberals and Greens. Same goes for SPD and Left Party in the Left Coalition.

They may be blowhards, but totally refusing each other would nearly be tantamount to political suicide.

Though either Jamaica or Traffic Light are possible options, but they both depend on a minor party (either Green for Jamaica or Liberals for Traffic Light) bending and finally being crushed by the weight of what they call "electoral responsibility"

In any case; ineffectual governments ensue
 
Yeah, I could see internal rebellion from both parties, possibly, with Wolfe or somebody being Chancellor. I still think Jamaica is the most likely, though. The SPD's constituency is too close to DIE NEO-LIBERALs, ANTI-CAPITALISM FOREVER, LONG LIVE THE FRANKFURT SCHOOL, WE DISLIKE ALL CAPITALISTS kind of affair. Far too polarized to do something sensible like that.
 
Wooz said:
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAA
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From an American perspective, I'm not that polarized. I would have ended up voting for Kerry, I like Obama and Daley, and would not vote for Jeb or any other non-semi-Liberal Republican in the next election.
 
Oh, just in case anybody wondered: in the political context of Germany blue also refers to the CSU, the Bavarian sister party of the CDU.

Technically, the CDU got even worse results than the SPD, but only because it doesn't compete with the CSU (which is exclusive to Bavaria) and both act as a Union in most things.

The results are disastrous for both coalitions. Red/Green was predicted to fail, but Black/Yellow has lost most of the popularity it supposedly built up during the past term of the Red/Green coalition.

Since CDU/CSU pretty much reigned Germany in any question that required a vote in the parliament during much of the past term, a Grand Coalition wouldn't neccessarily be a bad thing -- due to the previous Red/Green minority in the parliament, the former Red/Green government DID already have to adjust its politics toward the CDU/CSU.

Another thing I would like to point out is that the German chancellor holds much less political power than the U.S. president. The German system has a stronger emphasis on checks and balances in that case (whether this is good or bad lies in the eye of the beholder).

Anyway. Why are you so interested in German politics lately, Johnny?
I wouldn't mind if it weren't for the omnipresent pessimism and slightly flawed historical analogies.
 
John Uskglass said:
And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why the American system roxorz.
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Yeah, nothing better than getting to choose between a grand total of two parties that differ only in irrelevant nuances. Real damn democratic.

Props to Ratty.
 
Ashmo said:
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Anyway. Why are you so interested in German politics lately, Johnny?
I wouldn't mind if it weren't for the omnipresent pessimism and slightly flawed historical analogies.
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I like Germans and Germany. Had the best time of my life over there this spring.
 
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