Gun Control

It is always the same talking points. Just like with the politicians. GOTCHA questions and evidence.
 
zegh8578 said:
I can't wait for this thread to finally resolve completely, and everyone will be in agreement!
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You expect it will be????

It always boils down to:
Either a gun kills people or people kill people, if a person kills other people then the matter in which they do it will just change
You think the government can actually help or you don't
You are allowed to defend yourself or your not.

Gun advocates like me argue that even though you ban guns it does nothing positive to violent crime rates, yes less people are shot but the amount of people dead at the end is unchanged. We also say that criminals have already decided to break the law so they do not care about your laws.

Gun control advocates argue that just stopping the shooting is enough, and that eventually criminals will have less guns because they cant get them from breaking into your house anymore. I find that most but not all of these people have never and may never touch a firearm and only have a base understanding of how they work.

We both have stats showing different things from the same dataset and will just argue back and forth, but as posted in here I think best about the quote from Benjamin Franklin

"Those who are willing to trade liberty for security deserve neither."

And my other favorite on this subject would be

Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding where to go for lunch, Liberty is a well armed sheep.
 
Crni Vuk said:
How do sheeps hold guns?
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With his "arms" hahaha
well-armed-sheep.png
 
GonZo_626 said:
You expect it will be????

It always boils down to:
Either a gun kills people or people kill people, if a person kills other people then the matter in which they do it will just change
You think the government can actually help or you don't
You are allowed to defend yourself or your not.

Gun advocates like me argue that even though you ban guns it does nothing positive to violent crime rates, yes less people are shot but the amount of people dead at the end is unchanged. We also say that criminals have already decided to break the law so they do not care about your laws.

Gun control advocates argue that just stopping the shooting is enough, and that eventually criminals will have less guns because they cant get them from breaking into your house anymore. I find that most but not all of these people have never and may never touch a firearm and only have a base understanding of how they work.

We both have stats showing different things from the same dataset and will just argue back and forth, but as posted in here I think best about the quote from Benjamin Franklin

"Those who are willing to trade liberty for security deserve neither."

And my other favorite on this subject would be

Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding where to go for lunch, Liberty is a well armed sheep.
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You're repeating stuff that's easily counter-argued, reducing the gun control advocacy argument (in addition to gun control advocates themselves, I guess) to something stupid and simplistic, and misusing quotes.

I would care more, but I guess I was mistaken in thinking that this was a debate. Apparently it's just a shit show. Oh well.
 
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Lanfear said:
You're repeating stuff that's easily counter-argued, reducing the gun control advocacy argument (in addition to gun control advocates themselves, I guess) to something stupid and simplistic, and misusing quotes.

I would care more, but I guess I was mistaken in thinking that this was a debate. Apparently it's just a shit show. Oh well.
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Yes I did reduce the arguments to something simplistic and stupid, I did that on purpose so that we could all see how simple and stupid this is. Go ahead and easily counter-argue either of them because everyone just uses the same stupid arguments. I don't want to say its a religion but it is a belief system. Also explain how I am misusing the provided quotes, its good to say but you do not say how?

Australia's violent crime rate, and murder rate are dropping at a rate no faster then they were before the port Arthur massacre, yes less people are shot but the rate for people being murdered is dropping just the same as it was before. Americas murder rates and violent crime rates are dropping as well, even with the mass-murders by firearm. Rifles like the AR-15 are demonized but yet only account for something like 2% of people shot in the USA, nobody is talking handguns which account for the vast amount of people murdered and quite frankly due to the Heller case in the USA nothing can be done against those as it was found constitutional to carry a handgun for defense. There are approx. 200 uses per day in the USA of defensive use of Firearms and yet people say firearms are not good for defense. Canada instituted vast amount of Firearm legislation after our mass-shootings in the 90's and yet both guns used were left as non-restricted as they could find no reason to ban them yet leave others that were the exact same. You here talk about how military sniper rifles should be banned when the farmer down the road has been using the same bolt-action gun for years that the military and police forces use but he has a wood stock instead of a plastic stock the police and military use. The very people that argue against police brutality believe that only police should have guns?????? This whole argument boils down to one stupid thing.

Do guns kill people, or do people kill people? Its as simple as this. If guns kill people well we have gotten good at concealing little terminators in them to control them and make them go kill all those people. If people kill people what they use shouldn't matter, but finding a way to stop them is. The media is in some way pushing this as when you see an article about mass killings they don't blame cars, or acid, explosives, some mastermind cooked up the plans to do these things. But dear god if they used a gun to do the same thing that evil 60 year old AR-15 should be banned. Nobody is looking into doing some sort of enhanced background check for renting a cargo van, and yet that seems to be a good weapon of choice outside the US.

This is a debate but both sides can keep refuting the same arguments over again, but as gun control advocates all say they want to reduce shootings. But their answers do not reduce deaths. At least right now if I see a psycho walking around with a gun I can try to hide, I cant look at every cargo van, or truck the same way.
 
...Nobody is looking into doing some sort of enhanced background check for renting a cargo van, and yet that seems to be a good weapon of choice outside the US.

This is a debate but both sides can keep refuting the same arguments over again, but as gun control advocates all say they want to reduce shootings. But their answers do not reduce deaths. At least right now if I see a psycho walking around with a gun I can try to hide, I cant look at every cargo van, or truck the same way.
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Is your AR15 a comfy ride in to work? How about it’s hauling potential, was it easy to get that piano in your assault rifle when you moved house? I’ve heard good things about it, do tell!
 
popej said:
Is your AR15 a comfy ride in to work? How about it’s hauling potential, was it easy to get that piano in your assault rifle when you moved house? I’ve heard good things about it, do tell!
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Kinda my point. First thing nice cherrypicking and no taking into account what I have said, second your kinda proving my point by calling it an assault rifle, you know nothing of guns. An assault rifle is fully fucking automatic, you pull the trigger it does not stop shooting until it runs out of ammo. AR-15's are semi automatic, I pull the trigger it fires one fucking round, it is no different then say a ruger mini-14, fires the same round, uses the same mags, has the semi-automatic action. Does the pistol grip on it change that much to you, how about its colour, if I paint my AR bright fucking pink does that make it not scary to you. Oh but you can use you car, or van for other things. You know like how my AR-15 can be used for target practice. Its all about the direction you the fucking person decide to point your weapon of choice. A gun is no more fucking dangerous then a car when pointed in a safe direction, and just as fucking dangerous when pointed in an unsafe direction. Except that cars kill a lot more people, then guns, but you know it makes your life easier so lets not talk about them.
 
Atomkilla said:
I for one think guns suck and should be abolished. People who use guns really have issues. It really reflects their deep mental issues and improper destructive urges.

Thermonuclear weapons.
Now I am for that. Proper destructive urge.
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I actually love guns
The few times in my life I held handguns, I almost get a bit weird
I pet the gun
I pet it and I mean it

Once I was allowed to hold and "dry pump" a pump action shotgun
Yeah, you are free to think in terms of inuendos and just run with it, I was almost drooling

I do want guns
I wish someone would give me guns

As for the politics, jesus christ, it just makes me wish for a meteor - but guns in themselves, I love them, to the point of sheer perversion
 
zegh8578 said:
I actually love guns
The few times in my life I held handguns, I almost get a bit weird
I pet the gun
I pet it and I mean it

Once I was allowed to hold and "dry pump" a pump action shotgun
Yeah, you are free to think in terms of inuendos and just run with it, I was almost drooling

I do want guns
I wish someone would give me guns

As for the politics, jesus christ, it just makes me wish for a meteor - but guns in themselves, I love them, to the point of sheer perversion
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Now Atomkilla might not give Zegh a gun. Gonzo and SuAside would be glad to hand him one. I would distract him and cook and give him some reindeer stew and that would make him forget about guns. Walpknut would give him a...back rub? Not sure.

Anyway, there are different ways to approach situations. :)

Anyhoo, back on topic. Armed guards might not work, the deputy dude assigned to guard the Florida school kinda didn't do nuffin.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-43164634
 
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I feel that both blocs don't fulfill my 'gun-law' needs properly. The Democrats are too hardline about it and the Republicans are too invested in the NRA. I can surely agree with more testing and background checking, but little more - Japan is NOT an example to follow, IMO.
 
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