World of fallout, is it possible?

l0s7 4 lyf3 said:
Not EVERY mutation in fallout was a result of the FEV, such as the villagers in Arroyo. They had no exposure to the FEV their mutations were just a result of the background radiation in the enviroment.
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okay, your right, but im talking big mutations, like brahmins, deathclaws, radscorpins, geckos.....and so on
 
but lets all remember that every mutation in fallout was because of the FEV, scorpins for example wouldnt mutate, caus they can take an extreme ammount of radiation without being affected
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In other words, you don't know what you're talking about.
 
you missed my last post, i said thhat l0s7 4 lyf3 was right, but i was talking about the big mutations, super muties, radscorpins, geckos, deathclaws....did you read this post?
 
First it's "every mutation", now it's "big mutations"... Make up your damn mind! But don't claim you only meant big mutations when you clearly said "every".
 
what the? how much does it take for you to understand?
i also clearly said to l0s7 4 lyf3: "OKAY, YOUR RIGHT"....is that so damn hard to miss, are you a bit slow-mided?
 
actually we have no way to know how the survivors of the earth's species would react to a planet wide blanketing of radiation

let's face it, we've only seen small bits of what happens when radiation interacts with lifeforms if you are talking a global scale, if there was a massive nuclear war the surviving lifeforms would almost certainly adapt the radiation in one way or another (so a human from arroyo would be far more resistant to radiation than a human from the Enclave for example) and there have been many examples of animals mutating into having extra limbs, unusal size, even extra heads from all sorts of stimuli (pollution, bad grain, whatever) so there's nothing to say the surviving animals wouldn't be disfigured for a large number of generations (if not permanantly)

As for ghouls and supermutants, I thought those were the result of FEV

PS: Hydrogen powered cars are probably the future (15-20 years) as gas get's more expensive, yes currently they obtain the hydrogen from fossil fuels because it is easy (AFAIK) but hydrogen can be made in numerous ways so even if we run out of oil we will still be able to make hydrogen for the hydrogen/electric cars.

I don't think we'll suffer a "Road Warrior" period (or fallout, which is slightly more plausible than Mel Gibson being a soft spoken badass), here in the US we have something like 2 years worth of reserve oil (22 billion barrels, 5 trillion barrels of natural gas reserves), and at least half is saved for the "holy shit everyone is out of gas" scenario, when that happens in 30 or so years I have a feeling the $50.00 a gallon gas will motivate people to buy alternate forms of transportation like hydrogen powered vehicles

course as always this is a poorly informed rant, feel free to shoot it full of holes, as that's the best way to learn
 
override367 said:
there have been many examples of animals mutating into having extra limbs, unusal size, even extra heads from all sorts of stimuli (pollution, bad grain, whatever) so there's nothing to say the surviving animals wouldn't be disfigured for a large number of generations (if not permanantly)
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Many examples of single animals muating, but very rarely would these be "stable" mutations that were passed on to offspring. Even less likely is that an entire spesies would mutate in the same way or that one particular mutation would become prevalent through breeding. You may end up with animals with extra legs and other major birth defects, but you would not have a homogenously mutated species like Brahmin.
 
well I'm not saying we would get consistant mutations (like 2 headed brahmin) but a large number of surviving animals that managed to make it despite the radiation could very well be pretty messed up looking

and who knows? perhaps a specific mutation that lended itself to survival could be passed on? I'm just saying it's not entirely impossible
 
mutations usually happened to the next generation, not neseceraly those that were exposed...i think
 
Who cares, it's a computer game in a pulp setting. It's not like anyone claimed Fallout to be a realistic representation.
 
Sigh, Kaghan what in the world was the point of that post ? Try to learn some net-etiquette and for the love of god learn to use the spell checker (and do not post just to answer me).
 
Who cares, it's a computer game in a pulp setting. It's not like anyone claimed Fallout to be a realistic representation.
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True, but if enough fans ruminate over irrelevant problems for long enough, anything is possible.

Besides speculation and the like is great fun (to some at least).
 
Just thought i would add my two cents. 8)

Barring all external factors, mutations occur very rarely, and are rarely expressed because many forms of mutation are expressed by a recessive allele.

However there are many mutagenic agents that artificially increase the rate of mutations in an organism. The following are some factors that increase genetic mutations in organisms

Members of species in a particular geographic area or ethnic origin are more susceptible to mutations
High dosages of X-Rays or ultraviolet light can increase the likeliness of a mutation
Radioactive substances increase the rate of mutations exponentially
As mentioned previously, genetic mutations are a source of new variation in a species because it physically alters the sequence of nucleotides in a given sequence, therefore altering the genome in a unique way.
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http://www.biology-online.org/2/9_mutations.htm

Very good website. If what i read is correct the increase of mutations would increase exponentially, meaning the rate of mutation would increase. The number of generations in a species is more important to mutation than number of years. So fast reproducing creatures would have noticeable mutations in a very short time. So IMO Fallout World mutations are possible without FEV.


Cheers Thorgrimm
 
Life and evolution is unlikely enough already so it is not that impossible that stable organisms could develop. I would like to know if anyone can justify how evolution manages to create such complex and interrelated systems and organisms in such a (relatively) short time. (I don't need a religious version thanks).
 
Darwin's finches are an excellent example of the way in which species' gene pools have adapted in order for long term survival via their offspring. The Darwin's Finches illustrates the way the finch has adapted to take advantage of feeding in different ecological niche's.



Their beaks have evolved over time to be best suited to their function. For example, the finches who eat grubs have a thin extended beak to poke into holes in the ground and extract the grubs. Finches who eat buds and fruit would be less successful at doing this, while their claw like beaks can grind down their food and thus give them a selective advantage in circumstances where buds are the only real food source for finches.

Industrial Melanism
Polymorphism pertains to the existence of two distinctly different groups of a species that still belong to the same species. Alleles for these organisms over time are governed by the theory of natural selection, and over this time the genetic differences between groups in different environments soon become apparent, as in the case of industrial melanism.

Industrial melanism occurs in a species called the peppered moth, where the occurrence has become of more frequent occurrence since the beginning of the industrial age. The following argument elaborates the basis of principles involved in natural selection as far as industrial melanism is concerned.

Pollution, which is more common in today's world since the industrial age causes a change in environment, particularly in the 1800's when soot would collect on the sides of buildings from chimneys and industries and make them a darker colour.
The resultant effect was that the peppered moth, which had a light appearance was more visible against the darker backgrounds of sooty buildings.
This meant that predators of the peppered moth could find them more easily as they are more visible against a dark background.
Due to mutations, a new strain of peppered moth came to existence, where their phenotype was darker than that of the white peppered moth.
This meant that these new, darker peppered moths were once again harder to track down by their prey in environments where industry has taken its toll.
In this instance, natural selection would favour the darker moths in polluted environments and the whiter moths in the lesser polluted environments due to their ability to merge in with their environmental colours and lessen the chances of them being prone to a predator.
Sickle Cell Trait
Consider this argument of natural selection in the case of sickle cell trait, a genetic defect common in Africa.

Sickle cell trait is a situation that occurs in the presence of a recessive allele coding for haemoglobin, a substance in the blood responsible for the transport of gases like oxygen. The presence of the allele is either partially expressed recessively (sickle cell), or fully expressed by a complete recessive expression which results in full blown anaemia. If this particular allele is dominant, no sickle cell trait is expressed in the phenotype.
The above occurrences in the case of a recessive allele result in structural defects of red blood cells, severely reducing the organisms capacity to uptake oxygen.
It was pointed out that in Africa, there is a high frequency of this mutation, where cases of malaria were high.
A substantiated link was made noting those who suffer sickle cell trait or anaemia were immune to the effects of malaria.
This is yet again natural selection at work. Although sickle cell trait or anaemia are not advantageous characteristics on their own, they prove to be advantageous in areas where malaria proves to be a greater threat to preserving the genome (i.e. surviving).
The incomplete dominance of this genetic expression proves favourable either way.
This is how science has understood natural selection since the first studies involving Darwin.
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QuietFanatic, this information is from that same site as the previous post. You might want to check it out. 8)


Cheers Thorgrimm
 
I know most of that stuff but I am still not convinced that the theory is 100% right. My problem is the creation of truly complex organisms such as mammals from single celled organisms. Then again, maybe enough talk will convince me otherwise. :)

This might deserve it's own thread.
 
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