why is army in fallout universe so undeveloped?

M

Martin

It Wandered In From the Wastes
i mean, in FNV there were actuall real world modern weapons, in f1 and f2 not. whats with that? and why no AK? it was out in 1948, since fallout shows 1950s there should be AKs everywhere, because USSR werent main enemy of US, china was. and with industry base of USSR that didnt go full Boris Yeltsin, they would produce so much weapons that world would be flooded with them even with practically ww3 for 10 years. and those weapons could even work. properly sealed AKs can last for a few hundred years. chromed that is.

and what about tanks? did army recyclated so much? did the us army scrapped all the tanks in favour of PAs even tho they were rare? (and all games straight out lack any actuall garbage "storages" that are common for overconsumption age, practically no dumps) Even today some armies have ww2 tanks and in frozen universe of fallout, its VERY unprobable that army wouldnt keep around pattons or some other tanks around. and dont say they were all at the front. it doesnt work like that with immediate danger of invasion.

i have read some deep analysis of fallout universe, most were about how army leadership was extremely conservative in choosing of their armament. cant believe armies like that wont keep massive stockpiles of all possible old shit around just because.
 
aaaand this is why I like FO: tactics ... It brings in many 'real world' bits of things that can quite believably exist in the post-apoc FO world. Gameplay / Game-style aside I still value the input on setting lore from FoT.

Also.. to correct a little, FO1 & 2 both feature a quite nice selection of real-world bits of weapons / tech...
 
One timeline we have robots and a nuclear reliant society, the other we don't. Somehow I doubt we're going to have the same guns.
 
There are real world guns in Fallout 1 and 2 (tonnes of them in 2), and the assault rifle in these two games is a fictional AK model. There's no reason to believe the military didn't use tanks either, even if there weren't art assets for them in the first two games. There were tanks in Tactics.
 
I was going to say 1 and 2 both had real world weapons, just the same with New Vegas. 3 and 4 is where it went bonkers with weapon choices, particularly 4. However 4 does feature a few tanks spread around the wasteland they are just in that weird bubble artistic decision Beth went with.
 
I remember somebody saying that the NCR used refurbished tanks in California, but I could be talking out of my ass, after all if they had tanks why weren't they using them to fight the Legion?
 
which gun is AK like? there is ak-112, but its not ak. not same system of reloading. and why the fuck, would US, giant corporate dictatorship import weapons, when they could make even more money with their own M series.
only reason would be that developers didnt had enough money to buy m-16 licence.
.beth tanks in 4 were semi realistic, using pattons and m series tanks as base. but they for sure played too much red alert. two cannons. one does not simply use two cannons on a tank.
 
The AK-112 is a fictional Kalashnikov. Hence its designation. And are you complaining about the presence or absence of Kalashnikov rifles? Make up your mind.
 
Who really cares, there are guns galore in the games, whether you want real world guns or the stuff of fantasy plasma guns 'n stuff.

But to be honest I'd trade in all my guns for the Sinister Mr Fister
 
both to be honest. ak is rifle using expanding gasses to reload itself. ones shown in f1 and 2 are not like that. every ak, even sniper adaptions and light machineguns ones are based on one single principle. fallout ak-112 doesnt represent this principle, and as gun enthusiasist it pisses me off. they could have called it m-17 or whatever. still, why were they importing them? making themselfs dependant on foreign power, thats extremely unamerican, even more in fallout universe with extreme communist paranoa.

in new vegas were real world m series guns. without any explanation. like boom, they exist, ignoring lore to extreme degree. and all while completely ignoring ak-112 rifle being present mere hundreds of kilometers away.

so naturaly i want to know which is right. cant be both.
 
Maybe that AK wasn't gas operated. No law that says a fictional AK has to be. And maybe they had nothing to do with the U.S. military. Maybe they were just cheap automatic rifles that were plentiful and easy for various groups to acquire.

Or maybe the Fallout developers didn't spend half as much time thinking it through as you have, and the asset just got reused from Fallout to Fallout 2 for consistency, then the idea abandoned in NV because they came to a similar conclusion as you, that it would make more sense to use AR-15 models.
 
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Martin said:
beth tanks in 4 were semi realistic, using pattons and m series tanks as base. but they for sure played too much red alert. two cannons. one does not simply use two cannons on a tank.
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The Germans had the Versuchsträger prototype that had two cannons, but the tank didn't had a turret. I am just mentioning it here because someone might find it interesting to learn more about it.

Fallout Tactics intro shows a pic of a lot of pre-war tanks and soldiers:
FoT_Pre-War_Tanks.png
So we can see that the army in Fallout universe is quite developed, they have tanks (M4 Shermans in Fallout Tactics and the weird double cannon one from Fallout 4), military Robots (Sentry Bot, Robobrains and Mr Gutsys) and were developing a super robot weapon (Liberty Prime), they use cyborg dogs (Cyberdogs), they developed a couple of Power Armor models and also a couple of more mundane combat armors, they have nuclear weaponry (ICBMs, Fatman on newer games and other types), they have stealth technology (Stealth Boy), they have a good air force and navy (we can see in Rivet city a Carrier and some jets, Bombers in FNV's Boomers base, etc) due to the scarcity of fossil fuel they were developing Vertibirds, plenty of army and combat weapons to choose from, virtual training programs (both for soldiers as seen in the Operation Anchorage DLC and for pilots as seen in FNV's Boomers base), it had at least one Orbital Missile satellite (used to destroy Liberty Prime in the Broken Steel DLC), the US government had defense contracts with Poseidon Energy to develop orbital laser systems (and they did develop it as seen in FNV Helios One place and again once activated and used with the Euclid's C-Finder) and also developed Implants to give soldiers natural armor (Phoenix Implant as seen in Fallout 2 and the Sub-Dermal Armor implant from FNV although I can't remember if that one was also developed by Poseidon Energy) many military bases, installations and National Guard Depots (as seen in most Fallout games).
In my opinion and by how limiting we can see of an entire country like the USA's military power in just a number of games we can count using the fingers from one hand, the USA's military are quite developed, remember that we always have to assume that what we see in games like Fallout is only a small part of what exists in it's entire universe. >_>

Note: I am writing this by memory, and my memory is really bad because of reasons, so I bet I forgot many things, if anyone could add whatever they notice I forgot to mention, please be my guest. :confused:
 
Risewild said:
The Germans had the Versuchsträger prototype that had two cannons, but the tank didn't had a turret. I am just mentioning it here because someone might find it interesting to learn more about it.

Fallout Tactics intro shows a pic of a lot of pre-war tanks and soldiers:
FoT_Pre-War_Tanks.png
So we can see that the army in Fallout universe is quite developed, they have tanks (M4 Shermans in Fallout Tactics and the weird double cannon one from Fallout 4), military Robots (Sentry Bot, Robobrains and Mr Gutsys) and were developing a super robot weapon (Liberty Prime), they use cyborg dogs (Cyberdogs), they developed a couple of Power Armor models and also a couple of more mundane combat armors, they have nuclear weaponry (ICBMs, Fatman on newer games and other types), they have stealth technology (Stealth Boy), they have a good air force and navy (we can see in Rivet city a Carrier and some jets, Bombers in FNV's Boomers base, etc) due to the scarcity of fossil fuel they were developing Vertibirds, plenty of army and combat weapons to choose from, virtual training programs (both for soldiers as seen in the Operation Anchorage DLC and for pilots as seen in FNV's Boomers base), it had at least one Orbital Missile satellite (used to destroy Liberty Prime in the Broken Steel DLC), the US government had defense contracts with Poseidon Energy to develop orbital laser systems (and they did develop it as seen in FNV Helios One place and again once activated and used with the Euclid's C-Finder) and also developed Implants to give soldiers natural armor (Phoenix Implant as seen in Fallout 2 and the Sub-Dermal Armor implant from FNV although I can't remember if that one was also developed by Poseidon Energy) many military bases, installations and National Guard Depots (as seen in most Fallout games).
In my opinion and by how limiting we can see of an entire country like the USA's military power in just a number of games we can count using the fingers from one hand, the USA's military are quite developed, remember that we always have to assume that what we see in games like Fallout is only a small part of what exists in it's entire universe. >_>

Note: I am writing this by memory, and my memory is really bad because of reasons, so I bet I forgot many things, if anyone could add whatever they notice I forgot to mention, please be my guest. :confused:
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if you could come up with any more things i would be very grateful.
 
Martin said:
both to be honest. ak is rifle using expanding gasses to reload itself. ones shown in f1 and 2 are not like that. every ak, even sniper adaptions and light machineguns ones are based on one single principle. fallout ak-112 doesnt represent this principle, and as gun enthusiasist it pisses me off. they could have called it m-17 or whatever. still, why were they importing them? making themselfs dependant on foreign power, thats extremely unamerican, even more in fallout universe with extreme communist paranoa.

in new vegas were real world m series guns. without any explanation. like boom, they exist, ignoring lore to extreme degree. and all while completely ignoring ak-112 rifle being present mere hundreds of kilometers away.

so naturaly i want to know which is right. cant be both.
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And you know that the AK112 is not gas-operated how, exactly? There are different types of gas-systems, you know, not every gas-system looks exactly like the AK system. The american AR rifles are also gas-operated, and so is almost every modern assault rifle.
Anyway, the Fallout universe diverged from our own some time in the '40s (and it doesn't take place in the '50s!). There's no reason that there would be ANY real world weapons. Personally, I always thought that the inclusion of even the Desert Eagle was a bit of a stretch in Fallout 1, and didn't like the addition of so many more real world guns in Fallout 2 and, worse, Tactics. Well, they're in now, so no use in complaining.
Not that we know wether or not the AK112 was some sort of standard army weapon in the US. It's said to be an outdated military model, so it might just be used by civilians. Or it's actually an american design (Russia [who, btw., don't appear to be the primary antagonist of the US in the Fallout universe] doesn't have any claim to name their weapons "AKxxx"), who knows.
But yeah, in the end it's a lot of inconsistent lore, mainly added in Tactics and the switch from 2D to 3D.
 
The way I understand it is some events that occurred post 1950's in our world still occurred in the Fallout universe, so you have real weapons like the Mauser, Desert Eagle, M1 Garand, Service Rifle, etc. In one of the intros you even hear radio broadcasts from our timeline...

Tactics is the main offender of the real world weapon usage. Many people didn't like seeing the Humvee, most likely preferring the old Jeeps. I prefer them using weapons that are more of a combination like the Service Rifle in New Vegas.

Isn't H&K one of them?
 
TorontRayne said:
The way I understand it is some events that occurred post 1950's in our world still occurred in the Fallout universe, so you have real weapons like the Mauser, Desert Eagle, M1 Garand, etc. In one of the intros you even hear radio broadcasts from our timeline...

Tactics is the main offender of the real world weapon usage. Many people didn't like seeing the Humvee, most likely preferring the old Jeeps. I prefer them using weapons that are more of a combination like the Service Rifle in New Vegas.
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service rifle is modeled after ar-10. my main issue is what games to follow. f 1/2/3/4 or tactics/FNV?
 
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